Mixing Bass Guitar

[7string]

I'm mixing using Guitar Tracks Pro 3. I usually work on individual tracks in Sound Forge 5.0 (if necessary) and have various plug-ins (Waves, Amplitude, GT, Cakewalk along with the ones that are built-in to SF). I'd like some advice on getting the bass guitar to sit in the mix, sound full but still be distinct. The bass guitar used is not the best, but it works, an Ibanez SR 305 DX 5-String (http://webpages.charter.net/jeffj10/ibanez_5string_bass.htm). I'm hoping that some of you will give me some good pointers to try. I don't usually put any effects on the bass track but I realize it will have to be EQ'd. What are your mixing techniques?

Also, there is a slight hiss in the bass track that I haven't been able to find the source for. And when I run it through an 8k noise reducer it helps alot but then the track's tone sounds like crapola. The hiss is not noticeable unless the song is in a quieter part and I wonder if mastering will make it stand out even more or even if it can be fixed in mastering, once I'm done with the final mix.

Thanks in advance for your help!

7

 

[scrubs]

I hear you. I have a pretty lousy bass myself, with hissy pickups and some shielding problems. At the expense of tone, I generally have to cut all frequencies above 3000-5000Hz. I generally compress the snot out of my bass track to compensate for poor technique as well. The combination of heavy compression and selective EQ ensures that each note hits with about the same intensity, which is what I'm going for. If bass was a more prominent instrument in my recordings, I'd probably have to rethink my tactics.

As for your noise problem, I would suggest starting with a good parametric EQ. Set it with a very narrow Q and either boost or cut 5-8db. Then, sweep the frequency until it either emphasizes (if you boost) or diminishes (if you cut) the hiss. Once you've found it, widen out your Q a little and diminish the depth of the cut until you've reached a compromise between tone and noise.

Also, I doubt mastering would be the best place to remove such noise. Certainly, good mastering houses have nice EQs that are capable of razor cuts, but it would be best to isolate and remove the problem from the offending track, itself, rather than have to apply an EQ cut to the entire mix.

 

[7string]

I hear you. I have a pretty lousy bass myself, with hissy pickups and some shielding problems. At the expense of tone, I generally have to cut all frequencies above 3000-5000Hz. I generally compress the snot out of my bass track to compensate for poor technique as well. The combination of heavy compression and selective EQ ensures that each note hits with about the same intensity, which is what I'm going for. If bass was a more prominent instrument in my recordings, I'd probably have to rethink my tactics.

That's the trouble. In a lot of my songs, the bass is either the only thing playing at times or just drums and bass. And running it through the 8k noise filter makes the tone suck even worse and when it's playing all alone... well, you get the picture.! Tell me more about your use of compression and selective EQ?

As for your noise problem, I would suggest starting with a good parametric EQ. Set it with a very narrow Q and either boost or cut 5-8db. Then, sweep the frequency until it either emphasizes (if you boost) or diminishes (if you cut) the hiss. Once you've found it, widen out your Q a little and diminish the depth of the cut until you've reached a compromise between tone and noise.

I'm not very good with EQ. Never have been. I wish there was a plug-in EQ that had presets like, "For the best bass tone ever click here." Same for compression. I'm new, kinda, to both. So when you say "narrow Q" and "sweep the frequency" you lose me.

Also, I doubt mastering would be the best place to remove such noise. Certainly, good mastering houses have nice EQs that are capable of razor cuts, but it would be best to isolate and remove the problem from the offending track, itself, rather than have to apply an EQ cut to the entire mix.

I knew that. I'm just to the frustration point of blowing it off and giving it to someone else to fix. Thanks for your help and suggestions! It's much appreciated!


7

 

[Rokket]

How are you tracking it? DI? Mic'ing the amp? To me the secret to getting it to sit in the mix is how you record it to begin with. Tell me that, and maybe I can help you out a bit.


That bass isn't the worst one I've seen, so maybe I can come up with a couple solutions based on how it was tracked...

 

[Dogman]

You haven't seen cheap, until you've seen my sweet Applause bass I bought 20 years ago. That is the cat's meow, or something.

Anyway, I've gotten a few good sounds out of it, and made it sound ok, even though I don't play bass too often. You should be able to get yours to sit in the mix right, with some tweaking of the eq, compression, etc...

Good luck.

 

[7string]

How are you tracking it? DI? Mic'ing the amp? To me the secret to getting it to sit in the mix is how you record it to begin with. Tell me that, and maybe I can help you out a bit.


That bass isn't the worst one I've seen, so maybe I can come up with a couple solutions based on how it was tracked...

Thanks for the replly! I'm going direct to computer with it. My situation doesn't lend itself to the use of amps right now.

 

[7string]

You haven't seen cheap, until you've seen my sweet Applause bass I bought 20 years ago. That is the cat's meow, or something.

Anyway, I've gotten a few good sounds out of it, and made it sound ok, even though I don't play bass too often. You should be able to get yours to sit in the mix right, with some tweaking of the eq, compression, etc...

