Module or Soft Synths?...

WERNER 1

WERNER 1

Member
Hey guys,,,,Forgive me here as I'm not a keyboardist :o

I recently received a Roland A-80 Midi Controller Keyboard from our Keyboardist, and I've got it hooked into my Delta 1010's Breakout Box Via the Midi out/In....I'm also Runing Sonar 6 PE..

My question is that I'm looking for something with some really good Piano and Synth sounds and don't know if I should go with a Module or some Soft Synths? I do have some Soft Synths that came in Sonar, but IMO those are not very good sounding (??)

Does anyone have any suggestions as to which way would be the best to go, and also what brands/Models I should be looking at?

Oh yeah,...I'm looking to keep this thing rather inexpensive as I can :D

Thanks in Advance!

Rick
 
For decent piano and synth sounds, you could look at the following:

Cakealk Dimension Pro, Spectrasonics Atmosphere or Trilogy, SampleTank and reFX Nexus.

I just recently dumped my Roland XP30 in favor of Dimension Pro and don't miss the hardware one bit.

Other good softsynths out there are Korg's Legacy Collection (both Analog and Digital Editions) as well as Native Instrument's FM8.
 
Well its all about personal prefferences i guess.I would do both if i had a chance.
I sold my XP-30 and i regret it because now i only have soft synths and Halion.It doesnt sound bad but i could use some variety.

Actualy its good to have soft synths when you have crappy converters and preamps ,so you can keep everythin in the box,but on the other side if you have some good converters, you can use your modules and change the shape and tone on analog gear before it enters the digital world.To my ears its better and sound more natural than any sampler or synth in the box.

Delta 1010 isnt bad ,i would definitly use the outboard gear first then the inbord stuff.But then again its all about what genre of music you are creating.The techno and electronic music can be forgiving staying in the box , but rock ,hiphop ,r&b and Jazz need more of a natural instruments.

Just my humble opinion.
 
That's a question that will generate tons of conflicting opinions.

To me, it's not a question of the medium (hardware vs. software) but a question of product. You can get some great products in both mediums, and some shitty products in both mediums.

The only time it becomes an issue for me is if the soundcard latency needs to be high so the CPU doesn't choke... then playing virtual instruments becomes pretty difficult. So usually what I'll do is have one project where I just lay down tracks, bounce the audio, and another one where I arrange stuff, giving me the best of both worlds.

Ivory or Kurzweil MicroPiano or KME? Or Roland Fantom? Or...
Absynth? No hardware equivalent to this, and to me one of the best synths ever created hardware or software...
Yamaha Motif or Korg Legacy Collection? Take a pick :D
 
Thanks for the replies guys!!!

I see that you both use(d) the XP-30 (??)....This is a module yes? ....Whould this be a decent place to start for a good used module? Or should I just get the Phantom X8?!?! :eek: The Roland Rep came by the other day and I got an hour and a half crash course on that sucker ...WOW!

So what are some good modules to keep an eye out for, and what kind of prices's are they bringing these days??

Thanks again!

Rick
 
WERNER 1 said:
Thanks for the replies guys!!!
I see that you both use(d) the XP-30 (??)....This is a module yes?
Click to expand...
Almost. It's a 61-key keyboard. A little long in the tooth now, so you can probably get one for a song on ebay. It's the same basic core as the JV1080 and takes the SRJV expansion cards. The sounds are from about 1995 but they aren't bad. Bal Sagoth used them on most of their albums - they had the XP50 and later XP80 as I recall.

Nonetheless it would do what you want since it can be controlled via MIDI. I've used the JV1010 myself which again has the same basic sounds, and I can provide a few examples if you're curious. The pianos could be better, but they aren't bad.

The equivalent module would be the JV1080.
 
Take a look at the old EMU Proteus lineup. They all have a good collection of decent sounds and they sell for a song on Ebay. EMU made a wide range of nice 1U rack mount modules for different styles of music. Here's an example:

http://cgi.ebay.com/E-MU-Proteus-1000-2000-sound-module-EMU_W0QQitemZ130127355709QQihZ003QQcategoryZ38071QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
http://cgi.ebay.com/E-MU-Orbit-3-synthesizer-module-9099-Orbit3-no-reserve_W0QQitemZ130127343115QQihZ003QQcategoryZ38071QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem http://cgi.ebay.com/EMU-E-MU-vintage-pro-sound-module-with-manual-and-cable_W0QQitemZ230145469231QQihZ013QQcategoryZ38071QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

For some of the worlds best pure synth sounds look into the Matrix 1000, the thing is a monster.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Matrix-1000-sound-module-by-Oberheim-GOOD-condition_W0QQitemZ270134996206QQihZ017QQcategoryZ38071QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
 
My JV1080 has been gathering dust since I got Atmosphere. It's much more convenient tracking down exotic sounds in software than trying to figure out why the sound module is not switching sounds. I just got really tired of having to reconfigure my software to work with an external sound module.

Today there are numerous options in software that work better than modules but there is a downside to software which is cpu limitation. Freezing tracks takes care of this one however.

