Microphone change

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gospel

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My gospel group just upgraded our mics from Shure SM 58s to Shure Beta 58s. The mics are so much different that, I don't know if it was the eq settings or what, but we didn't really didn't sing as good with the betas as we did with the SM mics. We pride ourselves with having tight 3 part harmony which seemed hard to do with the betas. Maybe it is because we aren't used to them or that I am going to have to change eq settings drastically to get a good sound. Does anyone have any advice (except buy new mics)?
 
Hi Gospel,
I'm here lurking to learn about recording,but I feel qualified to comment on this.
The 58A differs from the regular SM-58 in two ways.The neo-dymium magnet gives a bit more gain (volume) before feedback.In other words,it has more output than the regular 58 at the same setttings.
It also gives a bit more of a "presence" boost."Presence" is old-timer talk for high end.Shure vocal mics like the SM-58 do this anyway.It's one of the reasons they're so popular--in a murky,muddy live sound environment where the acoustics are poor,the vocals cut through,and are crisp and clear.
The Beta 58 just does it a bit more.
You don't give any specifics about your eq-ing,but I'd hazard a guess that in the same sound environment,you could turn the volume down a little,and possibly the highs just a hair,and you'd get more what you're used to with the regular 58's.This in itself may fix your problem.
Since they have higher output ,the way the mics are "worked" distance-wise probably added to your problem.If each singer is used to singing (for instance) 3 inches from the mic for this part,five inches away for that louder part,et cetera,this would throw your blend off until each singer learned how the new mics react.
I would turn down the gain a little."A-B" a new and old 58 before a rehearsal (or just on your own with the PA),and figure where to set the volumes and eq.And then let the singers get used to working them and blending.
I could definitely see where your blend could be thrown off without adjusting the PA and getting used to the new mics.
I do believe it's worth the trouble.I've been singing for 30-some years,and in my opinion the Beta 58 is a noticeably better sounding mic for live gigs,especially in places that are poor acoustically.
On the other hand,if y'all are singing in the same 2 or 3 places regularly and the acoustics are good,and the singers hate the new mics,then sell 'em on Ebay. :) Nothing wrong with a regular 58 or 57 either.
By the way,I prefer the 57 over the Beta for recording.
 
Dave Brophy said:
...snip
The neo-dymium magnet gives a bit more gain (volume) before feedback.In other words,it has more output than the regular 58 at the same setttings.
snip...

Hi Dave!

Welcome to Home Recording dot com - Pardon my ignorance, but how does this relate to "gain-before-feedback" ? I would have thought that if the mic had more output, it would feedback earlier, i.e. with less gain... unless there was something else happening - like, for instance a change in the polar response pattern...

Sorry, it's early in the morning, I've not had my coffee yet, and that could be why I'm confused.

- Wil
 
Dave,
As for eqs, I had the main and monitor eqs set exactly the same as I did with the SMs (It seemed I had to boost the highs with the SMs to not have a muffled sound). On the channel eqs I backed off a little on the treble. I appreciate your comments.
 
Wil,
That "gain before feedback" is a buzz-phrase that I think both Shure and Electrovoice claim on their neo-dymium mics like the Beta 58 and the EV N/D 757 mics.
And you're right,a higher output by itself wouldn't do it.I forget what they claim does.The Beta 58A is Supercardioid-another difference from the cardioid regular 58--so perhaps that's it.The idea being that a narrower polar pattern gives you a lesser chance of feedback from stage monitors.
Thanks for the welcome,btw.
-Dave
 
Ah! OK - that would make sense - providing of course, that the monitors aren't directly in line with the back of the mic, since the patterns of hyper-cardioids tend to have a very narrow lobe which sticks out the back of the mic - ie. at 180 degrees to its main axis, so the trick would be to make sure the monitors are off-axis w.r.t the mics

- Wil
 
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