New to Home Recording and Need Help - Thank You

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AC_Rhino

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Hi gang,

I play a number of instruments and have played in bands for years until early 2000’s and then pretty much stopped playing. Recently I’ve been getting a lot of songs stuck in my head … and I’m getting the bug to record some of them.

I know nothing about home recording and I’ve lurked on here for a few days to scope the place out. I have a number of questions to ask … but I’m hesitant to do so because a lot of what I’m seeing is “read this before doing that” or “don’t ask these questions” … so since I don’t know what I don’t know and this forum has a ton of info on it I’m just going to come out and say what I’m looking to do and hopefully someone can detail out for me what I need to do and how to do it.

I don’t know if what I’m looking for can be found in one software package and then I use adapters to connect the guitars/keyboards to it, or if I need some stand-alone devices, or what peripherals are required … I’m not even sure a lot of the terminology for things. Treat me like you’d want to be treated if you were trying to learn something for the first time.

I have these songs stuck in my head and I’m looking for a way to record 8 tracks and give those tracks a basic mix. I’m also going to need a drum machine of some type as that is one of the instruments I don’t have and can’t really play. I’d like to lay down a basic drum beat, follow that over with bass and rhythm guitars, then add a few melody tracks with guitar and keyboard. I’d like something pretty simple to use to start out … it doesn’t need to be a professional recording device or even software. I don’t really know what it needs to be as any kind of google/amazon search quickly becomes overwhelming. I’m also ok getting something simpler/cheaper/easier to start out with and as I figure out more of what I want to do and learn more about how to do it and what technology is out there today for it. I'm not looking to make videos or publish anything ... this is just for my own sanity.

So, in a nutshell:
  • Something easy to use and setup
  • Something to record 8 tracks
  • Something to provide drum affects
  • An understanding of the equipment/software I’d need
  • An understanding of the peripherals I would need
Thanks for your help.
 
Oh and based on what I've read/seen here I should add I won't be recording the instruments all at the same time as it is just me. So I'd like something I can use to layer and mix as I add each instruments piece ... I don't have an need to record a full band playing at the same time.
 
You need a couple of essentials - an interface. In the main the differences are the number of simultaneous inputs. If you can live with just a few, and most people can unless they want to record drums, is the scarlet 2i2 it gets excellent reviews. The DAW is more difficult, because they all do similar but slightly different things, but in quite different ways. Some people - like the guys who do 'beats' (alien to me) will use ableton or other 'less musical' but very competent DAWs - it works for their needs. Other people want a DAW that more mimics old fashioned tape recording (that's me).

Many of them are totally free, others cheap and some very expensive. None are 'better' just different, and what usually happens is that you stick with the one you start with. I like Cubase, but mainly because every time I have tried something else, it isn't cubase, and I'm disadvantaged. If I had the patience to stick with them, maybe I'd have changed - but with Cubase, I'm comfy, quick and happy.

Most plug ins that you will use sparingly or obsessively will work on most DAWs. A few are make specific, but not that vital now. The good stuff works on virtually anything.

Most DAWs come with a decent number of plug ins so effects and processing are there. Generally, the more you pay, the more variety and range you get - but you will keep buying new ones.

A 2 input interface can record on most DAW, sequencially, loads of tracks - a 2 input interface has two mic sockets - if you need drums, then you'll need more of course - 8 input interfaces are not hugely expensive. I have some, and very rarely need more than four, but four for me happens quite often.

None are easy to use if you don't have a DAW head. My old friend who was great with tape machines, made no progress since 2000 - not the music side, but computers. They're pretty easy to setup. Most install quite simply - the only decision is where to store things. internal or external drives? Most folk now record their audio on a different drive - it smooths thing quite a bit, and gets music away from computer stuff.
 
rob aylestone said:
You need a couple of essentials - an interface. In the main the differences are the number of simultaneous inputs. If you can live with just a few, and most people can unless they want to record drums, is the scarlet 2i2 it gets excellent reviews. The DAW is more difficult, because they all do similar but slightly different things, but in quite different ways. Some people - like the guys who do 'beats' (alien to me) will use ableton or other 'less musical' but very competent DAWs - it works for their needs. Other people want a DAW that more mimics old fashioned tape recording (that's me).

