Modding the Epi Valve Jr.

[ofajen]

Here's the only dilemma... I can't build a speaker cabinet to save my life. Whenever I work with wood the outcome is always "close enough, I'm not going to be doing anything with this that would require (whatever)". Does anyone know where to find a place that custom builds cabinets? I'm also a little bit curious about the speakers. The specs all have a resonant frequency note in them, does this necessarily have to be matched to the cabinet??

A couple of thoughts... You might be able to find standard cabinets to suit you, which will probably be cheaper than custom cabinets. Second, if you're wanting an open-backed cabinet, you don't have to worry so much, since the cabinet really won't have much of a resonance at all.

Cheers,

Otto

 

[ocnor]

I registered 2 weeks ago and got accepted a day later.

I registered about a month ago and never heard back from them.

 

[32-20-Blues]

I can't see why people would keep putting more and more money into an inexpensive Chinese-made amp. Two new tubes (at less than $25) makes the VJ combo an unbelieveably great sounding amp. Continually dumping more money into it is like slapping extra racing stickers on the side of your dragster.... it makes you feel good, but nobody else notices the difference.

I agree. If you want the sound of a Mesa, save up 1500 bucks. However, if you just want a solid, good sounding amplifier for recording/home playing/some performance work, throw a maximum of 200 dollars at the Epi combo.

 

[Lt. Bob]

I can't see why people would keep putting more and more money into an inexpensive Chinese-made amp. .

'cause it's fun mainly ..... to pull apart something and make major changes youself rather than paying someone to do it. Plus, it's a good way to learn about this stuff. You wouldn't be willing to tear apart a Mesa or Marshall or anything else that costs a lot but you're not as reluctant to do that with a $99 amp head.
Actually, for me, I think I'm gonna start researching towards building an amp from scratch but for a newbie .... modding an already existing amp would be a safer place to start.

 

[32-20-Blues]

Actually, for me, I think I'm gonna start researching towards building an amp from scratch but for a newbie .... modding an already existing amp would be a safer place to start.

I'd love to get into amp building.

2 years ago, 'Guitar' magazine in the UK ran a series of articles on amp building. They put together a kit (without the cab or speaker) that you got by mail order, and then they talked you through the amp design, stage by stage, for a few months. The thing was an amazing success - apparently there were a couple of thousand people in Britain & Ireland who ended up with homemade Fender Champ knock-offs. For most of them, it was their first build.

Oh yeah, the kit cost around 150 dollars, so it was fairly cost effective, too.

 

[Zaphod B]

I'd love to get into amp building.

2 years ago, 'Guitar' magazine in the UK ran a series of articles on amp building. They put together a kit (without the cab or speaker) that you got by mail order, and then they talked you through the amp design, stage by stage, for a few months. The thing was an amazing success - apparently there were a couple of thousand people in Britain & Ireland who ended up with homemade Fender Champ knock-offs. For most of them, it was their first build.

Oh yeah, the kit cost around 150 dollars, so it was fairly cost effective, too.

I'd like to do that, too.

But first I have to build my wall-of-boomboxes experiment.

 

[Buck62]

'cause it's fun mainly ..... to pull apart something and make major changes youself rather than paying someone to do it. Plus, it's a good way to learn about this stuff. You wouldn't be willing to tear apart a Mesa or Marshall or anything else that costs a lot but you're not as reluctant to do that with a $99 amp head.
Actually, for me, I think I'm gonna start researching towards building an amp from scratch but for a newbie .... modding an already existing amp would be a safer place to start.

I understand your point... to a point, that is!

I mean, you're basically paying $140 for a cabinet/housing and interior chassis and then spending anywhere from $250 to $500 for a whole bunch of mods. To me, that seems rediculous. You might as well shop around for a cabinet and chassis somehwere else and build the darned thing from scratch, if that's your intent.

When pro mechanics build a race car for the track, they don't go to a dealer and buy a brand new car and strip everything out and throw it away. They build the body themselves or they order the bare-bones chassis/frame/body and go from there. So why pay extra for a bunch of brand new parts that you're going to toss in the garbage when you buy a VJ or VJ combo???

Replacing the tubes or the speaker are are relatively cheap mods that have a direct impact on the sound, so I can understand that. But replacing EVERYTHING??? That just seems a bit extreme on a perfectly good brand new amp.

