Need some help with acoustics for my room.

[anemicrock]

I have been reading up a lot on room acoustics and how vital they are to have in your room lately and would be very grateful if someone can help me out. I know I need bass traps and broadband traps etc but I don't know how I can make them work with my room. I have attached some photo so you can see exactly what I mean. My room dimension are 18 feet wide. 15 feet long and 9 feet tall.

 

[anemicrock]

Sorry. Here are the photos.

 

[anemicrock]

Rear wall. Left and right corners.

 

[anemicrock]

Wall to the right if facing my desk. Unfortunately my kitchen. I apologize if the images are too large. If so just say the word. Thank you.

 

[pandamonk]

Preferably you want to be centred along the 15' wall with speakers firing down the 18' dimension. You want at least 2" absorption panel in the first reflection points (side wall and ceiling) and on thr back wall. Then at least 4" bass traps in the corners(including ceiling corners). For your drum booth, i'd recommend 4 gobos and 2 clouds.

 

[anemicrock]

Thanks man. Unfortunately I can't pit my desk as you mentioned other wise it would block access to my roof terrace where we we're talking about putting the drum booth. It sucks I can't have it that way. Can you think of a work around.

Also, even If I did place my desk like you suggested I would have no place to put bass traps behind me which would either be my kichen. Would be kind of hard to cook whilst there is a 4" bass traps hanging everywhere or right in front of my window. One day I'll have the perfect room but like I said this is all I got to work with for now.

 

[anemicrock]

I have just two more questions then I can get on with treating my room.

The two tiny corners on the wall I am facing, the left hand corner being cut short because of the window and the right hand corner which is a beam that sticks out. Probably to cover pipes or something. Can I just build
1 1/2 foot wide bass traps to go there and the length would be as tall as the wall? Reason being I don't want them sticking out and looking ridicules. I would have to cut triangle shapes out of the insulation to pack it in and get the thickness out of the trap. I know it would be better to leave a gap as thick as the actual bass trap but I just won't work in my case.

And my last question.

What do I put on the wall I am facing? Bass trap, Broadband etc. I'm confused because the wall behind me is a window almost dead center. Then there are untreated walls to the left and right of that window. About feet each wall which I will be tackling. For the wall I am facing I'm guessing a diffuser so what's reflecting off the window bounces back to hit the diffuser and stops it traveling back and forth. Am I right?

Sorry for all the questions when you most probably have already given me the answers but my room and unfortunately the layout is a bit confusing on where and what to actually be used.

I want to thank everyone once again for all the help you have already given me. And thank you for your patience.

Kevin

 

[pandamonk]

Thanks man. Unfortunately I can't pit my desk as you mentioned other wise it would block access to my roof terrace where we we're talking about putting the drum booth. It sucks I can't have it that way. Can you think of a work around.

Also, even If I did place my desk like you suggested I would have no place to put bass traps behind me which would either be my kichen. Would be kind of hard to cook whilst there is a 4" bass traps hanging everywhere or right in front of my window. One day I'll have the perfect room but like I said this is all I got to work with for now.

Well that's the best place. It might still work the other way around. Like centred along the 18' firing down the 15'. Bass traps can hang on any corner, so doesn't have to be at the kitchen. You could also build some removeable ones for when you need to room for something else.

 

[pandamonk]

I have just two more questions then I can get on with treating my room.

The two tiny corners on the wall I am facing, the left hand corner being cut short because of the window and the right hand corner which is a beam that sticks out. Probably to cover pipes or something. Can I just build
1 1/2 foot wide bass traps to go there and the length would be as tall as the wall? Reason being I don't want them sticking out and looking ridicules. I would have to cut triangle shapes out of the insulation to pack it in and get the thickness out of the trap. I know it would be better to leave a gap as thick as the actual bass trap but I just won't work in my case.

And my last question.

What do I put on the wall I am facing? Bass trap, Broadband etc. I'm confused because the wall behind me is a window almost dead center. Then there are untreated walls to the left and right of that window. About feet each wall which I will be tackling. For the wall I am facing I'm guessing a diffuser so what's reflecting off the window bounces back to hit the diffuser and stops it traveling back and forth. Am I right?

