Mic pre first or new soundcard?

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Ivan314

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As of right now I have a very basic setup: Cakewalk software, stock soundcard (ESS Aleggro), Compaq Presario with PIII and plenty of memory, Shure SM58 mic.

I know I need better sound card, mic pre (preferably with some compression capabilities), and good quaity monitor speakers eventually. I also would like to stop having to crawl behind my PC every time I want to change from mic to guitar.

My question is which do I get first the soundcard or mic pre? And will the mic pre solve my input access problem (how does it interface wth PC and audio equipment ie mic and guitar)? If the mic pre does solve the access problem I will probably get it first. I have done research on the topics, but haven't gotten a firm answer in my head. :confused:
 
Ivan314 said:


My question is which do I get first the soundcard or mic pre? And will the mic pre solve my input access problem (how does it interface wth PC and audio equipment ie mic and guitar)? If the mic pre does solve the access problem I will probably get it first. I have done research on the topics, but haven't gotten a firm answer in my head. :confused:
Click to expand...

You will want both eventually. But, yes a preamp will *sorta* solve your access problem. You will need some cable. Get a 1/8" to 2 mono 1/4" female patch cord, and you won't have to crawl behind your PC. With this cable I suppose you could avoid the preamp, but you don't want to. A preamp into the line in on your soundcard will improve your recordings considerably.

So:

Microphone>preamp>line-in on Allegro.

The 1/8" stereo male to two(left and right) 1/4" female is one cabling option.
 
As King Newbie and Lord of Cheapskates, I will tell you that a preamp, at this point, will make WAYYYYY more of a difference...are you going straight from the mic to the soundcard now?.....that must sound pretty weak....I started with a sm57 oing thru the pres on my old 4 track or thru my J-station and the sound was pretty decent but nothing compared to when I started using my Delta DMP2 pre-amp.....

as far as guitar goes, will you be mic'ing an amp or going direct....either way you will go into the preamp with either the mic or guitar and from the preamps outputs to the soundcard.....

what kind of budget do you have (if any)?...we may be able to steer you in the rightdirection....
 
For $199 at GC you could get the Seasound Soloist. Then you'd have mic and instrument pres and a 24/96 PCI card. These sold originally for $399, but Seasound is going out of business.
 
Seasound Going FAST!!!!!

I just bought the last Seasound Solo EX (the step up from the Soloist) in St. Louis, So if you're ready to buy, do it now!

I haven't hooked mine up yet or anything and I'm also a newbie, so I only know what I've heard as far as the outstanding quality of Seasound. But if you're comfortable with all the endorsements from this BBS, then act soon, 'cuz they're going fast.


Rock On---Stinky


P.S. I believe the Soloist has ONE pre and two other inputs for a total of three. The Solo EX has two pres and two other inputs for a total of four. The Solo EX is marked down to $299 from the previous $499 street price ($850 List).
 
Checked out the audio buddy

I think the M-Audio Buddy might be a good option for me. I was looking at (salivating over) the Delta Omni Studio to upgrade soundcard at the same time. But in that price range it would take a little time to be able to get it. I don't really need a lot of inputs, I only record one thing at a time.

And from what I've read at other posts I might be off better spending a little more money on individual items (sound card, compressor, etc) than going for combo eq.

What is phantom? Comparable models to audio buddy (Art, DBX pre mics) advertise "tube based", does that mean anything in practicality?
 
Howdy,

As I understand it phantom power relates to the power inherent in pre-amps. A passive source like a microphone goes into the pre-amp and the signal is conditioned and amplified for recording by the unit. When you have a tube in the pre-amp (like in the ART Tube MP) that supposedly gives some tube coloring/warmup to the signal which would otherwise be completely digital.

When you are using digital recording, you lose some of the warmth you get from analog tape, etc. Using tubes is an attempt to make your signal sound a bit more organic and less harsh. A possible analogy would be the difference between seeing something filmed vs. videotaped. The video might be "clearer," but the film has a more "natural" look and deeper color saturation.

There are a lot of gizmos out there which are attempting to emulate "tube tone" along every part of the signal chain. I've got a few pedals (Dan Electro Daddy-0 and Fab Tone) which try to emulate tube tone. I guess they sort of work, but it doesn't quite feel the same.