 

[Lt. Bob]

Replacing the tubes or the speaker are are relatively cheap mods that have a direct impact on the sound, so I can understand that. But replacing EVERYTHING??? That just seems a bit extreme on a perfectly good brand new amp.

And I see your point also. And I, personally wouldn't spend that much on it. But I'd probably go maybe $100 or so. And I'm mainly talking about the head too .....
But for some people, having a cab and a chassis would be the hardest part to do so it's still a decent building block to get started with.

And actually, I have so many other things to do that it's not that likely I'm even gonna do anything at all to mine ..... might not even change the tubes although I do have a big ol' box 'o' tubes so maybe. But my Epi mainly holds down a shelf in my music room since it's usually not what I'd choose to gig with although I have done so.

 

[Outlaws]

When pro mechanics build a race car for the track, they don't go to a dealer and buy a brand new car and strip everything out and throw it away.

Correct, but street racers do. And that is what most of us here are closer to in your analogy because we don't have the sponsors to send us a $250k check to build a race car. You buy a cheap one, and over time you fix it up. That way you have a car rather than spending a few years saving.

That said, I dont own a Valve Jr, but I would like one.

(and for the record I hate ricer burners.)

 

[Buck62]

Correct, but street racers do.

That's what they used to do, several years ago.

Nowadays, cars are completely run by a large bank of multiple computers connected in succession. I used to build cars years ago... from the frame up. But I wouldn't touch today's cars. It doesn't make sense to rip out a bunch of costly electronic parts that make the car run perfectly fine and get the maximum horsepower from a small engine. Years ago, a 6-banger was a dog and all 4-cylinder engines were a piece of crap in a tiny econobox. But now you can buy a 6 cylinder car that generates 300+ horsepower right from the factory. Many 4 cylinder cars now generate 200+ horsepower. The only "tweaks" that street racers do these days are a beefier computer chip and intake and exhaust mods to help the car breathe better, generating up to 10% more horsepower. After that, it's all just silly plastic, fiberglass, or carbon fiber body panels to make the car look more like a racecar.

 

[Outlaws]

The only "tweaks" that street racers do these days are a beefier computer chip and intake and exhaust mods to help the car breathe better, generating up to 10% more horsepower.

I beg to differ on that one.

After that, it's all just silly plastic, fiberglass, or carbon fiber body panels to make the car look more like a racecar.

That is true 97% of the time.

 

[Zaphod B]

The only "tweaks" that street racers do these days are a beefier computer chip and intake and exhaust mods to help the car breathe better, generating up to 10% more horsepower. After that, it's all just silly plastic, fiberglass, or carbon fiber body panels to make the car look more like a racecar.

Not true. You see lots of people installing turbos or superchargers, sometimes combined with nitro shots. This requires aftermarket chips and custom mapping in many cases.

Granted, most rice burners just have coffee can mufflers, fake turbo boost gauges, and plastic, but there is some serious performance upgrading being done.

 

[ggunn]

That's what they used to do, several years ago.

Nowadays, cars are completely run by a large bank of multiple computers connected in succession. I used to build cars years ago... from the frame up. But I wouldn't touch today's cars. It doesn't make sense to rip out a bunch of costly electronic parts that make the car run perfectly fine and get the maximum horsepower from a small engine. Years ago, a 6-banger was a dog and all 4-cylinder engines were a piece of crap in a tiny econobox. But you can find 6 cylinder cars that run 300+ horsepower right from the factory. 4 cylinder cars easily generate 200+ horsepower. The only "tweaks" that street racers do these days are a beefier computer chip and intake and exhaust mods to help the car breathe better, generating up to 10% more horsepower. After that, it's all just silly plastic, fiberglass, or carbon fiber body panels to make the car look more like a racecar.

Whatever. The problem with an an analogy is that its root it's just... an analogy. Economics has nothing to do with it; if economics were the driving force 99+% of all of us who are musicians wouldn't be. For a lot of folks, the experience of starting with a functioning amp and doing revs ad nauseum to it is an enjoyable excercise, and putting more money into it than the amp originally cost is not an issue at all. It's an educational experience as well, and well worth the cost. To them, of course; DSFDF and YMMV.

