New one... Honest comments, please. Remixing next week based on what you have to say.

T

Teddie

New member
Hey HR Buds,

This is regarding my new song “Conformity” which you can find here: http://mp3.com/smartapple.

I received some really negative comments about this song from a friend of mine. I really kinda like this song and how it turned out, even right after doing it, so it concerns me that my friend very much disliked how it turned out because I truly respect his opinion. To me, he really knows what he’s talking about - so I feel like my ears are missing a whole lot of what's going on in the tune. He’s got some very valid comments about the song and I’m going to use his advice in the next remix… but…

… but before I spend a couple of nights remixing this song, I want to get all the comments I can from you folks so I can have all your advice and comments in “my basket” to use for the remix.

Please rip this song apart, listen closely, let me know if you hear anything, anything at all that doesn’t sound right or good to your ears… I want to hear what you really think. What your ears are really hearing…. If there are things you don’t like, lemme know, hurt me… Of course, if you like the song or parts of it, let me know that too :)

Also let me know if you’re listening to the hi-fi or lo-fi version and if you’re listening through speakers or headphones… I’m a pain in the ass.

I really want to get this song good and tight sounding because this is the song that our HR buds Bucky and 2Mac let me record the acoustic guitar tracks in their studio when I visited Chicago… and I would feel like I let them down if I didn’t get this song perfect (or at least perfect to the best of my ability).

As usual, thanks for all your help!,
Teddie (Smart Apple)
http://mp3.com/smartapple
http://www.smartapplerocks.com
 
Hey Teddie,

I listen to it cranked up twice on my 20/20's. If it was me I wouldnt change a thing, maybe my ears arent trained as well as some of the pros here, but it sounds perfect to me. With that said, I think it is a very cool tune, I love the stops near the end, nice touch. Wish I could be more help, but it sounds ready to me.

What MP3 encoder are you using? It sounds really good, very little loss on the high end.

Bassman
 
Headphones.

I'da brought the main and backing vox up 1.5 dB. There. Now, it's perfect. :) I wanted more edge, more presence, more upfrontness to the vocals - it's a preference, not a criticism.

I really like this one. Good song material, good sound, lotsa muscle in both. Past stuff of yours I've listened to has displayed your strength for fitting expertly into recognizable genres. This one's different, it's its own song. I much prefer it. Maybe your buddy wanted something that sounded like something else?

I really like the sound you got on that acoustic. How'd you do that? I found the overall level pretty loud - did you compress it a lot?

This is one of the best conformity songs I've ever heard. I like it better than the Who's 'Uniform', for example. Way better. Good work.
 
bassman, thank ya bro... I'm glad you liked it. I use AudioCatalyst for encoding. It's the old version. I'm sure there have been a few upgrades since the one I'm using... I tested a whole whole bunch of encoders before I settled down with AC.

dobro, thanks for the input... Definitely will move the main vox up a little in the mix... I noticed that today when listening that also when the chorus kick in, to me, the chorus vox are where they should be, but the main vox are a little low in there which you can really tell when the first chorus chimes in... I'll fix that in the remix... I rambled just now. I'm glad you liked this one. This is one of those songs that meant something to me personally more than usual. For the acoustic guitar question you had, I'll let Buck or 2Mac answer that (where ya at bros?). I recorded those acoustic tracks over at Buck's studio when I visited chicago... He had all the mics and everything set up for me before I even got there... Buck and 2Mac monitored while I played. They sent me the tracks on CD after cleaning up. I can tell you what I did with the tracks they sent me (by the way, they sounded awesome from the get-go, but I did a tiny bit to them) There were 4 tracks, 2 tracks per mic. I played the song twice. I used both takes... I panned mic1a track hard left, I panned mic2a hard right, I panned mic1b at 9 oclock and panned mic2b at 3 oclock. I added very very gentle compression on all the acoustic tracks... very little. Buck or 2Mac can tell you more about how it was recorded, etc... cuz, well, I just played, they monitored and setup the booth, etc.... Those guys are cool... Again dobro thanks for the kind words... If you can think of anything else, let me know... I'm on a mission with this one.
 
No, no - my fault - I found the whole song pretty loud - did you compress the whole thing with a degree of attitude? :D The acoustic is just right.
 
Dobro, oh, no my fault. I read what you typed up there again and I realize what you were asking. Nope, I didn't compress the final mix... I did however raise the level of the stereo mix after I merged all the tracks to stereo... I brought the two resulting tracks back into my multitracker and upped the volume of left and right just under distortion. That's what I usually do for all my songs.
 
Hey, Teddie, your recordings are always very clean. They have a lot of clarity and depth and don't sound unnecessarily complicated. If I don't comment on them, it's usually because I don't know how they could be improved.
On Conformity, I guess I have more of a question than a comment. The acoustic guitars kind of sound like you're just playing the lower strings. Is that your intention?

Also, what IS that chord? :) It seems to sound OK throughout the song. But at the end there's the four bars of acoustic, and that chord is the second one. Sounds a little bit….hmmm…is that legal? :) I'm still trying to decide about it.
I wonder what your friend objected to. But I guess it's good that you didn't reveal it yet so you can get unbiased opinions.
 
Teddie

I really like this song... alot. :)

I have an idea or two I'd like to throw atcha, though.

It's not a right or wrong thing, because only YOU know what you want to hear and accomplish with this song.... and you're the 2nd most talented one-man operation I've ever heard.
(Sorry, but Todd Rundgren is still the tops in this dept. ;) )

I'll call you this weekend.

BTW... you're welcomed to come back and do more tracks here anytime it's possible for you. We really wanted to hear you sing through that big 'ole NTK and Envoice that I've got.