Sorry for all the questions when you most probably have already given me the answers but my room and unfortunately the layout is a bit confusing on where and what to actually be used.

I want to thank everyone once again for all the help you have already given me. And thank you for your patience.

Kevin

Could you actually draw a plan of your room, roughly to scale(with things like kitchen area, desk, doors, windows, etc), and I'll move things around and add the traps where i think.

 

[anemicrock]

Sure. I'll give it a go but I'm not really good at the kind of stuff.

 

[LemonTree]

That's not an ideal space but some very quick and inexpensive cures would be HEAVY velvet if you can get them curtains over the big window.

If I'm reading right your kitchen is directly behind you? Not a lot you can do about that really. Maybe a curtain rail on the ceiling with very heavy drapes behind the mixing position and monitoring at lower volumes would help pick up less reflections from the room. When not recording and mixing you pull the drapes back to the side walls and tie them up for asthetics.

Cheap absorbers for the walls....4" x1" or 4" x ½" frames even stuffed with 2" RW45 and covered with canvas. If you put a single strip of wood onto the wall with rawl plugs or whatever you can hang your absorber frames over them and take them down any time you need to. Obviously the bigger the gap behind the lower freqs will be absorbed.

You already mentioned you have a landlord and can't have anything to permanent so better I mention it again before anyone else chimes in with ideas that aren't ethical.

Play every commercial CD you can get your hands on through your monitors and LEARN how they sound in your room. Use them a LOT as mix references. I still think it doesn't matter how well a room is treated, you still have to learn how your monitors behave in there before you can mix acurately on them.

I'll get kicked in the nuts for this one .... use your monitors to get your levels balanced and use (dare I say it) headphones to check the panorama and the depth of your mixes, but always cross reference with your CD collection. If you get a happy medium between the monitors and headphones for that you're half way there but, never rely on headphones for individual volumes of instruments in the mix, always go on what the monitors tell you for that and they'll be more truthfull at lower listening volumes because the signals won't be bouncing off the walls as much and colouring your mix.

 

[pandamonk]

Sure. I'll give it a go but I'm not really good at the kind of stuff.

Just draw it on paint. If it's so bad i can't use it, I'll re-draw it, but just as long as you keep it roughly to scale and include the major things.

 

[pandamonk]

That's not an ideal space but some very quick and inexpensive cures would be HEAVY velvet if you can get them curtains over the big window.

If I'm reading right your kitchen is directly behind you? Not a lot you can do about that really. Maybe a curtain rail on the ceiling with very heavy drapes behind the mixing position and monitoring at lower volumes would help pick up less reflections from the room. When not recording and mixing you pull the drapes back to the side walls and tie them up for asthetics.

Cheap absorbers for the walls....4" x1" or 4" x ½" frames even stuffed with 2" RW45 and covered with canvas. If you put a single strip of wood onto the wall with rawl plugs or whatever you can hang your absorber frames over them and take them down any time you need to. Obviously the bigger the gap behind the lower freqs will be absorbed.

You already mentioned you have a landlord and can't have anything to permanent so better I mention it again before anyone else chimes in with ideas that aren't ethical.

Play every commercial CD you can get your hands on through your monitors and LEARN how they sound in your room. Use them a LOT as mix references. I still think it doesn't matter how well a room is treated, you still have to learn how your monitors behave in there before you can mix acurately on them.

I'll get kicked in the nuts for this one .... use your monitors to get your levels balanced and use (dare I say it) headphones to check the panorama and the depth of your mixes, but always cross reference with your CD collection. If you get a happy medium between the monitors and headphones for that you're half way there but, never rely on headphones for individual volumes of instruments in the mix, always go on what the monitors tell you for that and they'll be more truthfull at lower listening volumes because the signals won't be bouncing off the walls as much and colouring your mix.

Good ideas/points. For the frames, i used 2"x1" behind the RS45. This spaced it 2" from the wall and also left the edges exposed(more absorption ).

 

[anemicrock]

Okay. Like I said I am really shit at doing this kind of thing so this is the best I can come up with. It's not at all to scale as I have no idea how to do that but with the photos already posted previously and this crap ass little diagram or whatever you wanna call it, you should be able to get a better idea of where everything is at least. To the left and right of my desk are little pillars that stick out. I'm guessing the one on the right cause it to be a corner so I need to fit a bass trap in there some how. They stick out 1 ft.

