mic placement on 1x12 combo amp (guitar)

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powpowmeow

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only have 2 inputs to work with
have 2 sm57's and an audio technica at4050

right now, the close mic is pointed pretty much at the edge of the speaker, which is the best "primary" mic sound i have found so far (see below)

snip

with the close mic at that angle, whats the best way to place another mic?

my preamp has inversion switches so that is an option

thanks everybody!
 
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The rule of thumb is, closer to the edge more bottom, closer to the centre more tops, so I start about halfway.

This is how I miked my guitarists amp when we recorded the last album, all close kicked as we played the tracks live, guitar, bass and drums.

There is a fathead ribbon, a sennheiser ME20 omni pencil condenser and a Sennheiser 421. The 421 sometimes was swapped out to a sm57 depending on the track. All mics going to separate tracks on the recording.

Alan.

amp miced.webp
 
witzendoz said:
The rule of thumb is, closer to the edge more bottom, closer to the centre more tops, so I start about halfway.

This is how I miked my guitarists amp when we recorded the last album, all close kicked as we played the tracks live, guitar, bass and drums.

There is a fathead ribbon, a sennheiser ME20 omni pencil condenser and a Sennheiser 421. The 421 sometimes was swapped out to a sm57 depending on the track. All mics going to separate tracks on the recording.

Alan.

View attachment 86051
Click to expand...

You use a pop filter recording a guitar cab?

You definitely do something about that big blue slimeworm in your studio! :eek:
 
You got a midget singing in that cab? What's with the pop filter?
 
powpowmeow said:
only have 2 inputs to work with
have 2 sm57's and an audio technica at4050

right now, the close mic is pointed pretty much at the edge of the speaker, which is the best "primary" mic sound i have found so far (see below)

View image: best mic spot


with the close mic at that angle, whats the best way to place another mic?

my preamp has inversion switches so that is an option

thanks everybody!
Click to expand...

What makes you think you need that second mic? If you can't do good with one, you'll just make a mess with two.
 
If you are using two sm57s then I'd have the second one around 2-3 foot away as a distant mic, obviously make sure they are in phase though...easier said than done
 
Btyre2013 said:
If you are using two sm57s then I'd have the second one around 2-3 foot away as a distant mic, obviously make sure they are in phase though...easier said than done
Click to expand...

They won't be in phase if one is 2-3 feet away.
 
Btyre2013 said:
then tell me where the exact spot is to the millimetre that they are in phase, I need to know this info
Click to expand...

The exact spot will be less than a millimeter if you want the two mics perfectly in phase.
 
powpowmeow said:
whats the best way to place another mic?
Click to expand...

Unplugged and sitting on a shelf.

Seriously, get a good sound coming out of the amp first. If you can get that, then one 57 will work just fine for you.
 
Btyre2013 said:
then tell me where the exact spot is to the millimetre that they are in phase, I need to know this info
Click to expand...

They will be totally in phase at all frequencies when they are at the same distance and direction from the speaker. For mics that are different distances from the source you might experiment with time aligning them.
 
mjbphotos said:
You use a pop filter recording a guitar cab?

You definitely do something about that big blue slimeworm in your studio! :eek:
Click to expand...

The pop filter is to reduce the air blast on the ribbon mic, I have modded the screen mesh on my ribbons so they are not so restrictive, but with the volume of the cab there was some air pop problems with some low notes in this case.

The reasons for using multi mics is that I can use 1 or more mics later to get a guitar tone to suit the song, as we tracked 10 songs over 3 days and I was also playing live (bass) while tracking.

Oh and we had the midget backing singers in the cab to save room.
Alan
 
TripleM said:
Unplugged and sitting on a shelf.

Seriously, get a good sound coming out of the amp first. If you can get that, then one 57 will work just fine for you.
Click to expand...

yeah, i did that.

this isnt a thread about "how do i get a good guitar tone" it's a thread about "where do i put a second mic so it sounds good with the first mic i placed perfectly and HERE IS THE PHOTO"
interesting attitude some of you guys have over here.
 
I was trying to be a little humorous. I wasn't going for attitude. People around here who know me, know that I'm not an "attitude" guy. So I'm sorry if I seemed that way. It wasn't intentional.

So to respond to your response - if you have a great sound coming out of the amp, a single 57 is really all you need. Hit record.
 
FWIW - I used to place one mic closer to the center of the speaker and another further out towards the speaker edge. Both mics would be close to the grill. I would consider the first mic to be my "main" mic. The other mic was my secondary mic that I would use to add/remove low end. When setting up, I would do a couple of seconds of test recording and then expand out the wave forms in my DAW and look at peaks. I would then move the secondary mic closer or further back from the grill depending on how closely the wave forms matched. I'd repeat the process until the peaks lined up. I could get the peaks to line up perfectly. I never heard any phase issues with this approach either.

I eventually stopped this process because I didn't think it helped me. I moved over to the one-mic-camp.
 
powpowmeow said:
yeah, i did that.

this isnt a thread about "how do i get a good guitar tone" it's a thread about "where do i put a second mic so it sounds good with the first mic i placed perfectly and HERE IS THE PHOTO"
interesting attitude some of you guys have over here.
Click to expand...
I think I can get you steered in the right direction here then.

First ignore (with all due respect ) stuff like this (..the being 'in phase’ part)
Btyre2013 said:
If you are using two sm57s then I'd have the second one around 2-3 foot away as a distant mic, obviously make sure they are in phase though...easier said than done
Click to expand...

To cover again as it's a useful bit to get driven home- The only place where ‘two’ can be 'in phase’, is equal distance/equal time.

So the bottom line is for any 'second mic’ your choices are any position where your out of phase at some frequencies (in phase at others) tone -- make for pleasant useful combinations when blended together.

You can also have the case were one position makes for a very good tone picture (on its own), but the combined times don’t. Then the option is to adjust their relative times so they do work blended.

Another bit that might be helpful is the -9 dB rule;
The combined phase effect of any second signal attenuated by about that much are no longer oblivious- therefore making them not a problem.

In these ‘near + far mic’ questions this is often mistakenly applied / referred to / AKA as “The 3:1 Rule”.

Now you know what's there to play with.. it's wide open!
 
mixsit said:
Another bit that might be helpful is the -9 dB rule; / AKA as “The 3:1 Rule”.
Click to expand...

But isn't -9dB 3:1 quieter?? Just making a little light humor. I know the 3:1 rule refers to distance and not volume.

Back to the original question:
"with the close mic at that angle, whats the best way to place another mic?"
Click to expand...
Wouldn't it be easier to just move the 2nd mic around until you found a spot that works?? Sometimes the distractions from the internet makes a task more difficult than it needs to be. Go experiment and find out for yourself where the 2nd mic should go.
 
Chili said:
.. Just making a little light humor. I know the 3:1 rule refers to distance and not volume..
Click to expand...

Well, 'distance' to get the volume (..attenuation) But it is exactly all about the attenuation. And never about predicting some resultant phase qualities (or tone result).. which is where it gets miss applied so often.
 
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