Need help with vocal mic selection

[MooreDogger]

Hello,
I've been asked to put together a home studio and I'm trying to select some vocal mics. The band that will be recording consists of one guitar/vocal, a drummer, bass, a lead vocalist, and another backup vocalist. I want the capability to record live (the room will handle it well) so I need to select 3 vocal mics. I've been thinking about getting one "nice" one (on this budget 300 max/mic) for the lead and 2 lesser quality for the other 2 vocals. For the main one i've been looking at:

Marshall MXL V69 ME
Studio Projects C1
AKG C2000B/H100
Rode NT1000
Shure KSM27
CAD M9 Tube

For the backups i've been looking at:

Marshall MXL V67G
Studio Projects B1
Rode NT1a
Studio Projects B3

The lead vocal is female, and the backups are one male and one female (with the male singing lead sometimes).

What would you suggest for the 3 mics?

 

[noiseportrait]

I would not recommend recording vocals live with condesor mics unless you're puting the players in different rooms and having them monitor with headphones. If you want to do a live recording with the whole band in the same room, you will get much less bleed and hence, more usable tracks with dynamic mics.

 

[MooreDogger]

Sorry, I just meant track them all at the same time. The area (more than one room) that its going to be in has enough seperation that bleed from instruments wont be a problem. Mt appologies, I should have been more clear.

 

[Dot]

MooreDogger, you can't really tell which mic is going to sound best on which singer, so it's not like you can buy a "better" one for lead and lesser mics for bkgd vox. But you can get a selection that all complement each other and would give you the widest range of possibilities.

I'd recommend:

Studio Projects C1 - colored, hyped mic that sounds good on a lot of different people's vocals. Good vocal mic to cut through a mix. Not such a great instrument mic, IMO, except for snare and the occasional amp.
MXL V69 ME - a great complement to the C1 as the V69 is much darker, not hyped, and even more colored. Good for a smooth classic vintage sound.
Studio Projects B1 - great neutral workhorse mic.

Some people also find that tube mics work well for bkgd vox, because they're a little smoother and sit back behind in the mix.

My 2¢.

 

[MooreDogger]

thanks Dot. This place is really informative! Any other suggestions?

 

[DJL]

thanks Dot. This place is really informative! Any other suggestions?

It might help some if you tell everyone here what mics your vocalist have been using in the past, and if they like them or not... and if not, why?

 

[MooreDogger]

these particular singers have mostly only sung live (sm58s mostly) with the exception of one studio album. (not mine)

 

[DJL]

Do they like the 58's and do you have any other mics besides the 58's? The more info you give, the more I and others here can help walk you through this.

 

[MooreDogger]

I think they like the 58s but they're only used to hearing what comes out of the monitors so they dont get the greatest picture of what the tone is like. And currently I only have the 58s in terms of vocal mics.

 

[Richard Monroe]

Frankly, if you're tracking in different rooms, you kind of lose the live feel. You'd probably get better results tracking them separately, but... For the lead, C-1 is a valid choice, although I prefer the C-3, which is just over the budget ($350). The C2000B and Oktava MK319 work particularly well for me on backing vox, especially girls. A really good dynamic is also very good. The high priced spread is Shure SM7B, but Sennheiser MD421 is a good choice for less money. I'd probably track down a used C-3, and a used MD421, and buy the C2000B new. With those 3 mics, you should be able to mix and match until you get the sound you want. For $99 or so, throw the Oktava MK319 on the pile. Some combination of 3 of those four mics will work.-Richie

 

[MooreDogger]

ya, I'm rethinking the tracking all at once. It'll just be different for the band (they've only ever played together, never tracked) but i guess the result would be better in the end. Thanks for your help on that and the mics as well.

 

[sile2001]

Frankly, if you're tracking in different rooms, you kind of lose the live feel. You'd probably get better results tracking them separately, but...

Granted, it is not quite the same if you are in different rooms, but having played on a few recordings in the past (live and tracked), I will say that there is a distinct difference in live and tracked songs that is more than just a difference in quality...there is a difference in the performance as well.

For the lack of a better term, I've simply had to call it the 'jam factor'. Musicians in a good band have a tendency to feed off of each other, not just listen to their own sound. Consequently, as the song progresses, it becomes more than simply a sum of its parts. Sometimes the emotions behind the song comes out more and it is sung with passion rather than as a routine drill in a recording studio.

And on the other hand it can be completely disastrous

Before you write off the live recording, try it on a track or two (if you can afford the time) and see what you come up with. You may be surprised with the results. I used to play in a band that was knit close enough that with no prior discussion, we could completely change the way we played a song...it's feel, it's volume, it's rhythm and tempo..anything...and we could just flow with it. Those were some of our best performances and also some of our best studio tracks.

I will now step down off my soapbox

 

[MooreDogger]

So the final verdict is that i'm going to record the band live (with some scratch vocals) and then the other vocals after. Does this change the mic selection? (the 3 vocals will be tracked at once).

 

[Richard Monroe]

No, it doesn't really change the mic selection. The hard part is just finding the mic/pre combination that makes the singers sound good, which is like buying shoes. A cheap pair of shoes that fits is better than a pair of expensive Italian shoes that are the wrong size. You may find that 2 mics will work, with both backups singing into one mic at the same time. Generally, the backing vox want to be a little wetter and a little darker than the lead vox. I've done that a lot with the lead vox into B.L.U.E. Kiwi (waaay over budget) and the backing vox into C2000B or MK319.-Richie

 

[noiseportrait]

I'd get one nice LDC for the lead and use the sm58's for backups then. IMHO that would be a better investment overall.

 

[MooreDogger]

I've never recorded with the 58s, how do they sound? Also what then would you suggest as the one nice LDC at up to $600?

 

[Big Kenny]

Get a cad m179, $150 - $200, It is a great mic for now and later

 

[MooreDogger]

so no suggestions on a LDC up to $600?

 

[Richard Monroe]

Depends on the voice. I like Shure KSM44 (I talked GC to $600 on a new one) B.L.U.E. Baby Bottle, Rode NTK, Studio Projects T-3. Pesonally, NTK works very well with my voice, but vocal mics are like shoes. Whether they fit is more important than how expensive they are.-Richie