I apologize again for the lame ass attempt.

 

[pandamonk]

Maybe something like this as a minimum treatment.

 

[anemicrock]

That could work. I wish I could get away with that but there's just a couple of problems.

I have no where to put my sofa anymore. Anywhere I can see left to put it would be smack in the middle of the kitchen. Also where you put a bass trap over the bottom window that is exactly where the door is to go outside. The other window has a door as well. Sorry if I forgot to mention that.

Thanks for trying but I think my brother and his GF as well as my own GF will get annoyed if I put the sofa that close to the kitchen as well as them needing to slide back curtains and shit when it's time to cook. There funny like that.

It's a shame because the flat is a real nice place. It's a penthouse type thing right in the middle of the city. Views are great but it's just a two bedroom. I wish so bad that It had a third for a dedicated control room. I have gotten very used to the sound of my room though. I always mix like lemontree suggested with a reference cd in pro tools. I realized I had to work like that in this space the day I moved in. It's been working out okay but I just know I can get a much better sound with some treatment. If I had my way I'd just rip the fucking kitchen out and throw it in the hallway.

Maybe instead of building a drum booth outside I should just build a small control room and record drums elsewhere?

I give up.

Thanks guys.

 

[pandamonk]

That could work. I wish I could get away with that but there's just a couple of problems.

I have no where to put my sofa anymore. Anywhere I can see left to put it would be smack in the middle of the kitchen. Also where you put a bass trap over the bottom window that is exactly where the door is to go outside. The other window has a door as well. Sorry if I forgot to mention that.

Thanks for trying but I think my brother and his GF as well as my own GF will get annoyed if I put the sofa that close to the kitchen as well as them needing to slide back curtains and shit when it's time to cook. There funny like that.

It's a shame because the flat is a real nice place. It's a penthouse type thing right in the middle of the city. Views are great but it's just a two bedroom. I wish so bad that It had a third for a dedicated control room. I have gotten very used to the sound of my room though. I always mix like lemontree suggested with a reference cd in pro tools. I realized I had to work like that in this space the day I moved in. It's been working out okay but I just know I can get a much better sound with some treatment. If I had my way I'd just rip the fucking kitchen out and throw it in the hallway.

Maybe instead of building a drum booth outside I should just build a small control room and record drums elsewhere?

I give up.

Thanks guys.

That might be a better idea, although this room is a good size for a control room.

An outdoor control room wouldn't need to be isolated as much either, which means you could make it bigger. Maybe 12'x10'x8', built like supercreep's (just a stud wall and single door, like LT's suggestion). This would take up basically the same space as a 9'x7' with double stud walls and 10" gap. You could give it a sloped roof/ceiling(towards the back wall) too.

Your large room, with wooden floor and sloped ceiling, would also be good for getting a good drum sound. I'd still recommend heavy curtains over the windows though, and some gobos for around the drums.

It might also be a good idea to build a drum-riser(like the floating floor on neoprene pucks) to reduce structural transmission of bass frequencies.

This could be a plan

 

[anemicrock]

Sounds like a plan. I'm going to double check with my landlord that this kinds of build will defiantly be okay. It's a structure and not a portable booth so I NEED to be absolutely certain of this before I build.

Thanks again man. I'll let you know what happens.

 

[pandamonk]

Ok, I've drawn up a plan as close to scale as i could make it. For details, just download and zoom in. If you're confused by anything, just ask. For the floor, just build the floating floor with 4"x2"s. The Door is LT's suggestion. For the door, I'd suggest using thicker plywood(or doubling it) than the wall, as you're losing an inch or two air-gap, and it would be a slight weak link.

 

[pandamonk]

Sounds like a plan. I'm going to double check with my landlord that this kinds of build will defiantly be okay. It's a structure and not a portable booth so I NEED to be absolutely certain of this before I build.

Thanks again man. I'll let you know what happens.

Yeah definitely. This is more like just an insulated shed than the drum booth suggestion anyway. You don't need planning permission for builds under 25m^2 and 3m tall, i believe. Although, that could be wrong.