Many of them are totally free, others cheap and some very expensive. None are 'better' just different, and what usually happens is that you stick with the one you start with. I like Cubase, but mainly because every time I have tried something else, it isn't cubase, and I'm disadvantaged. If I had the patience to stick with them, maybe I'd have changed - but with Cubase, I'm comfy, quick and happy.

Most plug ins that you will use sparingly or obsessively will work on most DAWs. A few are make specific, but not that vital now. The good stuff works on virtually anything.

Most DAWs come with a decent number of plug ins so effects and processing are there. Generally, the more you pay, the more variety and range you get - but you will keep buying new ones.

A 2 input interface can record on most DAW, sequencially, loads of tracks - a 2 input interface has two mic sockets - if you need drums, then you'll need more of course - 8 input interfaces are not hugely expensive. I have some, and very rarely need more than four, but four for me happens quite often.

None are easy to use if you don't have a DAW head. My old friend who was great with tape machines, made no progress since 2000 - not the music side, but computers. They're pretty easy to setup. Most install quite simply - the only decision is where to store things. internal or external drives? Most folk now record their audio on a different drive - it smooths thing quite a bit, and gets music away from computer stuff.
Click to expand...
Thanks for helping.

So if I have a bass, guitar, and KB and I want to use a drum machine like EZ Drummer 2 ... and want to play one track at a time so start with drums, add bass, then add rythem, and lastly melodies ... what kind of interface would you use? Would that be just a 2 input or would I need some other kind of setup? The interface stuff to me is far more confusing because I can't picture how the setup would work in my head and all the videos I watch are just talking mouth pieces blathering on without showing any details ... I'm mean I've seen 200 hours of beards just puking away without any examples. When I was running a salt water aquarium board I would go through set by step what I was showing ... can you recommend any good videos where they just ... for a novelty ... show the equipment and use it?
 
You're piling straight into DAWs Rob, but that may mean fighting with computers to get a system up and running.
Do you already have a respectable computer Rhino?
There is another path, getting a hardware multitrack recorder. You just press buttons on it and record your tracks to SD cards plugged in.
I remember seeing a cool BOSS one, but there is also the Tascam DP008EX (just over £200).
That may be a simpler way in than a DAW.
You could use a hardware drum machine like the Alesis SR18.
I suggest you look upthe Tascam Rhino.
 
Slouching Raymond said:
You're piling straight into DAWs Rob, but that may mean fighting with computers to get a system up and running.
Do you already have a respectable computer Rhino?
There is another path, getting a hardware multitrack recorder. You just press buttons on it and record your tracks to SD cards plugged in.
I remember seeing a cool BOSS one, but there is also the Tascam DP008EX (just over £200).
That may be a simpler way in than a DAW.
You could use a hardware drum machine like the Alesis SR18.
I suggest you look upthe Tascam Rhino.
Click to expand...
I do have a a 17" laptop quad core i7 with 64gb ram.
 
I have both hardware multitracks and DAW setups. Something like the Tascam, or a Zoom is pretty quick and easy to get recording. You plug it in, hit a couple of buttons and start recording. For drums I've used the Alesis SR18. It works. It's not terribly complicated and the sound is good.

I've also got the DAW setup, and that would be the way I would go. A simple 2 channel interface like the Motu or Scarlett is plenty for basic "just me" recordings. Download either Reaper or Cakewalk by Bandlab. It will have everything you need to record as many tracks as you want. Need drums? Download MTPowerDrumkit. Its freeware, give them $10 or $20 and you can use it all you want without any nag screens. It comes with gobs of patterns that you can drag and drop into a track, modify it to fit your song, etc. Granted it doesn't have lots of different drum kits like the big boys do, but the sounds are completely workable.

Spend a week playing with the DAW and you'll find that you can get a song up and running in a short order.

You can also do a hybrid setup. I have a Zoom R24, have recorded 6 or 8 tracks, pulled the SD card and put the files in the DAW and did my adjustments. I use Reaper for the DAW.

The only other thing you need are some monitors (you can use with either a multitrack recorder or interface) and a microphone or two.
 
