Logic Pro 9 mixing vocals against a mp3 instrumental..help

  • Thread starter Thread starter MasterRS
  • Start date Start date
I agree the vocals sound weak or thin. I love the style, the vocal sounds like you're standing back from the mic in a room with some echo (from your posts I know you're not). I would say steeno has something with getting you singing a little stronger but I also think some could be fixed with some effects maybe.

Once you've recorded the vocals what are you doing to them. Any eq, compression, reverb, etc?

As for stronger vocals, think of it this way. If you were standing at a crowded mall and saw a friend way across the room, When you scream yo or hey it's not a quiet whispered hey.. hell scream it now.. if you feel your stomach tighten and the way the sound comes out, try and take a little of that and put it into your vocal. I could be way off but hey, that's the fun of digital recording.. hit delete and just let me know I was way off.
 
Your vocals sound unusually thin for the mic you said you are using in another post (sE Electronics X1). That is a good enough mic to give you the quality you want, but it seems like something might be wrong in the signal chain. Are you doing some super-agressive EQ cutting in the low freqs? Double check in your software settings to be sure you are recording with your audio interface and not your computer's internal mic.

And BTW, I'm not talking about vocal style in this post... I am talking about the literal quality of the audio.
 
Well firstly..thank you to you both to take the time out of your busy lives and to take a listen to help a dumbass newbie like me! I really appreciate it..firstly, i'm not miels away from the mic or anything..but if you listen to my recordings posted before (cubase and logic pro pne of hustle hard) they were recorded in my main room, but i felt the room has an echo. So what i did was recorded in my bathroom which is a small kind of room with no echo. Now i did still get told i'll get sibliance, so i put a sock over the top of the mic, had my se electronics sound filter around the stand and mic, then a thin towel..then i was as close as possible to the mic..i did this as before i got told alot of sibliance and problems was because i hadn't done this in correlation with my room sued..settings wise..am not a eq expert what am doing is just eqing it till i think it sounds like the 'pro sound i want' and then am adding compression/slight reverb..nothing else really..and as for the signal chain..it's definetely input from my saffire 6, but as said before..i'm using the safire 6 at 6/7 volume..it goes upto 9..so i dont know if perhaps i need it louder or what..
 
Okay, louder isn't what you want. Extra gain on your interface will only get you closer to clipping and will possibly introduce extra hizz and buzz. I have a feeling all the fabric you put in front of your mic is what killed your sound. Try again recording in your main room (even if it has an echo) with only the sE Electronics sound filter. Even if you get some sibilance problems, don't worry about that now. Get about 4-6 inches away from your mic to avoid the proximity effect and turn up the gain on your interface until you are tracking around -12 to -18 dB. You can see how hot you are recording by looking at the meters in your software. Try this and post up a raw track without any EQ/compression done to it. This will confirm whether or not the problem lies in the tracking or the mixing, and then we can work from there :)
 
Thank you so much for the fast response..okay I will do that for you definetely but how do i know when am 'tracking' -12 to -18?? on logic pro?
 
Open a level meter plugin. It's filed under the "metering" category. Make sure it's set for Peak metering and just watch where the meter tends to average.
 
yeah sorry i realised afterwards like duhh i know where it is..looking at the last recording for see u again i posted earlier in the thread those vocals are mainly -12 -18 but sometimes come upto -9..is that a bad thing..
 
MasterRS said:
yeah sorry i realised afterwards like duhh i know where it is..looking at the last recording for see u again i posted earlier in the thread those vocals are mainly -12 -18 but sometimes come upto -9..is that a bad thing..
Click to expand...

That's a great level, it can even peak at a little bit higher than -9 if you want. The important thing is to put the level meter before any other plugins so you are getting the true level of the audio without being affected by the gain of the other plugs.
 
OK, I listened.
It's definitely a stronger performance than the track that was titled "output1-2"


guitarplayr is right. Don't worry about socks or cloths or any of that.
I wouldn't even worry too much about what room you're in when you're using the reflection filter.
Just keep nice and close up on the mic and keep your vocals strong.


I can't pinpoint what's wrong, but that last clip still sounds.....idk. distant?
Also, I could be wrong but it sounds like you have a compressor on there that's doing no good.

I felt like every time you took a breath, the following syllable was fine then a leveller just took all the life out of the rest of the phrase.

Am I hearing things or is there a compressor on there?