Anyhoo, I'm really just getting started with all this and I'm not sure if I've answered your questions, but I hope I've helped.


Rock On--Stinky
 
Thanks Stinky for the input. Have you ever compared the tube based sound vs the audio buddy? I wonder if its worth the extra $20?
 
I haven't seen the Audio Buddy before. I see it's listed in MF for $99 and has two pre-amps, but they don't have any product info. on it. I looked at it at the Midiman website and it sounds good, but I've never heard any feedback about it.

Lots and lots of people swear by the Art Tube MP preamplifier and phanton power unit. I haven't personally used one, but have friends with project studios who have. With digital recording, alot of people emphasize the need to get some tube tone in the mix somewhere.

The Audio Buddy does give you TWO pres for the same price as the Art, but no tube and it's so brand new, I doubt you're gonna get much feedback. A lot of people are very picky about the tone, noise and color of their pres and the Art products are supposedly quite a bargain.

I'm currently in the process of putting together a pc-based project studio and am learning as I go, but I know enough to know it can be complicated. I'm wondering if, as a starting point, you wouldn't be better off using some of the recording software's plug-ins and learning how they affect your mixes BEFORE you go out and buy a bunch of outboard gear like compressors, etc. Those software effects are bundled with your recording program and I'll bet you can learn A LOT by experimenting with their potential.

What are you currently recording on? I'm getting ready to make the move from my cassette-based four track machine. I've done a lot of learning with it, but am definitely ready for a step up.

I know I've learned a ton by recording, continually asking questions on this BBS and reading.



Rock On-Stinky



P.S. Check out Tape Op and Home Recording. They're both really great magazines and are much easier to read than other recording magazines (and a lot more fun).
 
I'm using Cakewalk Guitar Studio 2, and just got Band in a Box for compostion help / backing tracks. I have explored all the plug ins, they are very tasty. But the input from my mic is to weak. Mics are passive, they don't have a real electric push behind them that you need by themselves.

If I can find one in stock locally, I'm going out tomorrow and getting the Art MP Studio. Its a step up from the base MP model. It has a couple of features I really like (mostly the Output Protection Limiter - so it doesn't fry my sound card), and is only $30 more. I have read that it is worth the extra $$ quality wise.

Four track may be a good option for you, but I'm hooked on PC recording. It has endless capabilities...that is if you have endless money to shell out.
 
Ivan,
I just got a DBX mini pre last week,and was very suprised how good it sounds.

Very clean for a cheap tube pre,$99 at guitar center.

I had both the art tube mp and the other unit with both the pre and compressor and returned them both,way to noisy.

I am recording acoustic guitar through a good large condenser mic,and the sound is very clean.

It would definatly solve your input problem,it has-xlr in,trs(1/4")
balanced or unbalanced in,xlr out,tr(1/4") unbalanced out and can also accept a guitar in the trs input.

All you would have to do is connect the tr out to either a cable with 1/4 inch on one end and 1/8 inch on the other or just use a quater inch cable and an adaptor for the computer end.

All this having been said,if you do go for the pre option you are still going to get plenty of noise from the sound card,just the nature of the beast,the best bet is to get a seperate ad/da converter and go into the computer digitally.

Im not a computer guru,but iv'e tried it both ways and opted for a 4 track setup until I can afford a good digital one.

If you look around on the other boards here,you can find all the information you could want on optimizing your setup.

Hope this helps,
Pete
 
Thanks Pete. I've heard that about the Art models (noisy), in fact I emailed their tech support addressing that very issue. I will have to check out the DBX model also. I have the description, but haven't heard much about it on message boards until your comment. I am going out today to hopefully compare the two, I'm not sure if you can do that in the store.

Your right about this site, tons of great info out there.....
 
Some peoples ears who I trust think highly of the Art...."noisy" isnt one of the words they use to describe it either....

Havent had a chance to check out the new DBX unit....of course they came out with this to compete with the Art Tube MP....curious to see how it stands up...
 
Gidge,
I wasn't trying to put anybodys gear down,just relating what happened to me.

If I offended anyone I apologize.

Peace,
Pete
 
Muze,

No offense taken , dude....takes more than that to rattle my cage....just wanted to give another view.....

Im still itching to hear that DBX myself......

Peace, love, and soooooooooooouuuuuulllllllllll.................
 
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