Major frustration: Les Paul Custom buzzing - advice

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espskully

espskully

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Hey guys. I have a '57 reissue Les Paul Custom ("black beauty" as they call it). It has been a flawless guitar for me for 8 years - never broken a string - and I ALWAYS break strings. I paid $3500 Canadian for it.

About 1 month ago it developed a buzz on the open low E string. It was bad enough that it was audible on recordings. So I took it in to Long and McQuade (the big Canadian music store chain) to get set up. After a basic setup didn't work - we found that the buzz seemed to be coming from the saddle area - the screw at the head of the saddle was touching the string (presumably due to the groove in the saddle being warn down after years of playing).

Anyway - ultimately - after 7 return visit (no shit) to this so called "great" tech - we put in brand new saddles, he filed the frets, the neck appears to be perfect (according to the tech), brand new strings, filled in and regrooved the nut, raised the action to an unplayable height (helped a bit but like I said, unplayable - so it's still high but not as bad), what else, that's all I can think of.

I got it back today as he was sure it was the saddles - and the low E still buzzes - open and when fretted - worst on the 12th fret, the A string buzzes when fretted and the D buzzes when fretted.

The tech just quit - -Friday was his last day. So he's gone. Techs are hard to find in this city. The only other one I know is a serious freak and we almost came to blows at the pub a while back.

I don't know what to do. What else sould it be???? It played perfectly until recently.

Any ideas, suggestions?

Thank you.
 
I can understand the saddle replacement....that seems logical.......

But why in the world would there be frett "filing" (Leveling?) involved? ...Or nut work for that matter??? Was this a new nut that was installed? Was there a problem that was found with the frets? (One coming loose/popping up??)

Before you took it in, did you try and raise the Low E side of the bridge just a bit to see if it took out the buzz any?

Do you know how to check the neck relief/bow? If so how is it set?

there are a lot of variables involved, but it sort of seems like you got hosed a bit by someone who didn't know as much as they said they did...

Rick
 
He said he tried filing as a last resort. The bow in the neck was perfect (so he said). He tried adjusting that as well with no results. He thought maybe the nut was grooved too deeply. I did try and raise just that side - with no luck. Still got buzzing.
 
Well, you have to figure out exactly what is buzzing...is it in the string path? Is it the string buzzing on one of the frets? (truss adjustment or filing a fret a bit will fix)
Is it one of the keys that has gear slack and is vibrating? (replacing the key will fix)
Is the buzz between the nut and the 1st fret? (string is setting too deep in the nut...put a piece of tissue under the string and see if it fixes this...if so, get a new nut cut)
Is the buzz between the 12th fret and the bridge? (again, figure out exactly what is buzzing...is it the string vibrating against something or a loose piece of hardware rattling?)

You can figure it out, if you take your time and put your ear close to the guitar...as you pluck the string move your ear around and pinpoint the source of the buzzing.
 
espskully said:
He said he tried filing as a last resort. The bow in the neck was perfect (so he said). He tried adjusting that as well with no results. He thought maybe the nut was grooved too deeply. I did try and raise just that side - with no luck. Still got buzzing.
Click to expand...

It doesn't sound, to me, like he is worth a damn. Anyone, who can do guitar setups, should be able to figure out the source of the buzz and not have to go through the "process of elimination". I hope you didn't have to pay them for "fixing" so many "problems that are causing the buzz". They should not get paid to fumble the hell around and shoot in the dark.

Take some time with the axe bro...you don't need them, you can figure out what is buzzing and then you will know what has to be done to fix it.

Anyway - ultimately - after 7 return visit (no shit) to this so called "great" tech - we put in brand new saddles, he filed the frets, the neck appears to be perfect (according to the tech), brand new strings, filled in and regrooved the nut, raised the action to an unplayable height (helped a bit but like I said, unplayable - so it's still high but not as bad), what else, that's all I can think of.

I got it back today as he was sure it was the saddles - and the low E still buzzes - open and when fretted - worst on the 12th fret, the A string buzzes when fretted and the D buzzes when fretted
Click to expand...

This sounds, to me, like the neck is NOT "perfect". Sounds like you need some truss adjustment...if you are getting buzz with the action up real high, new saddles, a new nut (supposedly cut correctly), and leveled frets..there are only 2 things left...either the truss rod is not the correct tension or its not the string buzzing.
Professionals are supposed to be experts in diagnosis....guess that guy is not really a pro huh?
Hope you get it straightened out man.
 
Thanks Jimi. That's a a great idea - I'll write down exactly where the buzz is coming from on each string.

I'll post back here with the results - and maybe you can help me figure this out.

I miss my axe!!

Thanks again.
 
Wheres Light..He's the guy who would know or could make a good guess,at least without seeing the guitar in person
 
For all the cash you paid for that thing, you should be able to send it back to Gibson for a look-see. :confused:


I found a screw loose on my Tonawandacaster causing a little buzz.


Dave
 
jimistone said:
It doesn't sound, to me, like he is worth a damn. Anyone, who can do guitar setups, should be able to figure out the source of the buzz and not have to go through the "process of elimination". I hope you didn't have to pay them for "fixing" so many "problems that are causing the buzz". They should not get paid to fumble the hell around and shoot in the dark.

Take some time with the axe bro...you don't need them, you can figure out what is buzzing and then you will know what has to be done to fix it.



