New microphone

  • Thread starter Thread starter jaz49
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O.K., no more recording in the livingroom for me...tried the bedroom and the bass is less of a problem there. So, at least some of my issues with the mic were caused by the room. Live and learn! Now I think it's time to look into some sort of room treatment, because the mic still sounds kind of harsh to me. Thanks to all for the excellent advise.
 
Get some of this stuff:
http://www.atsacoustics.com/item--Roxul-Rockboard-60-Case-of-6--RB60.html
Also known as mineral wool. It's cheaper than the Owens-Corning 705 stuff but just as good for sound absorption. I just made some wood frames and covered with burlap that I cut from old coffee bags that I got for free down at the local coffee shop. They actually look pretty cool and were ultra cheap. If I think about it, I'll post some pictures. I think this will help your recordings.

GZ
 
Thanks...looks promising. Not a bad price either, if it does the job. I'm wondering if it would be possible to staple or glue some fabric over the rock board without making a frame? Also, does it have to be burlap fabric?
 
Yes, definitely post the photos if you get a chance! How do you secure it to the wall without doing permant damage? I'm in a rental apartment. Thanks again!
 
The burlap is glued on with a spray on adhesive, 3M or a few other possibilities. You really need some kind of wood frame, or else hanging will be tough. I'll try to get some pictures later today and get them up. I hung them with chain on one hook, so only one hole in the cieling, which you can plug with toothpaste when you move out (make sure it's white toothpaste).
 
Yes, definitely post the photos if you get a chance! How do you secure it to the wall without doing permant damage? I'm in a rental apartment. Thanks again!

OK I'll try to post some pictures, but here's some websites that will tell you how to build QRD diffusors if you are interested. I've made some 1-D diffusors also called Schroeder diffusors, and some 2-D diffusors also called skyline diffusors. There's some of each in the pictures as well as the base traps.

Here's the link for the 1-D. Just type in the depth and the width and the site computes all the depths of each well.
http://www.mhsoft.nl/diffusor.asp#calcul

Here's the link for the skyline diffusors:
http://www.pmerecords.com/Diffusor.cfm

Here's some pictures:
 

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Only 4 pics allowed per post, so here's the skyline diffusors as well as an attemp to show how these were hung with chains and one hook.
Best of luck to you
 

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OK, some words about noise, a few days late but better than never. Condenser mics have self-noise. No, this isn't phantom power noise, nor is it a defect (unless it's an unreasonable amount). The self-noise of a dynamic mic is much lower because it doesn't have active electronics, so there is just a bit of thermal noise, probably at a level 10 to 20dB below your AT3035.

However, there is no reason at all to use 60dB of gain with an AT3035. That mic is around 20dB more sensitive than your Senn dynamic. Therefore, your gain setting should be about 20dB lower.

The AT is not magically picking up every sound that the Senn can't hear, unless these noises are outside the frequency response of the Senn. But high frequencies don't travel through walls very well, so I doubt this is the case. If you apply enough gain to the Senn to match the level of the AT, I bet you hear the dog too.

But people tend not to treat more sensitive mics that way; instead of normalizing gain, they back away from the mic or sing quietly. It's all about signal to noise, and if you sing 1' from the AT, but 1" from the Senn, the Senn is getting a much higher signal (your voice) to noise (the dog) ratio than you're giving the AT. That concept also applies to the self-noise of the mic. That concept also applies to your room response.

Now, the proximity effect between the two mics probably is different. That is a function of many things; polar pattern, diaphragm size, case, etc. But the correct way to set gain is to experiment with mic placement, especially distance, until you get the tone you want. Then you set the gain on your preamp to the correct level. This might be an iterative process, as backing away from the mic will drop level, etc.

Another thing to be very aware of is how the mic's sensitivity and response affects your performance. Some people get their first condenser and start singing or playing ppp because they can, the mic will pick it up. But that doesn't mean you should, unless you are recording a whisper track or something.

Again, as a starting point, turn down your pre's gain 20dB from your mark for the Senn, then try and see how you like the AT.
 
Nice work GZ! Love the coffee bags! Until I can get hold of all the necessary materials I'm going to try out some comforters hung on the walls with cup hooks...and see if they cut out some of the harsness of the mic. It really can get horribly harsh with the consanent sounds ...even using a deesser.
 
