M-Audio Delta 1010 LT PCI Digital Audio Computer Interface

[Robert D]

First, I'm a big fan of M-Audio as a company. They do a first rate job of designing quality into very modestly priced gear. Having said that, they pushed the envelope pretty far on the 1010LT, and when you push it that far, something simply has to give. It's not that the converters are in the box. Anyone who's ever used, or looked at the specs of Lynx cards knows that superb, dead quiet conversion can be done inside the box. But it takes spending money on extra bypass caps, common mode chokes, ferrites, maybe a 6 layer board, etc..... not to mention top notch converters. At the price they sell the 1010LT for, there just isn't room in the BOM cost for quality, and design compromises had to be made. You have to go into it knowing that. At some level, even after remarkable efforts by a polished development team, you do get what you pay for.

 

[Roguetitan]

The connection has nothing to do with the signal. However FireWire designs are generally newer designs than PCI designs, so they tend to have newer DAC designs, and their analog sections often meet tighter tolerances. The quality of computer audio gear has steadily improved, and the older designs just don't have the same quality as newer designs.




You're kidding, right? The FIREPOD ($400) does everything the Delta 1010 does except word clock. If you're using anything decent as a clock source via word clock, you're up in the dollar range where complaining about the cost of an interface is almost silly.

Besides, the 1010 and the 1010LT are NOT the same hardware. The 1010LT is a significantly cost-reduced version of the 1010. Among other things, the 1010LT features about forty or fifty electrolytic capacitors all over the board. Yum.

Finally, the Delta 1010 cannot record 10 channels of audio simultaneously by itself. It can record eight. If you add an external preamp with S/PDIF capabilities (these start just shy of $300).




Depends on the cable and the electrical noise in your environment. In an audio booth next to a light booth, you don't run unbalanced two feet, much less 20. If you do, you'll hum like a harmonica.

P.S. the electrical noise in many computers can be a problem. I had lots of problems with computer-generated electrical noise on the output side of my Delta 1010LT, and that's one of the reasons I sold it. It does not have adequate electrical isolation from noise on the power rails, and if your computer's power supply has any number of design defects (which are a lot more common than you might think), you, too, can hear weird electrical chirps. There are very good reasons to move the converters the hell out of the computer, and IMHO, anything with converters inside the computer's case is not a professional interface by any stretch of the imagination.

If you're spending the kind of money that an A&H Mixer costs, you should find the extra money to not buy a junk audio card, and IMHO, the 1010LT is junk in every sense of the word. Its drivers are buggy on the Mac and it isn't supported in Vista at all, it is not electrically isolated from noise sources inside your computer, it doesn't record with nearly the quality of modern converters, its built-in preamps are utter crap....

But if you've already made up your minds based on a bunch of reviews, go ahead. When people in here say pretty much the opposite of what those reviews say, though, you might do well to listen.

P.S. Musician's Friend does not publish bad reviews as far as I can tell. I've submitted several, and I haven't seen one yet.

you noticed I said other forums, i did not read any reviews on mf website but they do post productbad reviews/customer feedback on the product page because i have read them

like I said I know that fire pod technoligy is more advanced but I did not ask about fire wire or fire pod because I do not want that. I am staying with PCI card for now.
I know exactly what I am looking for and what I want

if I wanted a firewire interface I would have asked about firewire interface,
computer noise is a non issue like i also said. I did not come here looking for a debate on firewire VS pci cards I silply ask a question whether the Delta 1010 is a good card or not and I got the answer I was looking for in this forum and in other forums. this is not the only recording forum on the net.

I don't understand why there is always someone wanting to make an issue out of a non issue

I am am glad you like the firewire system but not everyone wants that technoligy.

 

[dgatwood]

if I wanted a firewire interface I would have asked about firewire interface,
computer noise is a non issue like i also said. I did not come here looking for a debate on firewire VS pci cards I silply ask a question whether the Delta 1010 is a good card or not and I got the answer I was looking for in this forum and in other forums. this is not the only recording forum on the net.

Then to answer your question, no, it isn't good. Their drivers suck and they cut lots of corners quality-wise. Among others, the converters and analog electronics date back to 1999 when the 1010 was first released to the public. (The 1010LT, despite coming out two years later, is still based on much the same guts, AFAIK.)

The sound quality of audio hardware has improved fairly dramatically in the past 8 years. Buying a 1010 or a 1010LT is like buying a 1999 automobile. It may be in mint condition, but it still gets '99 fuel economy.

I'm not going to push you to go with FireWire if you're really committed to buying a PCI interface.... The problem is that manufacturers pretty universally consider PCI dead, so almost nobody has designed new PCI audio interfaces in several years, so they are universally way behind the technology curve, and as a result, sound quality will generally be worse than with newer designs. The 1010LT isn't very good, IMHO, and a true 1010 costs more than FireWire interfaces that are -much- better.

