minimizing background noise

[Cabbit]

Hello,

I'm a new member of this forum and though I have extensive experiance with home recording, however, until recently, I've been completely self-taught ( trial and error) and have worked with a small collection of equipment (in particular: an obsolete 8-track digital recorder, generic dynamic vocal mics, and a mixer which, I found, I was better off NOT using) SoI may, at times, actually turn out to know VERY little about certain aspects of recording.

That said I'll ask my question:

Recently, I bought my first set of compressor microphones, it was an ADK set, and though I don't remember off the top of my head EXACTLY which microphones where included I remember that it was a set of:

1 Large Diaphram Condensor Microphone
2 Small Diaphram Condensor Microphones

As well as:
1 Shock mount
1 Pop filter

Now, using the small diaphram diaphram condensor microphones has really worked well for recording drums and bells and I look forward to trying them out with some other percusive things too, but that's not really relavent to my question.

What IS relavent to my question is:
The large diaphram condensor microphone works pretty well for vocals except that it picks up an ENORMOUS amount of background noise.

Now I've found that using a high-pass filter around 1500 hertz decreases significantly this problem and I can get away with doing that, at least for a vocal recording without overdubs, while no-one else is doing anything somewhat noisy downstairs (such as eating... my initial attempt at recording picked up my cousin eating in an adjecent room almost louder than my vocals... but when I took off the headphones I could barely hear her).

One drawback to this is that it limits the timing of when I can record and the other is that the effect of cutting out all that low-range stuff is that I sound like a singer from one of those when whiny pop-punk/emo bands that have been getting a lot of radio play recently.

So basically want to find another way to cut down on background noise.

Here is some info on what other gear I'm using:

1)A home PC
2)The open source recording program called "Audacity" (which for those not capable of actually programming anything themselves just means that it is possible to obtain for FREE ... and is, I might, pretty much as versatile as anything you might actually purchase... and occasionally MORE versatile)
3)A Soundcraft "Compact 4" mixer
4)The afore-mentioned shock mount and pop filter

And my first attempt was made in my mom's living room (which is where my band has rehearsed for the past four years, since my mom lives in the middle of nowhere and doesn't mind us playing) Back when I was using strictly dynamic microphones, I found that the complete lack of soundproofing had very little effect on my recordings.

Now I suppose I have the OPTION of recording somewhere else in that house, but I don't LIKE that becuase that means I'll have to move my recording set up whenever I'm recording something BESIDES vocals, but I guess I could try it if that will actually make a big change in how much Background noise I get.

Since I'm asking this question anyway, here are some others that I'm wondering about:

1)How far away from the microphone should I place the pop filter? Does this very per sitation? (in particular ... does this very based off how far I stand from the microphone and whether it is a condensor or dynamic microphone)

2)How loud does a sound source have to be before I risk damaging a standard dynamic microphone (like a Shure PG58) ... specifically: am I risking damaging these microphones by placing them right on top (almost, anyway) of my snare drum and/or right in front of my (guitar amp's) cabinet (when the 50-Watt head is set at about 4)? (experiance seems to say 'no' but I'm still a little bit worried after reading the FAQ that seems to indicate that dynamic microphones are ALSO susceptible to damage from overly loud sound exposure)

3)What would be the best way to record an instrument like trumpet with a condensor microphone without damaging the microphone (how far should I keep the trumpet from the microphone and should I use the pop filter?)

4)Has anyone tried combining the use of a condensor microphone and a dynamic microphone simultanously to record vocals? If so, how would you recommend positioning the microphones?

Two last notes:

My current financial situation means that I can't really spend a signifacant (say, more than $50) on new stuff in the near future, so solutions that involve me buying stuff won't really help me (although posting them ANYWAY might help other people who read this who CAN afford to buy expensive new stuff)

Also, I'm not at my mom's house now (where the majority of my recording equipment will continue to reside for the concievable future, considering that I live in an apartment), and will not be able to return there for another 2-3 weeks, so while I would appreciate any suggestions, I won't be able to immediatly try them. Actually, if I COULD immediatly expirement with these types of things, I would probably be doing that instead of asking other people for help. But I can't... so please help.