Thanks mshilarious. Thats good information. So the self-noise of the mic is normal...that's good to know. I thought it might be defective. But if I cut the gain on my preamp by 20dB I'm going to have to get real close to the mic I'm afraid. I normally sing quietly...can't help it, that's just how I sing. I used to have to practically swallow the Sennheiser to get a strong enough level. Getting too close to the AT 3035(less than 12 inches or so) seems to make it very harsh; but I will try backing off on the gain tonight and see how it works out. Of course the harsness may be due in part to the room and/or the preamps on the emu interface. And I thought this would be easy, lol! :D
 
By the way, you asked if the fabric has to be burlap, and the answer is no. It does need to be a fabric that is acoustically transparent. You don't want the sound bouncing off your bass traps, you want it to pass through and absorb sound. For me at least, burlap was by far the cheapest solution. Mshilarious has some acoustic fabric that he sells from his Niant site, if you want it to look professional.
 
Thanks mshilarious. Thats good information. So the self-noise of the mic is normal...that's good to know. I thought it might be defective. But if I cut the gain on my preamp by 20dB I'm going to have to get real close to the mic I'm afraid. I normally sing quietly...can't help it, that's just how I sing. I used to have to practically swallow the Sennheiser to get a strong enough level. Getting too close to the AT 3035(less than 12 inches or so) seems to make it very harsh; but I will try backing off on the gain tonight and see how it works out. Of course the harsness may be due in part to the room and/or the preamps on the emu interface. And I thought this would be easy, lol! :D

Well then, that's why you'd want a condenser. But as far as background noise, that has more to do with your singing style than the mic. You'd want to select a mic with the lowest possible self-noise, but even then you will still be confronted by ambient noise . . . like the dog. A pro studio works very very hard to have a very low acoustic noise floor, for that reason. And that is not easy or cheap to achieve.

Note that you don't have to cut the gain 20dB, although that's probably a good starting point, the key is the right amount of gain for the right mic in the right position. I don't think that will be 60dB with an AT3035 (that works out to about a 66dBSPL source, which will give you only 54dB of dynamic range, less if the dog barking is more than 12dBSPL in your studio, which he probably is . . .) But it could be between 40 and 50dB of gain, I suppose.

As for your room acoustics, absorption will improve the low frequencies, but if you're having a problem in the sibilance range (4kHz or so) at a distance of 1" from your mic, that's the combination of your voice and the mic, not so much the room. Vocal mics are very personal and sometimes you have to try a bunch before you get one you like. The mic I like on my voice is hated by most other people!

Fabrics: it doesn't matter too much what you use on a bass trap. Some fabrics are more transparent than others, but that's a high-frequency phenomenon. No bass frequency is going to be very impressed with a layer of fabric; they will pass right through to the insulation underneath to be absorbed. Beyond that, a commercial facility will need a fire-rated fabric. You can use whatever you like . . .
 
I was not aware that the fabric was only important to the higher frequencies. However, bass traps don't only absorb lower frequencies, so don't you want them to be transparent to maximize absorption at all frequencies?
 
I was not aware that the fabric was only important to the higher frequencies. However, bass traps don't only absorb lower frequencies, so don't you want them to be transparent to maximize absorption at all frequencies?

If you are building a broadband absorber, then yes. Sometimes when building a bass trap, you might not want broadband absorption, so you'd use a reflective surface.

But in a small room, broadband absorption is usually what's called for. Even so, I've never heard anybody say they had a 10kHz problem in their room . . . and I would guess nearly any fabric is transparent below 4kHz.
 
OK, thanks for that info. Your expert opinion is always appreciated!

GZ Out
 
O.K. I tried mshilarious' suggestions, but I still can't get rid of the harshness. It's pretty severe. Maybe it's the room... I can't figure what else it could be...except a defective mic. I turned the gain down to about 45 dB and am singing about 12 inches from the mic. If I turn the gain lower and sing closer the harshness is worse. Tonight I will try turning the gain down even more or backing off more, but I won't get a very strong signal. I haven't done any room treatment yet, except for some comforters. Could the room be making the mic sound so incredibly harsh? I am having the same problem with the sennheiser e835, BTW. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. :confused:
http://www.soundclick.com/lejaz
 
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