This sounds, to me, like the neck is NOT "perfect". Sounds like you need some truss adjustment...if you are getting buzz with the action up real high, new saddles, a new nut (supposedly cut correctly), and leveled frets..there are only 2 things left...either the truss rod is not the correct tension or its not the string buzzing.
Professionals are supposed to be experts in diagnosis....guess that guy is not really a pro huh?
Hope you get it straightened out man.
Click to expand...

This touches ALL the relevant bases. +1 :)
 
Hard to tell without seeing it first hand. I feel for ya...I had a similar experience with my Les Paul Deluxe. I bought it new in 80'. After about 4 years of playing full time(5-6 nights a week), It started developing problems with buzzing. I took it to a so-called "good "shop, and the guy pretty much ruined it. He leveled the frets , some were down to nothing and some were almost full height. After searching a while I found a place that was highly recomended.
The tech pulled the frets, planed the fret board (it had warped) and refretted it. VOILA!!!! It played like silk. Actually better than it was before.
He installed Dunlop fret wire too. It has held up great for 20 years of hard playing. The original fret wire wore out quickly.
I just leveled and crowned them recently.( I do this for a living now).
The best advice I could give you is to look for a luthier in your area. They'll know exactly what to do to get it straightened out. Music stores are notorious for letting people who aren't qualified, work on instruments. Or in most cases, they sublet the work to whoever is cheapest.(so they can mark it up and make more profit). GOOD LUCK!!!!!
 
goldtopchas said:
Hard to tell without seeing it first hand. I feel for ya...I had a similar experience with my Les Paul Deluxe. I bought it new in 80'. After about 4 years of playing full time(5-6 nights a week), It started developing problems with buzzing. I took it to a so-called "good "shop, and the guy pretty much ruined it. He leveled the frets , some were down to nothing and some were almost full height. After searching a while I found a place that was highly recomended.
The tech pulled the frets, planed the fret board (it had warped) and refretted it. VOILA!!!! It played like silk. Actually better than it was before.
He installed Dunlop fret wire too. It has held up great for 20 years of hard playing. The original fret wire wore out quickly.
I just leveled and crowned them recently.( I do this for a living now).
The best advice I could give you is to look for a luthier in your area. They'll know exactly what to do to get it straightened out. Music stores are notorious for letting people who aren't qualified, work on instruments. Or in most cases, they sublet the work to whoever is cheapest.(so they can mark it up and make more profit). GOOD LUCK!!!!!
Click to expand...

I agree with goldtopchas, with one exception...
Figure out the source of the buzz yourself first. pinpoint it. You may not need fretwork (well, you did say the "expert" filed your frets huh?...damn)
Anyway, if it doesn't need fretwork you can probably fix it yourself.

A luthier, if he is good, is going to recomend fretwork (possibly a refret even), a new nut, and of course you will get a complete setup with that.

The reason for this is that a good luthier, know how to get that thing playing like butter, and its going to take all of this to achieve the end result he wants his work to carry. No good luthier is going to do a half assed quick fix, on a guitar, and have his name linked to that type of work...and I don't blame them. If you go the luthier route you are going to get the whole enchilada.

But, look at it this way, a complete job, including a refret (worse case senario) would probably run you $300 to $350. Binded setnecks are higher than the fender necks to refret...but $350 should put you in the ballpark...(light could probably do a better job than me on giving you a ballpark price)

Anyway, $350 to have a class "A" fretjob and setup on a nice guitar like that is but a drop in the bucket. If you keep the guitar for 10 more years thats only a $35 a year investment...thats only $2.91 a week to have the Les Paul you WANT....not the one you have to settle for. (I should go to work selling guitar work for luthiers huh? :D )

A good luthier will have the guitar playing better than brand new. There is a fantastic luthier in this area and more than a few players, that have let him do their guitars, bring BRAND NEW GUITARS to him for a REFRET and setup, the day they buy the guitar. (these guys do not play cheap guitars by the way...Les Pauls, American Strats, PRS"s...all with brand new frets go straight in to him for a fretjob)

If you take the axe to a reputable experianced luthier, it will be better than you dreamed possible when you get it back...thats worth alot IMO

My 2 cents
 
If you raise the action (to an unsuitable high position) and you still have buzz (on both open and freted notes), it likely has little to do with either the neck or frets. That leaves the nut and bridge as most likely causes.

As others said, try to find out where the buzz noise is coming from. Sometimes a loose pole piece on a high pickup can cause this.

Also be sure the buzz is not note specific. If something is loose and responds to say an A note, but not other notes, then finding this out can help locate the source.

It also sounds like the shop you used were guessing at your expense. Don't go back (except to get youro $ back) and find someone else.

Ed
 
My r9 les paul buzzed, and I discovered it was the abr-1 bridge. These are apparently notorious for rattling. I replaced it with a tone pros abr bridge which promptly stopped all buzzing.
 
Buzzes/rattles can be in places you wouldn't normally think of, and the vibrations can travel and sound like they are coming from someplace else. I had a rattle on some specific notes on my Strat recently that sounded like it was coming from the fretboard. It turned out to be that the handle on the end of my tremelo bar had come partially unsecrewed and was rattling. Another time it was one of the screws that hold the knobs on the tuners. Another time it was a loose strap button.
 
Not sure if this helps you but if you're willing to spend a little cash, try some Graphtech saddles and a bone nut (like mentioned). If you can't find out where exactly your buzz is coming from, you have a good chance that (together with a well set-up neck) these will take care of your problem and improve your tone and sustain aswell.
 
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