Need advice on studio monitors

[Blue Bear Sound]

This guy does.


http://www.prorec.com/prorec/articl...0b7fae7ed3205d3c86256ae100044f41?OpenDocument

That article only proves 2 things....

1) Everyone doesn't have the same ears.

2) Articles such as that, for the most part are opinion based on a single person's subjective impressions.


You hear with YOUR EARS, not people's opinions. Monitor selection is EXTREMELY subjective.... so much so that a question such as "which monitor should I buy?" can only be answered one way.... "which monitor sounds best TO YOU?"

 

[ZOWIE!]

That article only proves 2 things....

1) Everyone doesn't have the same ears.

2) Articles such as that, for the most part are opinion based on a single person's subjective impressions.

Well that's all self-evident.

But do note Dragon's own article on selecting monitors posted here on homerec: it says let the pro reviewers narrow down the field for you.

 

[Blue Bear Sound]

Well that's all self-evident.

It may be self-evident but people continue to ignore what their own ears are telling them, in favour of 20 people posting that M-Audio monitors are "the shit!"

But do note Dragon's own article on selecting monitors posted here on homerec: it says let the pro reviewers narrow down the field for you.

That's a generalization that presumes much.

First of all, define PRO - is there a calibre of PRO that will make someone ignore their ears and follow what the PRO is using? Will you accept the opinion of George Massenburg more than the opinion of Aaron Carey?? (Both pros, one slightly higher-profile than the other!)

Second - NS-10s are very bad sounding speakers, but many pros still use them - does that mean if one is not pro and doesn't like the NS-10 they should get them anyways?

And lastly, how can anyone narrow the field down for anyone else, when not everyone shares the set of ears!

See my point?


Being involved with audio means LISTENING more than philosophizing on gear. If you can accept the premise that a Neumann U87 is a high-end mic that is not appropriate for every vocalist, then it shouldn't be too much of stretch to understand that one person's monitor is another person's doorstop, depending enitrely on their ears - not to mention the room they're being used in!

 

[pennylink]

All well-spoken, but in most circumstances it is very difficult for someone to test a large number of different monitors in the same listening environment, as no dealer will stock every monitor! So it does help to get some feedback from other users, to help narrow down the field.

Leavings, if you're worried about spending too much on your first pair of monitors (such as on the Mackie HR824), I would encourage you to take a really good look and listen at the Yorkville YSM1p.

The general consensus around here is that they're one of the best or at least one of the most-liked monitors (as in neutral, which is what you want) in the $400 or even higher price range.

The only difficulty might be in finding a dealer closeby where you can listen to them for yourself. It would be worth the effort though. Of course purchasing them isn't a problem as you can easily find them on-line.

You might want to try the "search" function at the top of the page for monitors and/or Yorkville YSM1p so you can at least see what other people think.

 

[Blue Bear Sound]

So it does help to get some feedback from other users, to help narrow down the field.

How much does it help given that you don't even know the context of the person's ears or listening environment?!?!

What if Rip based his opinions strictly from quick auditions to the monitors in his living room, rather than actually working with for longer periods in a proper control room? (and, given his comments, most of which I disagree with, I suspect the living room is EXACTLY where he auditioned them!)

 

[chessrock]

You guys . . . honestly . . .

I put somewhere around 0 stock in anything that anyone has to say about a pair of monitors.

Seriously. Relying on a board like this one . . . or any third-party opinion for that matter is just about next to a complete exercise in futility.

When it comes to microphones, compressors, mixers, etc. you'll notice a few patterns: Everyone has favorites which will vary, but for the most part, there is somewhat of a consensus on which ones are crap, which ones are acceptable, and which are good, etc. At least in a very general sense.

Not so with monitors. They're all over the freakin' board. One guy thinks monitor X is the shit, while the other guy thinks they're just shit. And both opinions could be from two very talented and respected engineers.

Go figure.

Anyway, I'm saying this because I'm sick of reading the same goddamn arguments over and over. Give it up. Just go and liten to a bunch of them and decide for yourself. And don't worry if Bluebear thinks they're crap or if I think they're crap or if Rip Rowan thinks they're crap, or if Jskillz thinks they're dope. None of these guys knows shit when it comes to monitors because frankly no one knows shit when it comes to monitors.

Alright? Glad we got that settled.

 

[Blue Bear Sound]

There ya go!

 

[kylen]

How much does it help given that you don't even know the context of the person's ears or listening environment?!?!

This is kind of it for me per what Blue Bear mentioned. I have a set of monitors that I was playing with last night that I could make sound great (sound had detail, depth, seperation, musical) or crappy (sounded like a wool blanket was thrown over the audio) just by moving the speakers .5m in my listening room.

That makes any 'sound bite' opinions of monitors way too subjective and arbitrary for me because of the monitor/room connection. However - statistically over time I'm keeping a list of what monitors folks use on a bunch of forums - when I hear their mixes and note their monitoring setup then it gives me an idea about a potentially good sounding piece of equipment to check out.

A lot of good equipment can be used so that it sounds bad. With monitors one of the things to make them sound bad is to put them in the wrong place in a room. I think anyone can suffer from this problem - more or less - even if the room has acoustic tratments.

kylen

 

[leavings]

Okay, so don't think that the point of the last 10 posts is lost on me. I understand that this may be a subjective art, and I AM trusting my ears.

But...

If I were going to just trust my ears then I would be perfectly satisfied with my headphones. I want monitors because they serve some purpose, to give me an accurate portrayal of the signal I'm mixing. Clearly some monitors serve that purpose better than others. The Alesis M1's I tested certainly didn't sound quite as good as the Mackies, but they seemed good enough considering the drastic price difference. I think I'll go back to a few more stores with all this info in my head, and then just buy something. I need to get started.

Please, if anyone can answer my other questions (about needing powered speakers and near-fields), I would appreciate it.

Thanks to everyone for your advice, Peter

 

[barefoot]

None of these guys knows shit when it comes to monitors because frankly no one knows shit when it comes to monitors.

I like to think I know a little shit about monitors.

I have to disagree with Bruce's premise that monitor selection is completely subjective. And you can't compare the sound of a microphone with the sound of a monitor. A microphone goes on the front end. It's a tool for acquiring a particular sound - be it clean, colored, or whatever. Monitors are on the back end. They are the windows to your mix, allowing you to "see" what you are doing with all of your sound coloring tools. Monitors shouldn't have a sound of their own. They should be transparent. Or at least, their sound should be conducive to good translatability. (I would argue that accuracy IS the best path towards translatability, but perhaps that's for another debate.)

In any case, there are certainly generalizations that can be made about the way we all hear (Fletcher-Munson for example). So, assuming the goal is to create a mix that sounds good to a large number of people on a variety of systems, there should certainly be some generalizations we can make about the desirable aspects of a studio monitor, no?

Thomas

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Thomas Barefoot
Barefoot Sound LLC.
San Francisco

 

[iceberg]

I like my M-Audio BX8's and I dont care who doesnt. They translate well for me and they dont fatigue my ears like my V8's use to do. I do still refence the V8's for a little different view so to speak. I also mix on ns-10's at another studio and enjoy them as well. You are right about them sounding bad, they do. But if you can get a great mix on them they translate real well.

If someone asks me for a good monitor under $600, I will tell them I like the BX-8's.

Its all relative fella's

go to a store with a return policy or find a studio that has monitors your interested in and let your ears tell you if they will work for you or not.