Mixing from ground zero

N

nielphine

New member
Hi folks =)

So, I'm a singer with some experience, and a complete noob when it comes to recording and mixing - I finished my studio a couple of months ago, and have been playing around with my toys, learning how to record on different situations, settings, with/without instruments and all, and though I'm still as green as a wheat sprout can be, I've been feeling a bit more confident about taking the next step and starting to "audioshop" my sounds. So far I've been using Sonar (I've got both x1 and x2, they came with some of the equip I got), but I have no idea where to start, like - what should I cut, what should I leave, how do I get a fuller sound when the recorded one is feeble, how do I take the pressure off a nearly-blown part?

I've been lurking around for the past year or so, but still, most of what your discussions sound like sanscrit to me- looks pretty on paper, but I lack the knowledge to understand most of what's there.

Do you have any links to sources, articles, or would be kind enough as to enlighten me a bit?

Thank you =)
 
Ask specific questions about a specific situation you have, and you will begin to understand more of the language. i.e.

What do you mean take pressure off a blown part? What pressure? What part?

Also,
Do you know where your high and low pass filters are on your EQ ? Do you know how to use them ? Thats a good start.
 
Sounds like you need to keep working on your recording techniques first - capture the sound well to start out with and you will need to do less processing to make it fit into the mix.
 
I think the best thing for you would be to jump in at the deep end and just play. Record something simple (say 1 vocal track and a couple of instrumentals) and just start experimenting. What sounds like Sanscrit will suddenly start to make sense when you play with a bit of EQ, reverb, compression, etc. etc. The beauty of recording and mixing on a computer is that you can play to your heart's content and still go back to your original tracks.

I do have to agree with mjbphotos that a main thing to work on is the process of recording. It's often said (and totally true) the the best mixes come from the best recording and need the least processing.

Finally, it MIGHT be worth experimenting with something like Reaper (free to try anyhow) rather than your Sonar. I'm a Sonar user for MIDI but don't like the way it handles live tracks and move to other software for recording and mixing live stuff. Others are totally happy with Sonar for everything but the software might be part of what's holding you back.
 
I completely agree with Bobbsy. Learn by doing. Just keep playing around until it sounds good.

Other than that, the internet is full of free info. Forums, how-to videos on YouTube, online magazines. An afternoon Googling will get you more than you can handle ;)
 
You should start at the source for sure! If you have any nearly blown parts, re-record them and try to get them as close to perfect as possible. If your source (guitar) sounds "feeble" try moving the mic around and getting a better placement (making it sound better). If that's still not enough trying double tracking it meaning, play and record the part again as close as you can to the original, then maybe good around with some panning. Not to start a war but pretty much every DAW is capable of pretty much the same stuff. It just depends on what you learn. There are plenty of folk outs there using Sonar.
 
hi guys, thx for the feed back =)

and well, I'm trying my best learn it by doing it =)

Holy Google has helped me a darn lot, and I bought some 5 or 10 new books I am actually reading - much is starting to make sense, but there's this concept of "test it and whatever works, works" that I can hardly accept (long story, but I definetely have proof that it can be a recipe for disaster)

I still haven't found one video or text that makes it clear to me how to use eq to my advantage, for starters. that's something I'm fumbling with for now, one track at a time (yeah, then later they won't match together, that rule I already have in mind Xp it's everywhere!)

about those blown parts, I re-recorded some, and another one I solved just by compressing and normalizing it. sounded decent enough for the overall quality of the project.

panning is a concept I learned recently and absolutely adored.

and as a lyrical singer (meaning I do opera, chamber music and stuff of the sort), I am totally for single-perfect-takes. unfortunately, that's not contemporary pop music's reality (pop as anything played with electrical instruments and heavy mandatory amplification). I've been experimenting on my musician friends and my brother's band and a couple of other random people with a low budget and lower expectations, and it's been rewarding. I got the "modern recording techniques" by Huber and Runstein as a guide for now, pretty useful ounce of paper there...