 

[dgatwood]

What IS relavent to my question is:
The large diaphram condensor microphone works pretty well for vocals except that it picks up an ENORMOUS amount of background noise.

That's the nature of the beast, I'm afraid.... There are four ways to improve things:

1. Turn a closet into a recording booth.
2. Move closer to the mic to improve your recording environment's natural signal-to-noise ratio....
3. Choose a condenser with a tighter polar pattern. (This has other disadvantages, though, so use sparingly.)
4. Don't use a condenser for vocals.

1)How far away from the microphone should I place the pop filter? Does this very per sitation? (in particular ... does this very based off how far I stand from the microphone and whether it is a condensor or dynamic microphone)

Varies according to the volume of the singer, the mic's sensitivity, the mic's polar pattern, the amount of presence boost you're trying to get (the closer you get, the more certain frequencies are emphasized), etc. Experiment.

2)How loud does a sound source have to be before I risk damaging a standard dynamic microphone (like a Shure PG58) ... specifically: am I risking damaging these microphones by placing them right on top (almost, anyway) of my snare drum and/or right in front of my (guitar amp's) cabinet (when the 50-Watt head is set at about 4)? (experiance seems to say 'no' but I'm still a little bit worried after reading the FAQ that seems to indicate that dynamic microphones are ALSO susceptible to damage from overly loud sound exposure)

Are they producing severely distorted sound when you hit the drum? If not, probably not.

3)What would be the best way to record an instrument like trumpet with a condensor microphone without damaging the microphone (how far should I keep the trumpet from the microphone and should I use the pop filter?)

Off axis a bit. And no, pop filters are to reduce plosives for vocals. If you were playing a mouthpiece directly into the mic, maybe, but....

4)Has anyone tried combining the use of a condensor microphone and a dynamic microphone simultanously to record vocals? If so, how would you recommend positioning the microphones?

Just don't. Pick one.

My advice based on your price point: build a portable vocal booth. Take a cardboard refrigerator box (or something else big enough to stand in), cover it with acoustic foam panels on the inside. Fold it up when not in use. Buy about five or six of these.

http://store.yahoo.com/yhst-3455591325931/bt2.html

Fasten them on with velcro (available in rolls at your nearest Home Depot, Lowes, Wal-Mart, or whatever) so that you can easily remove the panels and reuse them elsewhere if desired.

For folks with more money to spend, ribbons rule. Sorry, just had to say it.

 

[Cabbit]

Thanks for the advice.

There's a closet that I could probably convert to a vocals booth, but I'll try out the portable solution first.

And if that doesn't work I'll just go back to the tried and true method of using dynamic microphones.

 

[MessianicDreams]

in regards to background noise, as dgatwood mentioned try and get the best signal to noise ratio, and then use a gate to gate out any background noise which can be heard in between sung phrases. by applying a fair amount of make-up gain, you should be able to expand your useable dynamic range. also what polar pattern do you have your mic set on? if it is in omni- or figure-of-8, then try changing it to cardiod.

most dynamic mics (like your PG58) can stand very high SPLs. if you place it right next to a snare, there should be no problems at all. if you can hear it distorting yet your meters aren't clipping, then you know there's a problem.

i would only use 2 mics on a voice for specific reasons, and as a general rule i only use 1. if you do use 2 mics, remember to check for phase issues (listen in mono, flip the phase of one of the mics and listen to the difference it makes, if it all). you might what to perhaps try something like placing the capacitor as you normally would and then point the dynamic more towards the throat/nose/cheek. just remember to experiment with this, and if you don't find anything satisfactory then remove the dynamic!

regarding the mic'ing of brass instruments, i wouldn't go straight away for an off-axis position. try having someone move it around while you listen until you hit that spot that you like. moving off-axis can also be a good thing to do when recording vocals. remember for a directional mic as you move off axis the sound will begin to be coloured by the mic (think of a mic polar pattern and how certain frequencies will drop off as you move further off axis..)

happy hunting

MD