Modern Metal Guitar Tone - (w/ sample)

amra

amra

Well-known member
Ok, I being a guitarist I have my own favorite guitar tone, that I am (periodically) happy with. I like to think I am pretty good at getting some nice heavy guitar tones.

But sometimes I get bands in here that I know are looking for a certain type of modern metal sound, and I've never really been able to nail the exact sound with a real amp, tube or otherwise. I can get heavy all day long, but it doesn't have that "Sizzle" or modern sounding bite to it.

What kind of post production stuff can you hear on this sample? I hear an almost MP3/Audio streaming type compression on the guitar, that you don't really hear on the other instruments. Those in the know, break it down for me. Let's assume we've got a good sounding amp. Let's assume we've got good mic placement with a good mic.

From the mic back, what kind of stuff is on this guitar track?

 
I don't think that was what he was looking for...

To the OP, I can't help you, sorry. To anybody else, I'd be glad to hear your answers. I'm after that kind of guitar tone myself.
 
Sorry guys, I guess I should have been more specific. The clip I posted is an example of a modern metal guitar tone from a major label release. I am trying to figure out what kind of post production stuff was done to the guitar track on it...
 
I don't know Amra, I think that a tone like that is still mostly just dependant on good tracking rather than any post production techniques. I've heard some similarly great tones from dudes who supposedly don't process the guitars save for maybe a bit of EQ.

Do you ever check out the Andy Sneap forum?

http://www.ultimatemetal.com/forum/andy-sneap-151/

Alot of guitar tone talk going on there.

I was up against 3 persistent obstacles when it came to getting a good modern sound (not that I can get it now...but I'm closer).
First one was that I wasn't recording my cab in a suitable environment. Moving it out into a bigger room, even though I was still just close mic'ing, seemed to allow me to get a much tighter sound. (I used to mic it in a large closet and I was always eq'ing the hell out of it). Second was the speakers. Once I switched from G12t-75's to Celestion vintage 30's it was like a night and day difference when it came to that sharp high end bite. (the former speakers were pretty old too)
Third for me was the mic pre. I hate to attribute anything to money spent, but when I stepped up to a higher quality mic pre it really seemed to bring the SM57 to life. The sound was much more in your face and powerful.

I also think a really high quality eq is pretty important for any final shaping of the tone. Even if you're just talking plugins. I've got a couple of good EQ plugins that sound worlds better than some of the cheaper stuff I used to use.
You may have it all covered, I'm just relaying my experiences.
 
metalhead28 said:
I was up against 3 persistent obstacles when it came to getting a good modern sound (not that I can get it now...but I'm closer).
First one was that I wasn't recording my cab in a suitable environment. Moving it out into a bigger room, even though I was still just close mic'ing, seemed to allow me to get a much tighter sound. (I used to mic it in a large closet and I was always eq'ing the hell out of it). Second was the speakers. Once I switched from G12t-75's to Celestion vintage 30's it was like a night and day difference when it came to that sharp high end bite. (the former speakers were pretty old too)
Third for me was the mic pre. I hate to attribute anything to money spent, but when I stepped up to a higher quality mic pre it really seemed to bring the SM57 to life. The sound was much more in your face and powerful.

I also think a really high quality eq is pretty important for any final shaping of the tone. Even if you're just talking plugins. I've got a couple of good EQ plugins that sound worlds better than some of the cheaper stuff I used to use.
You may have it all covered, I'm just relaying my experiences.
Click to expand...

I agree with this 100%... right on target
 
Thanks for the replies so far, that's the kind of stuff I was looking for...

I've kind of had a hunch that the cab and speakers might play a bigger role than I first realized. But I also wondered if there was kind of "magic" compressor or something that gives modern metal tones that metallic crisp kind of edge to it. Tool is another good example of this sound. It just has a kind of crispness for a lack of better words. It just sounds processed.

Maybe I am just hearing things. Maybe all it is just the specific combination of amp and cab and EQ. Damn. I was hoping there was some kind of 'trade secret' that, once I weaseld it out of someone, I could save up, by some more gear and instantly get better recorded guitar tone! heheh
 
Read the Andy Sneap forums that was already mentioned.

As far as EQ and compression, I'd say none! Only a bit of corrective EQ and multi band compression to fix muddiness and fizzle.

It's 99% mic placement, and the entire guitar signal chain. From the guitar to the cab. As well as the amp settings.
 
line 6

only a suggestion...but try,two tracks on input. blend a miked cab with a modeler ,preferably a line 6(pod xt, pod pro , pocket pod ,tone port...) this will provide you clear distorted recto sound. give your cab a slight crunch, not too much. blend these tracks together on seprate tracks. this should get you closer to the modern sizzle.
 
In a couple of weeks I will try and post some of the metal guitar stuff I am about to record. The signal chain is pretty top notch. We will be using a Diamond SPecOP 100 head through the Diamond SpecOP 4x12 cab and a Marshall 1960a cab. For mics I will be using a Peluso 2247 into a Chandler TG2 preamp followed by a Distressor, and then a Royer R121 through a Pendulum Audio Quartet channel strip. For fun we may also toss a Red Type B with a C12 cap on it through a Martech preamp as well. That will help us determine what we may need to change at the head itself. The Guitar being used will be a Custom configured Jackson.
 
Wow that is some heavy duty hardware x...
You know what would be really helpful, would be to hear a clip of the raw guitar tracks, as they sound right after tracking and then a clip of the finished track. Not sure if that is something you would feel like doing, but that would be really sweet...