Bass and guitar plug in to virtually all interfaces via a combo connector - a dual socket. You can plug in an xlr connector for a mic, or a jack from a guitar. Keys would go in via two plugs. Ez drummer works from inside any of the popular DAWs. I cant see any point whatsoever in a hardware solution, because frankly they’re ancient technology and force old constraints on you which mean relearning, but worse, it prevents so many snags that get in the way of music. My friend who just passed away was a computerphobe and he carried on using hardware, and so many things he brought to me to fix in a few hours that would have been impossible on his system. Your external music keyboard will also plug into the interface and you will almost certainly start using computer generated sounds. None of my synths and keyboards now generate sounds I record. I have all of them in software and this works really well. Roland, Korg and Yamaha keys are in the computer plus the 70s and 80s synth sounde.

if you know the basics of computer manipulation, you’re away.
 
Here's your list:
1) Audio interface. Plugs into your computer via USB. You plug your guitars, keyboards or mics into it. The AI converts audio to digital (and back) You also plug your headphones into it, and/or your monitor speakers. It takes over the sound card function of your computer, when plugged in. You'll want at least 2 input capability for plugging in a stereo keyboard or two mics at a time, or mic and instrument. Many choices around $150.

2) DAW - recording software. There are many choices, with most of them offering free demo versions. Reaper is always my recommendation, as it has all the features you would ever need. Some find it too intimidating. Free to d/l the full version to try as long as you want, $60 to register it. Once you 'learn' how to work a particular DAW, its hard to switch to another as the interface will be different, so look at all the options.

3) Headphones or monitors to listen to the recorded tracks as well as hear what you are recording into the computer.


Of course, that's the tip of the iceberg..... but will get you going
 
Hi Rhino and welcome. I am going to suggest you spend a fair chunk of your budget on a good interface and I am going to suggest the MOTU M4 very specifically. Why?
I and my son (he plays I solders and pays) have used a variety of computer recording systems over the last ten years or so. Gear from M-Audio, Behringer,Native Instruments, Focusrite plus various PCI sound cards and mixer setups. The M4 was by far the easiest to setup and most logical and versatile to use. The fact that the pre amps and general sound quality is near state of art does not hurt!
MOTU are also very nice helpful people.

I say the M4 not the smaller M2 because you have keyboards? They can go into the two rear line inputs (3/4) and you still have 2 mic/ guitar/bass inputs on the front* Less farting about plugging and unplugging stuff. MOTU interfaces also have very low latency drivers and so you would find playing along with a previous track very easy, no perceptible delay. This will also make playing software drums much easier.

Monitor speakers need to be expensive to be really useful but if you have a decent audio system that could be used pro-tem.
Headphones need to be 'closed back' types to exclude sound ingress and egress. Needed when singing along with a track to prevent 'squeaky leakage' and acoustic feedback.

*A small mixer might be considered in the future to expand the mic count.

Best of luck,

Dave.
 
Are you on a Mac? Makes it tremendously simpler if you are are. Just get Logic Pro X - A Scarlett 2i2 - A SM58 and Cable - a Cable for your guitar (you own a guitar right?) and then go for it. Eventually you could get a keyboard - like a Keylab 61 Essential - and be done with it - Logic has the all the recording Plugins - The Samplers - The Synthesizers - The Drum Sets - The Guitar Amp Emulations - and just about anything you'd want.

I would never go with an External recording device - to much trouble and work.
 
I loaned the friend who has just died an HD 24 alesis, which I bought when they first came out and never used, because it was just a replacement for a reel to reel, but using hard drives. They were lovely but once you start to use computers, copy and paste is soooo useful. You just can’t do these things with linear recording.
 
The biggest game changer for me when moving from a stand-alone recorder to computer DAW - automation. No more riding the faders when mixing down.
 
mjbphotos said:
The biggest game changer for me when moving from a stand-alone recorder to computer DAW - automation. No more riding the faders when mixing down.
Click to expand...
I admit - automation is the one thing that I regret not having.
 
Not having automation would be a deal breaker. I use it on virtually every mix.

----------------

You can copy and paste on an HD24, but it's a cumbersome process compared to doing it on a computer.
 
I never knew that. Ian had the thing for about 20 years! I don't think he ever mentioned it in case I asked for it back. I doubt it has any real value now - can you even get IDE Drives now?
 
I think you might be able to get caddies for other drive types from third parties.