Tube mic through a tube preamp..... damn, life is good! :D

Buck
 
JimH, hey there. Thanks for the kind words. On that acoustic guitar question; actually the strings I'm playing on that very end verse are the same strings I'm playing on the regular verses throughout the song... except for the very last "strum" which was a suggestion by Buck. I played the last chord as a bar-chord... I like it... Kind of helped the end ring out as opposed to how I ended it originally in my head...

Now THE chord, you're talking about, I have no idea about chords... I can tell you what a G is, a D is.... um, that's about it... and THE chord your talking about is some malformed thing that I did... Actually, this makes me think of something funny... Not really related... I was in the sound booth (this is regarding the end chord), and Buck asked me to play an F-minor (I think that's what it was) for the last note... I didn't know what the hell he was talking about... So I just put my hands anywhere on the fret-board, held the guitar up to the glass and said, "um... is that it?"... PAH! Anyway, that second chord you were talking about, is shaped sort of like a C i think, but I actually think I messed up on the finger placement... I'm not sure... ramble.

Yeah, I decided not to tell what my friend thought so you folks could totally come up with your own comments and advice... Thanks again for listening and for your comments.

Buck, hey bro... Hey, I'm sorry I missed your call last weekend... I got your message. Gimme a ring later on in the week. Ah, hey, yeah... that NTK... that's what I'm talkin' bout... hehe.
 
Very nice song!

I hesitate to comment on the mix, as I really haven't done much (okay, any) mixing myself. However, I really like the song, and can tell you some of the things I noticed.

First, the bass (the level, I think, but perhaps the instrument) seemed to be a bit overwhelming - I found the acoustic guitar and drums tended to get "drowned out".

Also, the vocals seemed a bit "muted", especially when all of the instruments dropped out. My first thought was excess limiter, but I don't have the knowledge to say that with much authority.

Finally, it could be me, but the mix seemed a bit "left-heavy" - I listened with headphones, and it seemed there was a lot on the left, but not much on the right... this could be related to the bass issue.

Great song, regardless. Take my suggestions for what they're worth... and keep up the good work! :D

Addition: Listened to download copy (high-quality) through standard headphones.
 
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Teddie-

I had the same reaction that Dobro did (BEFORE I read his comment) -- the vocals, especially the lead vocal, should be more up front.

I liked the acoustic guitar. It's a very percussive, metallic sound. EQ boosts at 3-5K?

It's hard to understand a strongly negative reaction to this song. From a songwriting perspective, I might develop the melody some more, but otherwise it's a good song, and well-performed as always.

Hi fi. Through shitty speakers.
 
download & headphones

Sounds good, I understand the comment on left-heavy, think the acoustic guitar dsounds louder on the left, certainly the bass end anyway. Yep, that is a pretty dodgy chord, but it's not 'too' bad, nothin wrong with experimentin'! It's a cool song though, perhaps could do with some sonic variety, maybe some keyboards or something but I think you're taking on enough in any case! I thought the vocals were good and the backing vox sounded pretty much perfect.



Jags
 
HomeRec, thanks for listening. I totallly agree with you on the bass. When I listened to the song in my wife's car, in fact, the bass was painful. I think I toned it down to a good level on this next mix... I think. On the vocals, I'm not really sure what you meant by "muted" but I did use some compression on the vocals which may be what you're hearing. I think I may have fixed the "left-side-heavy" situation on this next mix. Let me know. Thanks for the kind words as well.

LI, hey bro... I brought the vocals up a little bit as you suggested. Also, bringing the level down on the bass I think may have helped the situation as well. You are correct on the eq boost on the guits. Glad it was good to your ears. I wasn't sure if I over did it. Thanks for the ears and the kind words.

Jags, hi. I actually had a hard time hearing the "left-side-heavy" thing, but I think I may have fixed it in this currect mix. I'm really thinking I'm going a little deaf in my left ear which scares the hell out of me. Jags, ya know, I actually took your advice on the keys... I very very subtley used some keys in the bridge to kind of fullen the sound.... it was bugging me before because it would thin-out to my ears when the bridge kicked in... I also added just a touch of verb to the vox in the bridge.

Other things I tried to fix was a little dissonance in the first pre-chorus vocal... I may have fixed it a little, but I may have not -- it's very subtle and I'm not sure if I'm hearing it anymore or making a audible figment of my imagination... dunno... also I fixed a little timing issue with the acoustic on the last verses... and a bunch of other little fixes that I hope make this a better better mix...

Please let me know what you hear/think if you get another chance to listen.

By the way, I created an UNPLUGGED version of the song to if anyone's interested.

Songs:
"Conformity"
"Conformity (Unplugged)"

here: http://mp3.com/smartapple

Thanks again,
Teddie
 
You've definitely solved the left-heavy issue in this mix. Sounds good. I know what you mean when you said that the keys were subtle! I think i just about made them out but that's all it needed, certainly gives it a bit more depth and variety. Very nice.

Jags
 
Much better

This version seems a lot more balanced.

I think that toning down the bass definitely helped curb the "left-heavy" quality of the song. I listened through the same headphones, and it seemed more balanced - the mix still seems to lean a little bit left, but not much.

Bringing the voice forward helped as well. I can still hear the compression in the section with the instrumental drop, but the fact that the vocals are more prominent helps. "Compression" - that's what I heard. Terminology glitch. :p

Subtle changes, but effective. One of those "It's exactly the same... only better" mixes. :)

Keep up the good work.
 
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Jags and HomeRec, thanks for the listens and the advice.

I think this might be the last mix on this one...

Although (uh), Bucky1962 asked me to send him the vox tracks. He's got this cool thing called an Envoice (spelling?)... He's gonna try to breathe some life into the vocals... So I'm gonna send those to him and see what he can do.

Thanks again folks!
 
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