Mastering Software Conundrum

T

Twinnesota

New member
We are dummies and need all the help we can get.

We want to (god forbid) try the so-called black art of MASTERING!

We record into a Korg D3200: 48 kHz/44.1 kHz, 24-bit (up to 12 simultaneous tracks)

We mix using Protools LE/M-Powered.

The FIRST big question is: "DOES OUR CHAIN SUCK SO FAR?"

The NEXT question is: "WHAT TYPE OF MASTERING SOFTWARE WOULD BE RECOMMEDED?"

AND: "WILL IT WORK WITH PROTOOLS?"

Thanks,

T
 
What you need (technically) is software that will author a compliant disc (no, that wouldn't be included with PT).

What else you need is what you need. What are your mixes lacking - Any why do you think that the mastering phase is going to change it if it wasn't happening during the mix?
 
Massive Master said:
What you need (technically) is software that will author a compliant disc (no, that wouldn't be included with PT).
Click to expand...

OK-BIAS PEAK PRO? [we use a mac] others?

Massive Master said:
What else you need is what you need. What are your mixes lacking - Any why do you think that the mastering phase is going to change it if it wasn't happening during the mix?
Click to expand...

EQ, crossfade, dither, limiting, etc, maybe.

Thanks,

T
 
Mastering software.........WAVES!!!! I have tried many plug-ins and have found Waves to be very very good.
 
Massive Master said:
Bias (IME) is a load of Bias without the "ia" in it.
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:D

Best product for CD assembly on Mac is Sonic's PMCD and Soundblade. Personally I use a Pro Tools HD system for major processing, Audiofile's Sample Manager for SRC, then Sonic's Soundblade for final editing, tweaks, and master.
 
Saiza said:
What software do you use to master with?
Click to expand...
I'm on the PC side of things and I'm partial to the Sony products, personally. I use Sound Forge as the 2-track editor and CD Architect for the final assembly and packaging. I can and have also used Wavelab instead, but I "grew up" on the Sonic Foundry/Sony products, so I'm just more comfortable with them.

As far as plugins for EQ and limiting and such - which are what they are and are not specific to, and only a small part of the mastering process - the Waves plugs are very nice, but I prefer to add that kind of coloration during mixing...though it does depend upon the content. Most often for polishing the mixdown I prefer the stuff from Roger Nichols Digital exactly because of it's very neutral color.

But my main point was that the Waves bundles are not mastering software. They're just a bunch of EQs and compressors and reverbs and stuff like that. There's no way to edit tracks, perform fades/cross fades, volume balance tracks, set track order, set gaps and track markers, perform sample rate conversions, edit CDInfo or PQ information, perform error tests, etc. - all the stuff that mastering is supposed to actually be all about.

G.
 
SouthSIDE Glen said:
I'm on the PC side of things and I'm partial to the Sony products, personally. I use Sound Forge as the 2-track editor and CD Architect for the final assembly and packaging. I can and have also used Wavelab instead, but I "grew up" on the Sonic Foundry/Sony products, so I'm just more comfortable with them.

As far as plugins for EQ and limiting and such - which are what they are and are not specific to, and only a small part of the mastering process - the Waves plugs are very nice, but I prefer to add that kind of coloration during mixing...though it does depend upon the content. Most often for polishing the mixdown I prefer the stuff from Roger Nichols Digital exactly because of it's very neutral color.

But my main point was that the Waves bundles are not mastering software. They're just a bunch of EQs and compressors and reverbs and stuff like that. There's no way to edit tracks, perform fades/cross fades, volume balance tracks, set track order, set gaps and track markers, perform sample rate conversions, edit CDInfo or PQ information, perform error tests, etc. - all the stuff that mastering is supposed to actually be all about.

G.
Click to expand...

So, he needs "Edittracksperformfades/cross fadesvolumebalancetrackssettrackorderset gapsandtrackmarkersperformsamplerateconversionseditCDInfoorPQ informationperformerrortestsetc PRO" ?
:D

I have not seen that particular software package yet
 
MCI2424 said:
So, he needs "Edittracksperformfades/cross fadesvolumebalancetrackssettrackorderset gapsandtrackmarkersperformsamplerateconversionseditCDInfoorPQ informationperformerrortestsetc PRO" ?
:D

I have not seen that particular software package yet
Click to expand...
They call it Wavelab :D
 
Twinnesota said:
We are dummies and need all the help we can get.

We want to (god forbid) try the so-called black art of MASTERING!

We record into a Korg D3200: 48 kHz/44.1 kHz, 24-bit (up to 12 simultaneous tracks)

We mix using Protools LE/M-Powered.

The FIRST big question is: "DOES OUR CHAIN SUCK SO FAR?"

The NEXT question is: "WHAT TYPE OF MASTERING SOFTWARE WOULD BE RECOMMEDED?"

AND: "WILL IT WORK WITH PROTOOLS?"

Thanks,

T[/QUOT

Mastering is not black art. In your case, it is a process of assembling an album so that it is pleasing to the listener. In major release, it is this plus making sure that the audio balance is portable to as many sound systems as possible. Mastering software is a collection of tools that make the above possible and like any other tool, needs a craftsman behind it to make it work properly. The craftsman is the mastering engineer who has many years experience and a capable environment to get the job done.