And I don't know how you can say that computer noise is a non-issue. Unless you have personally used a recent 1010LT in that particular configuration, you don't know how it will behave. In particular, they made a small hardware rev about three years ago to accommodate the early PowerMac G5s that removed one of the board's grounds. I never had noise problems before that, but did have electrical noise problems on the output path with the modified version of the card.

 

[Robert D]

Among others, the converters and analog electronics date back to 1999 when the 1010 was first released to the public. (The 1010LT, despite coming out two years later, is still based on much the same guts, AFAIK.).

I'm almost certain the 1010Lt uses lesser quality converters than the original 1010, and lesser other guts.

The problem is that manufacturers pretty universally consider PCI dead, so almost nobody has designed new PCI audio interfaces in several years, so they are universally way behind the technology curve, and as a result, sound quality will generally be worse than with newer designs. The 1010LT isn't very good, IMHO, and a true 1010 costs more than FireWire interfaces that are -much- better.

While I agree about the 1010LT, there's some pretty large generalizations in that statement, and saying that PCI interfaces are universally way behind the technology curve and will generally sound worse than newer designs has no basis that I know of, beyond the interface where it's all ones and zeros. It's akin to saying an old Neve preamp is old technology and therefor will sound worse than a newer design. The ramp on converter technology pretty much flattened out several years ago, and most changes have been cost down process improvements and feature add ons for portable media devices. Where it might be true is that, as the cost of converter chips have come down, the lowest cost interfaces are probably using better converters - not because they weren't available before, but because they are cheaper now.
There are several good reasons to choose firewire today over PCI, but not because it inheirantly sounds better. I'll put my PCI Lynx L22 up against that claim any day.

And I don't know how you can say that computer noise is a non-issue. Unless you have personally used a recent 1010LT in that particular configuration, you don't know how it will behave. In particular, they made a small hardware rev about three years ago to accommodate the early PowerMac G5s that removed one of the board's grounds. I never had noise problems before that, but did have electrical noise problems on the output path with the modified version of the card.

Very good point, and this is an area where cuts will have been made in the 1010LT vs a Delta 66,44, or other M-Audio interface with in the box converters. Really good EMI and conducted noise immunity costs money, and the BOM cost of the 1010LT will have been stretched too thin relative to the margin to spend any money there.

 

[Vagodeoz]

I have the delta 1010lt and a behringer mixer, and I was happy with my setup, until I ran into THIS!!!
This one seems great! It has 16 inputs! 8 of which are XLR and it has the same AD/DA converters as the HD24!!!
It's on sale on 400$!!!
Looking forward to selling my 1010 and my mixer for one of those.

 

[Roguetitan]

I have the delta 1010lt and a behringer mixer, and I was happy with my setup, until I ran into THIS!!!
This one seems great! It has 16 inputs! 8 of which are XLR and it has the same AD/DA converters as the HD24!!!
It's on sale on 400$!!!
Looking forward to selling my 1010 and my mixer for one of those.

if I was going to go with a firewire that would be more the direction I would go.
the setup I am currently trying to put together will be a permanent setup in my studio but the Alesis Multi Mix would definately be an option with my laptop for a portable unit. I would much rather have that setup than the VS2000 studio work station I currently use for my portable unit.

 

[dgatwood]

While I agree about the 1010LT, there's some pretty large generalizations in that statement, and saying that PCI interfaces are universally way behind the technology curve and will generally sound worse than newer designs has no basis that I know of, beyond the interface where it's all ones and zeros. It's akin to saying an old Neve preamp is old technology and therefor will sound worse than a newer design.

There's a big difference between discrete designs and IC-based designs. Amplifier ICs have gotten much better in their noise figures in the past decade, and most of these devices probably use several. What I'm saying is more along the lines of a Mackie Mixer today will sound much better than a Mackie Mixer from the late 90s.

The ramp on converter technology pretty much flattened out several years ago, and most changes have been cost down process improvements and feature add ons for portable media devices. Where it might be true is that, as the cost of converter chips have come down, the lowest cost interfaces are probably using better converters - not because they weren't available before, but because they are cheaper now.

That's certainly true. It's more that everything is converging towards what used to be the high end. The flip side, though, is that low end stuff now is better than most typical hardware designed five or six years ago.

Your Lynx card was almost ridiculously high end when it was designed. Thus, it has only settled to roughly equivalent to today's high-end hardware. The vast majority of the currently-for-sale PCI cards, though, are not based on custom silicon that was five or six years ahead of its time....