but, as I said, I'm not using ideal material as a source (and I don't like to record myself, I get tired fast ¬¬), and that's the main reason I'm digging deeper - I know I can turn some kinds of dust into coal, if not a diamond - just don't know yet which are the tools...

soon enough I'll get there =)
 
nielphine said:
I still haven't found one video or text that makes it clear to me how to use eq to my advantage, for starters. that's something I'm fumbling with for now, one track at a time (yeah, then later they won't match together, that rule I already have in mind Xp it's everywhere!)
Click to expand...

Regarding EQ, THIS is one of the better tracts I've found to give you some starting points.

Remember that EQ is something you don't use "because it's there". You use your equaliser because there's something you're not happy with in the original recording or in how multiple tracks sit together. Perhaps a vocal sounds a bit "honky" or there's a lack of intelligibility in the lyrics...or an instrument sounds a bit harsh and edgy and stands out too much in the mix. If you're happy with the sound, you probably don't need EQ.

Anyhow, the linked tutorial gives some starting points about what changes to various frequencies can change or fix.
 
The most important thing I learned in the beginning about EQ is to try to cut first to fix a problem. If it sounds muddy, cut the mud, don't try to boost the highs.
For a while, I was only cutting and never boosting, but recently I've found that I want to boost from time to time, but like 10% only. It transformed my mixes when I first started doing that.
 
nielphine said:
I got the "modern recording techniques" by Huber and Runstein as a guide for now, pretty useful ounce of paper there...

but, as I said, I'm not using ideal material as a source (and I don't like to record myself, I get tired fast ¬¬), and that's the main reason I'm digging deeper - I know I can turn some kinds of dust into coal, if not a diamond - just don't know yet which are the tools...

soon enough I'll get there =)
Click to expand...

Excellent starting point. Helps you understand the lingo a bit better. There are tons of video tutorials that can help you better understand plugins and how they work. There are sites like lynda.com and macprovideo.com that can teach you everything you want to know about a daw for a small fee/month. Once you have some more specific questions tho, come back and I'm sure we'll be able to help you some more.
 
The biggeset game changer for me was buying a pair of decent monitor speakers. Through trial and error my speakers have taught me more than any person could teach me. Monitors help you hear "more" and you can ask more accurate questions rather than why your having trouble mixing
 
Noah Nelson said:
The biggeset game changer for me was buying a pair of decent monitor speakers. Through trial and error my speakers have taught me more than any person could teach me. Monitors help you hear "more" and you can ask more accurate questions rather than why your having trouble mixing
Click to expand...

I got a pair of mackie's MR5 :listeningmusic:

but I like to put things down in words as well...
 
The one best thing I ever did was treat my room. It's worth more than all the new, shiny equipment you can buy. An un-treated room lies to you, plai nad simple.

I'd take a treated room with cheap consumer speakers over an un-treated room with the best monitors any day.

Learn about room treatment. It's not complicated or expensive. Save your money on anything else until you treat your room.
 
RAMI said:
The one best thing I ever did was treat my room. It's worth more than all the new, shiny equipment you can buy. An un-treated room lies to you, plai nad simple.

I'd take a treated room with cheap consumer speakers over an un-treated room with the best monitors any day.

Learn about room treatment. It's not complicated or expensive. Save your money on anything else until you treat your room.
Click to expand...

oh, I built my studio from scratch with a great architect who has a degree in acoustic engineering - my room sounds as well as it can (considering it is a very small space =) ), finished it on december last year, got the equipment about 2 months later.

yes, I'm not very normal Xp
 
It's good to think in 3dimensions - where do you want to place each track left-right (panning), top-bottom (high to low frequencies e.g. hi-hats and bass) and front to back depth (which sounds in the foreground and which in the background - you can place sounds to the front of back with volume and reverb)
 
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