Loud band, small room, vocals bleeding into drums

moresound said:
I get some ringing after doing live shows if it kinda loud. But never pain. Is there really pain with tinnitus?


:cool:
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Yeah, if it progresses it can start causing migraines and drive you almost insane. The pain can also be caused from an underlying problem that's causing the tinnitus.
 
Noisebin said:
I'm just baffled at how high the level of the vocals are in the two SM-57s on the drums. ...The funny thing is, the non in-ear guys say they can barely hear the vocals in the room. Sinny hoo, I guess I'll have to go with triggers, Edrums, or a drum machine. I have outrun the limits of analog technology!
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You don't want a drum machine. you can get by this problem.

Get the gobo and...

Try a mic with a tighter polar pattern like a Beyer Dymanic M201 and put some sound absorbtion behind him.

Another thing to try is moving the guitar amps closer to the guitarists ears.
 
When you're in a very small practice space, I gotta wonder why you even need monitors for amplifying the drums, IEM or not. If you can't hear the drums au natural in a 22 ft. garage, either your drummer is a girlie boy or your guitarists are cranking it waaaay too loud.

M<y point is that for your document recording purposes, you should be able to forgo at least part of the drum miking and use the mic(s) instead for recording the band.

When you're done recording, you can always go back to doing the miking/monitoring. Of course after you listen to the recordings, you guys just might find out that volume is half of your problem.

G.
 
moresound said:
I get some ringing after doing live shows if it kinda loud. But never pain. Is there really pain with tinnitus?







:cool:
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I've never had pain, but it's friggin annoying. I have a constant ringing with morse code in addition on the right. Not the bass, not the drums, the guitar. My guitard's Champ 12 did most of the damage. My suggestion: limit the guitards to 15 watts amp, if it's good enough for Zakk Wylde it should be good enough for them. The ONLY reason to practice at ear splitting volume is cause you don't want to know how shitty you sound.
 
You got to figure it's compensating for a small dic....... well you know where that was going I don't have to type it out! :D







:cool:
 
moresound said:
You got to figure it's compensating for a small dic....... well you know where that was going I don't have to type it out!
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Differential Interference Contrast?....Dubai International Capital?...Disseminated intravascular coagulation?...Dependents Indemnity Compensation?...Downtown Islamic Center?
 
You guys gotta' tailor yourselves to your practice environment. Get some blasticks for the drums. Turn the guitars down.

My personal goal for band practice: No need for earplugs and it all sounds mixed without going through a mixing board.
 
Noisebin said:
I guess I should have mentioned that despite the "newbie" title by my ID, I actually have been recording for about 20 years, so I"ve got a pretty good grasp of the basics. My "pa speaks" are actually wedges pointed away from the drums (drummer uses the in-ears).
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Singers need an extra 6dB or so of their voice in their monitors to overcome hearing themselves through bone conduction. When it sounds loud enough to you it's not loud enough for them. IEMs would help, but separate mixes would be advisable.

Noisebin said:
I'm just baffled at how high the level of the vocals are in the two SM-57s on the drums. It is so loud, that you have to pull the real vocal fader up about 65% of the way just to overcome the vocal in the drum mics.
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Where two or three planes (walls, ceiling) meet you get a retro-reflector. The wedge sound bounces right back at the kit. Combined with that extra 6dB mentioned above and a small room you have a problem.

Noisebin said:
I tried to get around this by turning the trim on the drum mics all the way down figuring that only the explosive sound of the close miked drum would penetrate. But that leaves the drums sounding weak.
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That's one of the myths about gain, that turning it down can somehow separate some parts of the signal from others. The truth is you get less of everything in perfect proportion.

Noisebin said:
The funny thing is, the non in-ear guys say they can barely hear the vocals in the room. Sinny hoo, I guess I'll have to go with triggers, Edrums, or a drum machine. I have outrun the limits of analog technology!
Click to expand...

Try raising the wedges up on stands. Cutting the distance to the listener by half gets him a free 6dB of SPL without increasing the actual level in the room.
 
We're not micing the drums in order to amplify them, just for the in-ear mix and to record them. The only thing that gets amplified in our set up is the vocals. I'm actually using my mixer in reverse from normal due to the configuration. I send the vocals to the amp for amplification via aux sends as you would a monitor mix. Everything else goes into the mixer. With my mixer (Mackie CFX16) I can tap off each channel to send to the recording system without interrupting normal signal flow into the mixer.

In other words, the in-ears get all the instruments, but we are only sending vocals to the monitors.

Bouldersoundguy: Thanks thats the kind of input I was looking for...I didn't do a good job of describing the scenario in one succinct post. Thanks all...
 
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