Mixed Tracks for Opinions?

D

dem466

New member
Im sixteen, i've been recording my bands music for the last year or so. Haven't had any proper training or learning of any sort, just self-tought myself everything i needed to know.

For our most recent track, (first one on the player), i was looking to get some feedback.

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The gear i have isn't fantastic, and i recorded/mixed/mastered this all in my room, with a pair of crappy headphones. But the gear setup i had was as follows:

-Samson tom mics, overheads and kick drum mic (Pretty cheap starter kit)
-2x Shure SM57's on the snare
-SM57 on Guitar and Bass amp
-Behringer Pro-XL Gate/Compressor

The recording interface i used was the Tascam US-1641, and the DAW i used was Cubase LE4, and it was mastered with Izotope Ozone.

Don't be put off by the fact that it sounds as if its going to be some really crappy failed recording by some kid, i've been told this was quite good for what i had and how old i was. :)
 
Very very good recording. The vocalist is golden - don't lose her.... :D The writing and playing is fabulous - for your age especially. You sound great - I can't say how much I liked this... I have no problems with the mix....
 
Everything sounds really great, especially the guitars and vocals. It sounds like you're a really tight band and you have a lot of fun playing together :) I really like your cover song choice too.

I feel the drums in all of your songs could use some work - they could be brought up in the mix and made more present. You should really bring the kick and snare up so they can guide the rest of the music and better hold the song together. It sounds like you could possibly bring the mics closer to the drums too, especially the overheads (I don't know how far away from the drums they were when recording). The cymbals seem to dissapear from the mix sometimes--changing mic position and compressing can easily deal with this.

If you wanted to post some tracks to one of your songs, maybe we could take a look at them and make some adjustments you could replicate in the future.

BTW, the guitar playing is really tight and spot-on. Good job!
 
Thanks for all the positive feedback :)

I actually, along with the overheads, used a Rhode NT-1 condenser placed about five meters away in the room, since the room is quite large for a bedroom, but doesn't have the natural acoustics to get a good reverb on it's own. It gives a sort of 'distant' effect to the drums, but sounds better than not having it in this room.

I uploaded a track with just the Drums and Bass like you suggested.. should be interesting to hear what anyone has to say

SoundClick artist: Zeke Mountain - page with MP3 music downloads
 
I agree the playing and vocals are great. The drums, while played well aren't recorded well. It sounds like they are coming from down the hall. Really muffled, and it turns the song into a mud fest. If you could post how you recorded the drums, there are lots of people on this forum that could help you figure out a better way to get them more up front and present.
 
The room i used to record the drums was about 5x10m. The snare was miked with two SM57's, one on top and one underneath. The three toms were mic'd with the Samson tom mics (again, not sure exactly what type, but pretty cheap), and another Samson for the Kick. The kick drum mic was about half into the port hole in the front drum skin.

The overheads were two Samson condensers. Can't remember exactly how far apart they were, but i used the Spaced Pair configuration. I may not have had the 3:1 rule in effect.

I think what has given this "down the hall" sound is the fact that i used a Rhode NT-1A about 5-7 meters away from the kit. The reason for this, other than the fact i heard it was a good method to use, was because without it the drums just seemed too flat, because the room isn't quite ideal for a drum room.

One problem i have always had is getting a really full kick sound, and also a thick snare sound. I find it challenging to get a really punchy kick recorded, not a treble-y sort of put sound. With the snare, i can't get a sound that isn't thin and tacky.
 
dude.. sounds really good.. i love it.. that Evenescence cover is really nice.. your singer is wonderful..

for your kick, get good condenser mic on it, and aim the condenser DIRECTLY at the sound port, or just at the center of the kick.. you want to catch the FULL sound wave hitting the mic at its hardest.. if its tilted or not on center, it can tend to get a sound that is lacking in punch..

for your snare, for that particular sound, you may want to try and run an sm57 up top, and an sm58 on the bottom, or the opposite..

