Messing the mix up on purpose

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moresound

Loud Sun Studios
Just a thought to think a little outside of the box.

We all talk about what not to do while recording everything from drums to dulcimers for a pure capture of the instrument, then onto mixing them precisely but what if .....

What would one do to make a mix or a track of a mix to sound hideous or just not right - on purpose - as an affect or a means to an end for a finished project?
 
Have a listen to Portishead, I am not saying it's not right, but they do not follow convention. When I heard them for the first time it was like a reset button was pushed in my head reminding me that there are no rules. It is so refreshing to listen to mixes that are not the nice just right commercial mixes that we get bombed with on commercial radio.

Alan.
 
If I was to intentionally ruin a mix, I would sing.

I use my voice to stress-test equipment :D

Paul
 
I was thinking about something like this earlier. Not so much deliberately 'ruining' a mix, but how the whole concept of recording is to preserve an illusion. Few people have bands playing in their house. No one has a band playing in their car/van/lorry/bike/truck. So in reality, although we get 'used to' certain ways, that is to our loss sometimes because the bottom line will always be "do you like the song ?". How it's mixed and what one thinks of it is purely down to peoples' preferences and dislikes.
 
grimtraveller said:
I was thinking about something like this earlier. Not so much deliberately 'ruining' a mix, but how the whole concept of recording is to preserve an illusion. Few people have bands playing in their house. No one has a band playing in their car/van/lorry/bike/truck. So in reality, although we get 'used to' certain ways, that is to our loss sometimes because the bottom line will always be "do you like the song ?". How it's mixed and what one thinks of it is purely down to peoples' preferences and dislikes.
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Really! someone miss use or creativity, how ever you would want to look at it, of an effect or processor would be the beauty or ugliness in the eye (ear) of the beholder.
 
Well, yes. Back in the "old days" {ie 60s, 70s, even the 80s} there was an experimental bent that enabled artists and engineers to routinely do things that, today, would be frowned upon in the quest for clean perfection. You know, putting a sax through a fuzz box, a violin through a wah~wah pedal, doubling the snare with a tray full of cutlery, overloading acoustic guitars etc.....Sometimes it didn't serve the song and the experiment became more important which gave it all a bad name.
 
grimtraveller said:
Well, yes. Back in the "old days" {ie 60s, 70s, even the 80s} there was an experimental bent that enabled artists and engineers to routinely do things that, today, would be frowned upon in the quest for clean perfection. You know, putting a sax through a fuzz box, a violin through a wah~wah pedal, doubling the snare with a tray full of cutlery, overloading acoustic guitars etc.....Sometimes it didn't serve the song and the experiment became more important which gave it all a bad name.
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Now a days it's if a song has something just the bit out of place BANG it's a hit and everyone and their brother are in lock step recreating the sound and pumping out their version of their song with the same or very close artifact.

An example that I could throw out here ( and believe me they are not the first or pioneered this effect) would be Foster the people's - Pumped up kicks. It's got low-fi distorted vocals on the verses and heavy verb on the vocals chorus.
You turn on the radio now and that formula is present with more than a few other songs being played.
 
moresound said:
An example that I could throw out here ( and believe me they are not the first or pioneered this effect) would be Foster the people's - Pumped up kicks. It's got low-fi distorted vocals on the verses and heavy verb on the vocals chorus.
You turn on the radio now and that formula is present with more than a few other songs being played.
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Dang it I was just about to mention that song! Now I have nothing to add to the conversation.... :D
 
guitaristic said:
Dang it I was just about to mention that song! Now I have nothing to add to the conversation.... :D
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I have been doing live sound for 3 or 4 indy bands that have been doing this effect live for some time now (using a beta58 for the clean vocal sound and a green bullet or equivalent for dirty) it's been the craze for some time now --- Foster the People just got lucky enough to have a snappy hook that caught on and on to a singed contract with a major label.

That's show biz. ;)
 
witzendoz said:
Have a listen to Portishead, I am not saying it's not right, but they do not follow convention. When I heard them for the first time it was like a reset button was pushed in my head reminding me that there are no rules. It is so refreshing to listen to mixes that are not the nice just right commercial mixes that we get bombed with on commercial radio.

Alan.
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I think their stuff is artistically *different* than your typical MOR Pop, but I wouldn't say it's really a "messed up mix".
They kinda remind me of Supreme Beings of Leisure, though I think SBL sound better (more polished) musically and technically, while still sounding *different*.





 
miroslav said:
I think their stuff is artistically *different* than your typical MOR Pop, but I wouldn't say it's really a "messed up mix".
They kinda remind me of Supreme Beings of Leisure, though I think SBL sound better (more polished) musically and technically, while still sounding *different*.
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The thing I liked about portishead was the fact that on some tracks the bass is loud, or the vocals are distorted, one track "Half Day Closing" the drums are in 1 speaker and the vocal sound is messed up. I know that some of this has been done before but it defied the correct mixing sound that we always seem to hear, remembering this was 1994 to 1997, actually the newer album "third" (2008) has some very interesting production, interview here.

Supreme beings of leisure I actually found through my love of the Portishead sound (trip hop) and a CD store recommending them to me, I love the production of the Self titled album, great band.

Alan.
 
witzendoz ~ actually the newer album "third" (2008) has some very interesting production, interview here.


I had read that interview -- very interesting to say the least! Especially the microphones and gear used.
 
witzendoz said:
The thing I liked about portishead was the fact that on some tracks the bass is loud, or the vocals are distorted, one track "Half Day Closing" the drums are in 1 speaker and the vocal sound is messed up.
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Yeah...it is unconventional, though they do it in conjunction with the artistic aspect of their music, which is cool...rather than just "messing up the mix" aimlessly or out of poor skills....and yeah, it's been done and gets done a lot now, so ,much so that it's in many way become mainstream...the intentional distorted, out of balance stuff...etc.

I'm still stuck on the whole "perfect production" thing. :D
Any time I consider doing something odd/weird...I decide against it because I think it will be too cliché since it's been done so much.
I figure eventually things will come back around again....and folks will get away from the excessive "lo-fi" stuff.... :)
 
Actually all this talk about messing up the mix reminded me of this mix I did back in 1998, Everythings Just Dandy.

We recorded the vocals with a AKG D12 plugged into a Pig Nose guitar amp. The tracking was done on a 16 track analog recorder and in those days we mixed to 16 bit DAT tape. So what we did to get the sound we wanted was to mix in Mono (everything centre) we ran the mix through a Bellari Valve Pre (RP520) via the line in and cranked the pre into the red. The output of the pre was run into an Otari 1/4" half track analog tape machine (MX5050) and onto tape very hot, while the playback head was immediately playing back to the DAT machine.

We were after a very old sound as if the whole thing had been recorded with a single mic in a room with a loud band playing, I don't know if thats what we got but we liked it anyway.

Alan.
 
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