Amra
 
is another good example of this sound. It just has a kind of crispness for a lack of better words.
Click to expand...

that's called a vintage les paul, being fed simultaneously into marshall, mesa-boogie, and diezel amps...running through mesa 4x12's

on top of that, i read a joe baressi interview where he said that they threw 3 mics on each cab for 10,000 days, and did 4 takes for all the guitars...of course 3 cabs x 3 mics x 4 takes = 36 tracks!

i would venture to say that the guitar buss was fed through some sort of compressor, even if it was only to glue all the tracks together...but that's a minute detail. when it comes down to it, 95% of the tone will be from the player, the instrument, and the amp.
 
metalhead28 said:
I don't know Amra, I think that a tone like that is still mostly just dependant on good tracking rather than any post production techniques. I've heard some similarly great tones from dudes who supposedly don't process the guitars save for maybe a bit of EQ.

Do you ever check out the Andy Sneap forum?

http://www.ultimatemetal.com/forum/andy-sneap-151/

Alot of guitar tone talk going on there.

I was up against 3 persistent obstacles when it came to getting a good modern sound (not that I can get it now...but I'm closer).
First one was that I wasn't recording my cab in a suitable environment. Moving it out into a bigger room, even though I was still just close mic'ing, seemed to allow me to get a much tighter sound. (I used to mic it in a large closet and I was always eq'ing the hell out of it). Second was the speakers. Once I switched from G12t-75's to Celestion vintage 30's it was like a night and day difference when it came to that sharp high end bite. (the former speakers were pretty old too)
Third for me was the mic pre. I hate to attribute anything to money spent, but when I stepped up to a higher quality mic pre it really seemed to bring the SM57 to life. The sound was much more in your face and powerful.

I also think a really high quality eq is pretty important for any final shaping of the tone. Even if you're just talking plugins. I've got a couple of good EQ plugins that sound worlds better than some of the cheaper stuff I used to use.
You may have it all covered, I'm just relaying my experiences.
Click to expand...


I was going to post alot of the same exact things. Vintage 30's make a huge difference. I now track my guitars in a 20x35 room and I upgraded to koj's old m610 preamp. I'd have to say the pre really did make the biggest difference. I don't even eq guitars anymore. I get the sound right on the amp, check it on my monitors a few times and then hit record. No more fucking around. As far as the distortion sound, extremely tight playing and a really nice guitar. Pickups are vital as well, shit pickups are like using shit mics.
 
I don't mind posting before and after files, but it may be a little while. I just sent my R121 back to Royer yesterday for a re-ribbon. I did a couple of takes the other day though on that guitar rig with a Peluso 2247 and a Red Type B with the R7 capsule. Both of them were tracked through John Hardy M2 preamps and a UA 2192 converter. If I have some time at the beginning of next week I will try and post some of those if you want.
 
Any heavy guitar stuff you have recorded would be appreciated.
I think it might be handy to hear some raw heavy guitar tracked through a nice quality signal chain, so we home-studio types can have a reference of what we should be shooting for at that stage...


Thanks!
A.
 
I dont know whether anyone is paying attention to this post anymore, but I think I get a nice guitar tone. Go to www.myspace.com/mullecular, listen to Mechanize and be the judge. I recently remixed it. I think every aspect from pre production signal to eq tweaking is important. Also, how well the guitar mixes with the bass and likewise the bass to the bass drums which is a matter of eq and levels.
 
Ironklad Audio said:
that's called a vintage les paul, being fed simultaneously into marshall, mesa-boogie, and diezel amps...running through mesa 4x12's

on top of that, i read a joe baressi interview where he said that they threw 3 mics on each cab for 10,000 days, and did 4 takes for all the guitars...of course 3 cabs x 3 mics x 4 takes = 36 tracks!

i would venture to say that the guitar buss was fed through some sort of compressor, even if it was only to glue all the tracks together...but that's a minute detail. when it comes down to it, 95% of the tone will be from the player, the instrument, and the amp.
Click to expand...

Since it's been bumped anyway, let me just point out that if the OP posted a clip from 10,000 Days as an example of the sound he was after and was wondering what sort of post-production needed to be done to get him there...

...well, the producer claimed in the interview I read that he tried to do all his EQ'ing with mic placement and mic selection, and didn't actually use any EQ in the mix. I'm not sure if that's literally true or if he just limited himself to a few light tweaks here or there, but either way I suspect "10,000 Days" is one of the albums with the least post-production that's been recorded in years. :D
 
I've had a few compliments for my heavy guitar tone. I don't do anything to it except roll off some of the lows if it needs it. The work is in the tracking.
 
metalhead28 said:
I was up against 3 persistent obstacles when it came to getting a good modern sound (not that I can get it now...but I'm closer).
First one was that I wasn't recording my cab in a suitable environment. Moving it out into a bigger room, even though I was still just close mic'ing, seemed to allow me to get a much tighter sound. (I used to mic it in a large closet and I was always eq'ing the hell out of it). Second was the speakers. Once I switched from G12t-75's to Celestion vintage 30's it was like a night and day difference when it came to that sharp high end bite. (the former speakers were pretty old too)
Third for me was the mic pre. I hate to attribute anything to money spent, but when I stepped up to a higher quality mic pre it really seemed to bring the SM57 to life. The sound was much more in your face and powerful.

I also think a really high quality eq is pretty important for any final shaping of the tone. Even if you're just talking plugins. I've got a couple of good EQ plugins that sound worlds better than some of the cheaper stuff I used to use.
You may have it all covered, I'm just relaying my experiences.
Click to expand...

Sonixx said:
I agree with this 100%... right on target
Click to expand...


This is hilarious. :D (of course, only a few will know why)
 
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