Good luck.

Thanks for the reply! Therein lies the problem. I'm not real familiar with EQ and compression. The bass actually sounds pretty good to me other than the hiss. When I try to remove the hiss, THAT'S when it starts to suck. And either before or after the 'hiss' problem, I'd like to fatten it up without muddying it up.

 

[scrubs]

I'm not very good with EQ. Never have been. I wish there was a plug-in EQ that had presets like, "For the best bass tone ever click here." Same for compression. I'm new, kinda, to both. So when you say "narrow Q" and "sweep the frequency" you lose me.

Well, I'm no expert on EQ, either, but I'll try to give a basic explanation:

First off, you should already have a parametric EQ with your current software. If not, there are freebies out there to try, though they are often less accurate.

A parametric equalizer is a type of EQ that lets you selectively edit precise frequencies or frequency ranges that are adjustable. This is in contrast to a graphic equalizer, where the frequency ranges are already set by the manufacturer and cannot be changed.

Parametric EQs have 3 basic features: 1) Frequency 2) Width (Q) and 3) Depth.

The frequency parameter selects the frequency that you want to either boost or cut. Sweeping refers to moving the frequency knob back and forth until you've identified the desired frequency.

The Q selects the width of frequencies (bandwidth) surrounding your selected frequency that will be affected by the cut/boost. That is, you could cut/boost a specific frequency, or by widening the Q, could cut/boost a range of frequencies (equally on both sides of your selected frequency). The better your parametric EQ is, the more precise you can get with this feature. Q is often referred to in octaves (such as, "make a 2dB boost that is 1 octave wide at about 600 Hz). 1 octave is a doubling of frequency (such that one octave around 600 Hz would roughly be 400Hz to 800Hz -- i.e. 800 Hz is one octave higher than 400Hz).

Depth refers to the level of cut/boost and is generally expressed in dB.

So, based on that: when I said you should use a narrow Q, I meant that you are looking to reduce a noise centered around a specific frequency, so you want to be as selective as possible in the frequencies you are altering. You should make the cut deep enough that you know when the offending noise has gone away. Sweep the frequency knob up and down the spectrum until the noise goes away.

Is that more clear? If not, perhaps these will help: http://www.theprojectstudiohandbook.com/articles6.htm

 

[Rokket]

Thanks for the replly! I'm going direct to computer with it. My situation doesn't lend itself to the use of amps right now.

I think the hiss is coming from the fact that you are DI'ing into your computer. A DI box will probably fix this, or a good pre amp or mixer... It will be easier to mix after that. Then read up on the page that scrubs gave you...

 

[Rokket]

The problem is your signal to noise ratio, and the DI box will boost your signal and get rid of the hiss...

 

[Atterion]

I had a 4 string version of that bass and it had quite noisey pick-ups. Short of replacing the pick-ups and thoroughly shielding it, there isn't much chance of eliminating the hum. However some suggestions:
Be sure you are as far away from your computer monitor as possible while tracking (or any other device in your studio that may broadcast interference). Also the use of a good external noise-gate should help (You could use the Gate section of any good hardware compressor, if you have one). You could look into getting a better noise-reduction program (I've had pretty good luck with Ray-Gun, which is fairly inexpensive). Short of these suggestions, you may be forced to notch out the frequencies being affected. You should use Sound-Forge to analyse the frequency that is giving you the problem (Just analyse a portion of the track where no notes are playing, but that you can clearly hear the hiss on).

 

[7string]

I had a 4 string version of that bass and it had quite noisey pick-ups. Short of replacing the pick-ups and thoroughly shielding it, there isn't much chance of eliminating the hum. However some suggestions:
Be sure you are as far away from your computer monitor as possible while tracking (or any other device in your studio that may broadcast interference). Also the use of a good external noise-gate should help (You could use the Gate section of any good hardware compressor, if you have one). You could look into getting a better noise-reduction program (I've had pretty good luck with Ray-Gun, which is fairly inexpensive). Short of these suggestions, you may be forced to notch out the frequencies being affected. You should use Sound-Forge to analyse the frequency that is giving you the problem (Just analyse a portion of the track where no notes are playing, but that you can clearly hear the hiss on).

I analyzed the track as you suggested and found the highest peaks at about 55k. So I notched it out and it seemed to work. Haven't had a chance yet to check it in the mix but will shortly. Thanks much!

 

[7string]

Well, I'm no expert on EQ, either, but I'll try to give a basic explanation:

(Basic explanation deleted)

Is that more clear? If not, perhaps these will help: http://www.theprojectstudiohandbook.com/articles6.htm

Wow. That helps when you can read it in layman's terms. Thanks! I'll probably get around to reading those articles in the link over the next few days.

I have a bunch of EQ's in with all the other plug-ins but I click on the one that says parametric EQ in SF and it looks NOTHING like a graph. But I did find one in WAVES that helped a bunch!

Thanks again!