And Yes, any of the "Mastering" software tools will work with pro-tools. Your problem is coming up with the craftsman.
Click to expand...
 
SouthSIDE Glen said:
I'm on the PC side of things and I'm partial to the Sony products, personally. I use Sound Forge as the 2-track editor and CD Architect for the final assembly and packaging. I can and have also used Wavelab instead, but I "grew up" on the Sonic Foundry/Sony products, so I'm just more comfortable with them.

As far as plugins for EQ and limiting and such - which are what they are and are not specific to, and only a small part of the mastering process - the Waves plugs are very nice, but I prefer to add that kind of coloration during mixing...though it does depend upon the content. Most often for polishing the mixdown I prefer the stuff from Roger Nichols Digital exactly because of it's very neutral color.

But my main point was that the Waves bundles are not mastering software. They're just a bunch of EQs and compressors and reverbs and stuff like that. There's no way to edit tracks, perform fades/cross fades, volume balance tracks, set track order, set gaps and track markers, perform sample rate conversions, edit CDInfo or PQ information, perform error tests, etc. - all the stuff that mastering is supposed to actually be all about.

G.
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I use the masterlink,boards eq and some secret weapons.lol www.sterlingsoundstudios.com
 
what ? are you serious

rocker dude, with all due respect I believe you have been misinformed. First off regarding waves plugins and plugins in general. Let me tell ya, I would use waves over a masterlink anyday of the year. the procsessing in the masterlink is "emulating software" as you call it as well. There are no vaccum tubes or class a circuitry. Second the last thing you ever want to do is as you said add that kind of "colouring" when your mix.I have worked with alot of great producers and engineers(David Botrill, Scott Litt, Bill Klatt, and then some.) And the last thing any of those guys would ever do is compromise their mixes with mastering in mind Unless you are not going to have your mixes mastered. As far as eq and dynamics(compression ,limiting, expanding, etc.) That is a vital part of the procsess! The most important tool being your ears! Mastering engineers hear things completely different that a mixing engineer that is why if possible you have someone else master your mixes. With that said waves plugins are fine for the project studio. You can use pro tools le for assembly, that is fine as well. All you nees is a good chaing and remember don't do alot of tweaking. For instance feather your eq. Example, instead of adding 6 db at 50 hertz on your low end, add 2.5 at 50, 1.8 at 56hz, and 1.3 db at 70hz. It evens out the low end and prevents mudd. Second a good chain would be Compressor(the c4 isn't a bd multiband comp. ) then your eq(always put eq after dynamic, then any kind of special procsessor that you like personally to add some character ( tape saturation or things of that nature), a dither, and finally a limiter. It is important to remember is that your mastering not to fix your mixes but to make a record, instead of a bunch of songs on a c.d. that are uneven and struggling to coexist together. Remember that one of the tricks to mastering is not what you do but what you don't do. most people tend to turn a knob until they hear a major change in the sound for better or for worse. Stay away from that and I have no doubt that you will be more than happy with your final product. Look, in a real mastering room they don't use plugins at all. They normally have a custom designed mastering console that looks nothing like a mixing console. They have ridiculous amounts of high end analog compressors, limiters, tube pre's, 3/4 in. tape machine to print on after stripping the time code(that is how they widen the mixes not with a widening plugin which you should never use.) Oh, and multiple custom designed 500,000 dollar monitoring setups. So with that in mind it should help you keep perspective on your finished product.Also a trick I use sometimes when I get a mix from someone and it just sounds way too dry and dead, pull up a good verb and use a tight room(not a plate) and cut dsome of the high end off of the verb itself and put a very little amount on the over all mix, use it first in your chain. It will sound kind of weak without it going through your dynamics. And on your limiter maybe -4 0r -5 db of gain reduction, a slow attack and don't use auto release, use your ears to release in time with the mix. I hope this helps you out.
 
cagefighter1978 said:
the last thing you ever want to do is as you said add that kind of "colouring" when your mix.
Click to expand...
Ummm....what?? Those same producers and engineers that you mention use the gear that Waves emulates during mixing as a matter of rote. It's not a question of mixing with mastering in mind, you're right about that. But show me an engineer that waits for the 2mix to use a nice Class A limiting amp to perform parallel compression on drums or vocals or waits until mastering to perform a hi-Q sweep for resonances on a guitar track (just for two of a million examples), and doesn't purposefully pick their weapon of choice based upon it's coloration characteristics as much as anything else, and I'll show you someone who is blowing smoke up your skirt.
cagefighter1978 said:
As far as eq and dynamics(compression ,limiting, expanding, etc.) That is a vital part of the procsess!
Click to expand...
Yes, just as it is a vital part of the mixing process and even to a degree the tracking process. But you wouldn't call a bundle of signal processors like Waves "mixing software" or "recording software", because they don't actually mix or record anything.

It's the exact same thing with mastering. Sure, polishing the mix with those boxes or plugs is an important part of the mastering phase of the production, but none of the tools required specifically for creating a (pre)master package are included. You need something like Wavelab or CD Architect or a Masterlink to actually create a (pre)master. In that regard Waves (or any similar bundling of signal processors) is no more "mastering software" than my mouse is "mastering hardware".

G.
 
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