louded poitn with out clipping

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tojo

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I think that when your are mixing the idea is to get the mix as loud as possible without clipping right? Does that mean i should boost the master? because when i do , background noise becomes audible.

any ideas?
 
Boosting the master fader will not effect your signal to noise ratio, or how much noise is there. You will just be hearing it better.

While in the mixing process, I don't like my mix coming anywhere near clipping. This doesn't give me any room for effects like EQ, compression, etc.

When the mix is finally done, all compression, EQ, reverb, or whatever, and you're ready to bounce it down and put it on CD, that's when you want the volume as close to clipping as possible.

That is assuming you want the most volume out of your song as possible. If other songs are on the same CD you may not want to do this.

A quick way to get it to full volume up is normalizing it to like -0.1db (I usually do -0.5db just because I won't sweat over half a decibel). Some will run it through a limiter.

I always normalize the finished product right before render (before any sample-rate-conversions or dithering). A lot of people hate normalizing but when it's used like that there is nothing wrong with it.

Edit: Another thing I forgot to mention is that some people don't like normalizing to 0db or even -0.1db because of inter-sample clipping. I don't know much about this but I believe it is at the digital-to-analog stage.
 
tojo said:
I think that when your are mixing the idea is to get the mix as loud as possible without clipping right?
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The idea in mixing is to get good balance and sound quality in all the dimensions of the mix. "As loud as possible" isn't necessary. If you have noise problems you should look at how you're doing your tracking.

BTW, I know it's a typo but what did you mean by "louded poitn"?
 
I always leave my master at zero. By the time I am done mixing the master is pretty tapped out, but I run compression on the master once I get a good balanced mix.

What do you mean when you say background noise? Guitar payler scratching his ass etc., or hum and hiss?


F.S.
 
A lot of software like Cubase, Logic, etc... has really nice soft clipping algorythms on the channel faders.. which sometimes even sounds nice. (I'll often, in logic, overdrive a channel fader output then send it's output to a bus so it doesn't overdrive the master fader.) Clipping is becoming less of a constant issue with a lot of modern software (except for Pro tools!!!).. recording audio into the software is more critical, but once it's in...a lot of software doesn't matter that much as all if it's a bit pinned.
 
oh yeah...compressor on the master channel (insert before you mix, not after) can make a big difference... I always mix with a compressor on the master channel..as I seem to consistently get nicer results that way.
 
sorry i meant "loudest point"---- typo. i'll try putting on all the fx. and then throwing a compressor on the master to get the finishing touch

thanks everyone
 
oh yeah, and the background noise is just a small hiss. I haven't got a very good noise reduction plugin... any ideas... free would probably be best :)
 
I recommend against a noise reduction plugin.

Find the cause of the his and fix it if possible. If it can't be removed see if you can make the signal going in as far above the hiss as you can.
If the hiss increases with the signal level (like on some guitar amps) then you're stuck, but try all options.

Rather than noise reduction or gates, manually delete the quiet sections of tracks where no one is performing. Vocal tracks, lead guitar tracks, tom tracks, etc can have alot of dead space in them that just needs to be muted out or deleted to prevent all that quiet noise from adding up to loud noise.



F.S.
 
Thanks! i'll work with it. If ican't remove the hiss, then i'll just use an envelope to drop the volume when no one is playing.
 
XLR said:
The idea in mixing is to get good balance and sound quality in all the dimensions of the mix. "As loud as possible" isn't necessary. If you have noise problems you should look at how you're doing your tracking.
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This is good advice.

If you are having noticable noise problems when you boost volume during mixing, then chances are you haven't recorded the tracks at the right level to begin with. In other words, your signal is recorded too close to the noise floor.

The first thing to do is to troubleshoot your recording setup and get the noise levels down as far as possible. This means tracking down any hums, hisses, or other audio oddities, and solving them.

If you are using a mic, you need to find the optimum settings for your mic and preamp. All gear has a sweet spot, and you need to experiment in order to find that. If you are using budget gear, chances are you are setting it up outside the sweet spot.

I mention budget gear only because low priced gear tends to have a very narrow sweet spot. Sometimes it can be a challenge to find it and make it usable.

Once you've sorted out the various issues with your recording setup, then you probably need to record at hotter levels. This gets your usable signal further away from the noise floor, ultimately allowing you to mix with quiter background noise.

Finally, the point of mixing is *not* to get the signal as loud as possible without clipping. That's not a factor at all, and I mean zero. It's as XLR said: "The idea in mixing is to get good balance and sound quality in all the dimensions of the mix."

In fact, when mixing your peaks should not go over -6 at the very highest. Keeping it anywhere from -12 to -6 will be a very good level, and ultimately will sound better.

Once you are finished mixing, then you can boost levels in the mastering process. But striving for ear shattering levels while mixing is not ideal at all. If it doesn't sound loud enough to you, just turn up your monitors.
 
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