I mostly keep mine around as a computerless live recorder. It's not really useful in a studio compared to a DAW.
 
rob aylestone said:
I cant see any point whatsoever in a hardware solution, because frankly they’re ancient technology and force old constraints on you which mean relearning
Click to expand...
You can't see any point whatsoever in a hardware solution, primarily because you don't really appreciate that there are many different human beings who respond to a plethora of different ways of arriving at the same destination.
Part of the joy of humanity is not only our diversity in terms of where we've come from and what we look like, but the way we can achieve the same result through vastly different means.
There are still people that cook using wood and fire. The food off those fires tastes every bit as good as from the cookers I use.
rob aylestone said:
Your external music keyboard will also plug into the interface and you will almost certainly start using computer generated sounds. None of my synths and keyboards now generate sounds I record. I have all of them in software and this works really well. Roland, Korg and Yamaha keys are in the computer plus the 70s and 80s synth sounde
Click to expand...
When I first discovered VSTis, I just bought the software, loaded them into the computer and came straight out into my portastudio and played them with a dummy keyboard. I still do that now. Bought a cheap laptop, loaded the various instruments into it. Play them with a MIDI keyboard.
Yet my recording system is an old one.
It makes no difference. I like this way of doing things, it's a way I've developed and at the end of the day, when you stick on the finished product, who honestly gives a fedora how it came to be ?
You can learn to drive on an Austin Cambridge from the 60s or a car made last year ~ you are still a driver and not a worse one because you learned on the Austin Cambridge.
rob aylestone said:
once you start to use computers, copy and paste is soooo useful. You just can’t do these things with linear recording.
Click to expand...
One of the major drawbacks with existing in one's own bubble and not keeping one's ear to the ground in respect of what other people are doing in their bubbles, is that you get stuck in an era that people have moved on from and you become dismissive, directly or indirectly, and assumptionist, of systems you no longer use.
I use an ancient system {built in 2000, outmoded by 2002 !!}, yet I've been copying and pasting with precise and calculating abandon since 2009. I've made many a song sound more interesting by using copy/paste, cut/paste, copy/insert, cut/insert, cut/move, cut/discard, timestretch etc, either in the recording, submixing or mixing phase.

Old technology doesn't mean the middle ages and Guy Fawkes blowing up the houses of parliament. In point of fact, much of the technology from hardware systems is no different to what you use now. Sometimes, you make users of "old technology" sound like the day before Les Paul pursued 'sound on sound' recording.
mjbphotos said:
Of course, that's the tip of the iceberg..... but will get you going
Click to expand...
And that's the crucial matter here ~ AC is a beginner with no home recording knowledge or experience, so when it comes down to it, what he needs is to get going, not become an expert in 4 minutes. Leave him to chart his path {that's not aimed at you, Mike}. That's half the fun and frustration !
mjbphotos said:
The biggest game changer for me when moving from a stand-alone recorder to computer DAW - automation. No more riding the faders when mixing down
Click to expand...
I utilize something that I call 'poor man's automation' when I'm mixing. I'll mix in sections so riding the faders is not a big deal at all. After all, I'm not riding all 12 faders at the same time. Good music necessitates a certain consistency.
But there are aspects of all recording that float someone's boat, while meaning nothing to another.
PorterhouseMusic said:
And, of course, I'm going to jump in and recommend that you consider the Tascam stand alone recorders
Click to expand...
I'd recommend that too. Well, standalone recorders, whether reel to reel, portastudio or digital.
But I'd also recommend the computer based DAW and interface. Whichever route you take, you'll have something of a learning curve that you are not currently facing in your life.
Papanate said:
I would never go with an External recording device - to much trouble and work.
Click to expand...
And that's a legit feeling for a person to have. But not particularly good advice to someone who is looking for a simple, uncomplicated way into recording the songs they have floating around their being. "Too much trouble and work" means nothing if someone else comes along and says "Well, for me they are easy."
For me, they are. Whereas compression on drums dizzies my head, regardless of whether on a computer based DAW, a standalone used with a portastudio or Jack Frost.
The simple fact is that every system of recording works. Every one of them.
Of course there are pros and cons to each. There are also adherents of each, which alone tells me they are all viable, in and of themselves.
 
It’s very true, we do become dismissive of old ways of working, and I guess the bubble approach is a perfectly workable one. I do think though that people in a bubble often just don’t want to even think about other people’s ones. That is fine, but to a person outside, considering entry to one, they need to get a welcome to each one from the people within, which we’ve done. And they have to decide. Radio hams still learn, often in classes, or live, Morse Code. It has been surpassed as a communication medium in almost every way, but for some people it’s still the most efficient way to do it for certain applications. A bit like tape.
 
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