PS.. and this is something alot of people skip, and it really f***s the snare sound up:

you are using 2 mics to mic the same object, and chances are, you will have phase cancellation.. do this

record 2 tracks for the snare.. top mic and bottom mic.. and invert the phase on one of them.. this should help give you a fuller sound from the snare..
 
DJYoshaBYD said:
and this is something alot of people skip, and it really f***s the snare sound up:

you are using 2 mics to mic the same object, and chances are, you will have phase cancellation.. do this

record 2 tracks for the snare.. top mic and bottom mic.. and invert the phase on one of them.. this should help give you a fuller sound from the snare..
Click to expand...

Yes, I was going to post that. Flip the phase on one of them and you'll hear the snare jump out at you in all it's glory.

I don't agree with needing a condenser on the kik, though. Some of the best kik mics aren't condensers, like the D-112, for example.
 
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RAMI said:
Yes, I was going to post that. Flip the phase on one of them and you'll hear the snare jump put at you in all it's glory.

I don't agree with needing a condenser on the kik, though. Some of the best kik mics aren't condensers, like the D-112, for example.
Click to expand...

that is true.. you dont NEED one.. that is just the sound that i go for when recording a metal or hardcore band, just because of the definition you can get out of it.. although, i have had good success with other mics, as well.. it really just depends on the sound you are going for..

but yeah.. inverting that phase does wonders.. ESPECIALLY on vocals.. i learned a few tricks regarding doubling tracks for vocals, inverting the phase, and doing some other stuff, to get some more, idunno, POW from the vocalist..
 
DJYoshaBYD said:
that is true.. you dont NEED one.. that is just the sound that i go for when recording a metal or hardcore band, just because of the definition you can get out of it.. although, i have had good success with other mics, as well.. it really just depends on the sound you are going for..

but yeah.. inverting that phase does wonders.. ESPECIALLY on vocals.. i learned a few tricks regarding doubling tracks for vocals, inverting the phase, and doing some other stuff, to get some more, idunno, POW from the vocalist..
Click to expand...

Hmm.. interesting method inverting the phase on the vocals. But if you're only using one mic to record them, how would you go about it? Is there a way to invert the phase of a track in realtime/post production in any DAWs? At the moment im using Cubase 5.
 
Hey dem466,

I am listening to "Another Night Without You", so my comments are based on that track. This is very good, for any age really. The main thing that sticks out is something many others have already pointed out on this thread...the drums and bass aren't quite up to snuff yet, especially when you compare the way they sound to the way the guitars sound, which are really up front and in your face (nice doubling and stereo spread on those, by the way). If you've got those drums direct mic'd, then I'd recommend that in addition to making sure that your phase is ok with the dual mic'd snare, that you might be able to get a more punchy, in your face drum sound by using a popular technique called parallel compression. Search Youtube videos on that technique to get an understanding of how to implement it. Also, you might try some gating and a short plate reverb on snare and/or toms to help as well...but remember, less is more!!! Play around with it and see if you can get the drums to sound much bigger - IMHO this song needs that.

I record all my bass parts through a Line 6 interface, so I am not an expert in mic'ing a bass cabinet, but it doesn't sound to me like that SM57 is doing it for you. Have you tried going directly into the Tascam with the bass and recording a track that way? I hate to say it, but I'd maybe retrack the bass part and mix the mic'd signal with some direct tone to get more punch.

The vocals are stellar. Just by virtue of having a great song and a great singer, you are 90% of the way there, and way ahead of most people, regardless of age. If you want to try some vocal sweetening, there is a neat little "trick" where you take your vocal track and copy it to two new tracks. Pan the first of those new tracks wide left, and the second one wide right. Then throw a pitch shifter on each of those panned tracks, and shift the first one down a few cents (5 - 12) and the second one up by the same amount. Throw a reverb on each of those panned tracks and set the mix to 100% wet and 0% dry. Then zoom in on the tracks and nudge one just a touch earlier than the original vocal and one just a touch later than the original. You can then mix those two tracks in with the original vocal track to taste. Generally, less is more, so you want it so that you can't really hear it, but you miss it when it's gone. What I love about that particular "effect" is that it doesn't muddy up your vocal with the reverb/chorus since the verb is panned out wide away from the source. Give it a try, I think it will sound great on her voice.