It may not be that way for you and you certainly would not be alone in that camp. But to give another, possibly more fitting analogy (though it's still one), I know a guy who bought a carcass of an old MGA for a couple of hundred bucks and has to date put about $12,000 into it with both restoration work and, um "souping up" (that term dates me, I know). I would never do that, but it's worth every penny to him.

 

[Buck62]

Ok, here's a better anaology musicians can understand.

Would you buy a $99 Squire Strat and dump $300 to $400 worth of mods into it to make it a nice player?

 

[Outlaws]

Ok, here's a better anaology musicians can understand.

Would you buy a $99 Squire Strat and dump $300 to $400 worth of mods into it to make it a nice player?

I don't know, but apparently you put a set of $25 strings on one.

That would be like what...putting Toyo tires on a Kia?

 

[Zaphod B]

Would you buy a $99 Squire Strat and dump $300 to $400
worth of mods into it to make it a nice player?

I think there are a few around here that have....

I guess it just comes down to defining the point where spending smart turns into spending stupid. If the only difference between a Squier and a Fender is the non-wood hardware, and you can get to Fender quality for less money and don't care about resale value, then it makes sense.

 

[ggunn]

Ok, here's a better anaology musicians can understand.

Would you buy a $99 Squire Strat and dump $300 to $400 worth of mods into it to make it a nice player?

Some would, maybe, but I think that you are missing the point. It's not so much the endpoint as it is the journey.

I've got an old Supro single ended 6V6 amp that I bought for 20 bucks a bunch of years ago. It quit working (actually I killed it and didn't figure out how I did that until later in the story) and got put in the attic. Later, I went back to school and got my EE degree, but they don't teach anything about tubes any more, so what I know I had to teach myself. I dragged out the old Supro, and spent many hours with books and test equipment, drawing out a schematic by hand from analyzing the circuit, figuring out what had blown up. I spent about a hundred bucks on parts, but my time as an EE is pretty pricey, so I'll bet there's a good $1000 more in it from that POV. When I powered it up and it worked, man, that's a good feeling, and I learned a helluva lot about what makes tube amps tick in the process.

Was it worth it, even though I don't even use that amp? You betcha. And that's no analogy.

 

[Buck62]

Some would, maybe, but I think that you are missing the point. It's not so much the endpoint as it is the journey.

I've got an old Supro single ended 6V6 amp that I bought for 20 bucks a bunch of years ago. It quit working (actually I killed it and didn't figure out how I did that until later in the story) and got put in the attic. Later, I went back to school and got my EE degree, but they don't teach anything about tubes any more, so what I know I had to teach myself. I dragged out the old Supro, and spent many hours with books and test equipment, drawing out a schematic by hand from analyzing the circuit, figuring out what had blown up. I spent about a hundred bucks on parts, but my time as an EE is pretty pricey, so I'll bet there's a good $1000 more in it from that POV. When I powered it up and it worked, man, that's a good feeling, and I learned a helluva lot about what makes tube amps tick in the process.

Was it worth it, even though I don't even use that amp? You betcha. And that's no analogy.

I understand THAT perfectly. That's a somewhat rare, vintage amp and you got it for a cheap price. I probably would have done the same thing.

But dumping twice as much money into a Chinese-made VJ combo than you originally paid for it is still a mystery to me!

Ok, I'm done now.... see the lower picture in my signature for the reason why.

 

[Zaphod B]

Hey, you're the one beating it!

 

[ggunn]

I understand THAT perfectly. That's a somewhat rare, vintage amp and you got it for a cheap price. I probably would have done the same thing.

But dumping twice as much money into a Chinese-made VJ combo than you originally paid for it is still a mystery to me!

Well, the vintage of the amp isn't/wasn't important, and if you consider the cost of my time, it's more like $1200 into a $20 amp. It was important in my learning process to start with something that already works or at least used to. Once again, the goal was not to produce a gigging amp, it was to learn something about how tube amps work and to get the satisfaction of fixing a broken amp.

It really shouldn't be a "mystery" to you, that sounds a little, um, judgemental, as if you think that there is something wrong with the folks who do stuff like that. It may not be what you would do, but DSFDF. Why do folks go fishing? A deep sea fishing trip can easily cost a thousand bucks when you could just go to the market and buy some fish a hell of a lot cheaper. Hell, sometimes those idiots catch fish and then just LET THEM GO! ;^)