I say, spend some time and check out software. If you have a decent powered computer you will be happier. Along with a decent midi controller (Not M-Audio if you are using Vista) it's just more convenient.
 
These days I don't see the point in buying an old synth like the XP30 for a piano. The piano sound in those doesn't hold a candle to what you can get nowadays. Also, you already have one of the best controllers ever made in the Roland A-80, you don't need another keyboard--get a module.

If you are gigging with it and don't want to bring a laptop, then a module is definitely the way to go. Something a little more modern like a Roland module with the SRX piano expansion board in it would be a good choice (XV-5050, XV-5080, Fantom XR for example). The piano built into the Fantom XR is also pretty good.

If you go the softsynth route, "Ivory" is a great choice for piano. Another way to go is to buy Kontakt 2 and get piano libs for it. SampleTekk has some good sampled pianos for Kontakt that are not very expensive.

But the main thinig I would avoid is picking up some of those old piano modules from Roland, Emu, Kurzweil and others. They were good in their day but have now been surpassed.
 
well this is my take on this subject.....lol any of the pianos listed above will do the job. it's really about what you're going to do with it. remember the end listener doesn't care if the piano is made from an old emu or roland or a new one...they care about music they can listen to. the only people who really care about that is the gear junkie or audiophile that really really digs deep down and try to tell the difference. if you can get a synth that makes a convincing piano then it's ok. dont get caught up in the gotta get the new synth everytime one comes out fad. poeple made music with the roland xp-30 back then and it was listenable. you can do it today.
 
Thanks again for all of the replies guys!! ... Sorry I've not been around much to respond...real busy with work :(

My goal is to just have it here in my Home Studio to use for some filler synth sounds as well as some piano parts.....again, I'm a guitarist not a keyboardist so there's a major learning curve going on there :o ....but on the same hand I want it to be decent enough so that if one of my Keyboard buddies comes over to lay down some tracks I'll have some nice sounds for them to choose from...

I don't think I'll ever use this thing in a live application.....just PC based recording..

I'm slowly learning how to use this as a midi controller for VSTi's such as EZ Drummer ....that's pretty cool!

Maybe later tonight I'll have a chance to check out some of the items you guys listed as I'm off to work right now again :(

Thanks a bunch!!

Rick
 
I'd like to second a fantom rack with an SRX expansion board that gives you specialized piano sounds if you need them although the ones that come with the Fantom are great to start with.

I will say i had proteus 2000 that has a half decent grand piano patch on it once it has been given a smidgeon of reverb. These racks can be had for as little as $150 on ebay and maybe use it in conjunction with a lexicon mx200 effects rack which is just as cheap . also the MX200 can be controlled through a VST plugin on your DAW ;) .
 
I think these are the only Synth/Key type soft synths included in Sonar 6 PE:

PSYN II™ Subtractive Synthesizer


Pentagon™ I Analog Modeling Synth


RXP™ groove instrument with REX file support

IMO, these are not really all that good....well at least the factory presets (??) ....nothing in comparrison to the Phanton 8 or Yamaha ES's .....Again, I'm not a keyboard player or anything, but I know a "good" sound when I hear it, and I"m not hearing it on the included stuff in Sonar PE...

Thanks,
Rick
 
WERNER 1 said:
nothing in comparrison to the Phanton 8 or Yamaha ES's .....Again, I'm not a keyboard player or anything, but I know a "good" sound when I hear it, and I"m not hearing it on the included stuff in Sonar PE...

Thanks,
Rick
Click to expand...

Yes well of course.

If the Roland and or Yamaha is in the budget you're not likely to go too far wrong. You did however mention in your first post that price was a consideration.

I know nothing of the Sonar Sampler Rapture (that I mentioned earlier) but for a utility type sound engine (one that covers lot's o bases) a soft sampler can do a lot of wonderful things and they're usually MUCH cheaper and somewhat easier to expand than a Roland or Yamaha or Korg solution. There are others (soft samplers) on the market to choose from as well.
 
Yes you're correct..... 3 grand is WAY outside of my budget :( ....even the module for 1300.00 isn't even close to fitting either ...

I guess soft styths and Piano/keys would be the most cost efficeint,...or the most "Bang for your Buck" item at this point..

Thanks,
Rick
 
Sorry I told you wrong...it looks as though Cakewalk/Sonar's sample playback engine is called Dimension Pro. Looks to be WELL under $300.00.

I've not heard it but as so often is the case it'll be MUCH more powerful than one would expect.

Native-Instruments Kontakt II is widely accepted as the most powerful soft synth/sampler on the market and would be another consideration in the "cover all bases" type engine albeit more expensive. I think the street price is around $500.00 but it is MASSIVELY powerful and wonderfully expressive.

I'm not sure if IK Multimedia's Sample Tank is PC ready but yet another great sampler/playback soft synth. I've always loved the sound of their engine.

Phil Collins and his son Simon have been (of late) raving about IK Multimedia's "Sonic Synth" a fantastic all in one playback device (which I have worked with and absolutely loved).

All of the above would give you great sounds, instant recalls. endless tweakability, automation and with the exception of Sonic Synth endless upgrade-ability.
 
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