Keep up the good work!

Best Regards,

Dave DeWhitt
SoundClick artist: Dave DeWhitt - page with MP3 music downloads
 
dem466 said:
The room i used to record the drums was about 5x10m. The snare was miked with two SM57's, one on top and one underneath. The three toms were mic'd with the Samson tom mics (again, not sure exactly what type, but pretty cheap), and another Samson for the Kick. The kick drum mic was about half into the port hole in the front drum skin.

The overheads were two Samson condensers. Can't remember exactly how far apart they were, but i used the Spaced Pair configuration. I may not have had the 3:1 rule in effect.

I think what has given this "down the hall" sound is the fact that i used a Rhode NT-1A about 5-7 meters away from the kit. The reason for this, other than the fact i heard it was a good method to use, was because without it the drums just seemed too flat, because the room isn't quite ideal for a drum room.

One problem i have always had is getting a really full kick sound, and also a thick snare sound. I find it challenging to get a really punchy kick recorded, not a treble-y sort of put sound. With the snare, i can't get a sound that isn't thin and tacky.
Click to expand...
Some good advice above. I'd also turn that Rode mic track way down in the mix. 5-7 meters away, holy cow, that is down the hall.
 
dewhitt said:
Hey dem466,

I am listening to "Another Night Without You", so my comments are based on that track. This is very good, for any age really. The main thing that sticks out is something many others have already pointed out on this thread...the drums and bass aren't quite up to snuff yet, especially when you compare the way they sound to the way the guitars sound, which are really up front and in your face (nice doubling and stereo spread on those, by the way). If you've got those drums direct mic'd, then I'd recommend that in addition to making sure that your phase is ok with the dual mic'd snare, that you might be able to get a more punchy, in your face drum sound by using a popular technique called parallel compression. Search Youtube videos on that technique to get an understanding of how to implement it. Also, you might try some gating and a short plate reverb on snare and/or toms to help as well...but remember, less is more!!! Play around with it and see if you can get the drums to sound much bigger - IMHO this song needs that.

I record all my bass parts through a Line 6 interface, so I am not an expert in mic'ing a bass cabinet, but it doesn't sound to me like that SM57 is doing it for you. Have you tried going directly into the Tascam with the bass and recording a track that way? I hate to say it, but I'd maybe retrack the bass part and mix the mic'd signal with some direct tone to get more punch.

The vocals are stellar. Just by virtue of having a great song and a great singer, you are 90% of the way there, and way ahead of most people, regardless of age. If you want to try some vocal sweetening, there is a neat little "trick" where you take your vocal track and copy it to two new tracks. Pan the first of those new tracks wide left, and the second one wide right. Then throw a pitch shifter on each of those panned tracks, and shift the first one down a few cents (5 - 12) and the second one up by the same amount. Throw a reverb on each of those panned tracks and set the mix to 100% wet and 0% dry. Then zoom in on the tracks and nudge one just a touch earlier than the original vocal and one just a touch later than the original. You can then mix those two tracks in with the original vocal track to taste. Generally, less is more, so you want it so that you can't really hear it, but you miss it when it's gone. What I love about that particular "effect" is that it doesn't muddy up your vocal with the reverb/chorus since the verb is panned out wide away from the source. Give it a try, I think it will sound great on her voice.

Keep up the good work!

Best Regards,

Dave DeWhitt
SoundClick artist: Dave DeWhitt - page with MP3 music downloads
Click to expand...

Thanks for all that advice there, ill definitely try that.
 
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