Master, I could be off track here so don't take this the wrong way, but I'm starting to wonder if you're killing your takes with effects?
I don't mean it in the nasty way, but it shouldn't be this difficult to get a good clear strong sound.

Would you consider posting a raw vocal track? No backing, no effects; Nothing.
 
No offence taken. If you can't take critisicm then you'll never get better. Yes there was compression on there. EQ too, de-esserr i think as well and then a slight reverb. And yeah maybe your right and i am killing them with effects..ill record tommorrow a raw vocal recording with just the mic and refelction filter for you guys..
 
OK, that'd be great Master.
If you're super keen could you post completely raw vocals, and the backing track that matches them?

I'd be happy to try to mix it. If I can do it well, then you mixing is the problem.
If I struggle, then it may be on the recording side of things.
 
Steenamaroo said:
I'd be happy to try to mix it. If I can do it well, then you mixing is the problem.
If I struggle, then it may be on the recording side of things.
Click to expand...

I'll give it a mix too :)

BTW this whole time I thought the "sound filter" was a pop filter, not a reflection filter. Either way, the reflection filter is great and Steenamaroo was right - the room won't matter too much with the reflection filter. Maybe consider picking up a cheap pop filter (or make one yourself with some nylon and a coat hanger) if you get too many 'plosives without the sock/cloth you had in front of it.
 
hi i have both a se pop filter and REFLECTION filter that i have been using, the only problem is recently the attchement for the reflection filter broke *doh* so yeah in need of getting a new one..ive got the raw recordings for you guys anyway..

Test1 by RS Music on SoundCloud - Create, record and share your sounds for free - i put the mic to a new height well above me for this one (super high so as stein said my chins up) and took stein's advice about a crowd/getting close to the mic..also in refer to guitar's advice i've also taken this aboard and the saffire 6 audio interface goes from input volume 0-10..at this recording it was set at 5 out of 10.

Test2 by RS Music on SoundCloud - Create, record and share your sounds for free - mic at normal height i have it..same input volume at 5/10 stand/mic adjusted to normal height i have it at..which is slightly below my chin..

Test3 by RS Music on SoundCloud - Create, record and share your sounds for free - mic at the same height as (test 2) i normally have it but only change was input volume was put to 7/10..

let me know your thoughts guys and if u need me to d any tests more like to discover the problem be great..

and thank you guitar..thank you stein for taking the time to listen and i appreciate all the help :) i've bought a mixing book today so going to continue reading it a bit more..but ill definetely have to take you both up on them mixing offers :) then i'll be like 50 cent on the tracks haha
 
Hey RS.

I was kinda hoping you'd post a rap that you'd done to a backing track, so we'd have the separate backing and vocal tracks to work with.


I took a look at your clips anyway, but there's not really a lot to do without some music.



For me, number one wins, but see what you think yourself.

EDIT*
forgot to say, you've a few plosives going on. 18 19 and 20 seconds, Just Tell me.
 
Steenamaroo said:
Hey RS.

I was kinda hoping you'd post a rap that you'd done to a backing track, so we'd have the separate backing and vocal tracks to work with.


I took a look at your clips anyway, but there's not really a lot to do without some music.



For me, number one wins, but see what you think yourself.
Click to expand...

Agreed.
 
oh right am sorry, i posted just the vocals because i thhpught prior to this one of you guys put that you wanted to hear my vocals alone to see if that was at fault and if it was my eq skills? Thats why i did it. Yes i agree i think one sounded the best myself, which is at a height i've never had the mic. I love what you did with my vocals stein, how did you manage to get them that clear and loud? That's exactly what level im wanting my voice to be at to be honest..:) please spill
 
Ah, fair enough Master, that was a good idea. I just got my wires crossed.

To be honest with you, I have very little going on, but I think that's the key.

In order I have eq, comp, verb and delay, but all of them are very subtle.



The eq is just rolling off at 90hz and boosting by 2db@350hz and 9khz, both with a very wide Q.

The comp is set at 1.6 to 1, and the max reduction it ever does is 3db.

The reverb is very tight. It's a chamber type and I have the blend down to 6% wet.
The reverb time is pulled back to one second, and i pulled the early reflections away back too.

The delay has the highs rolled off it and should be barely audible. I find it thickens the voice a little.



Now, having said that, I don't think the specific numbers and details are important.
I think it's just a case of keeping everything very subtle.

If you find it tricky to hear subtle difference when your mixing, try toggling the bypass on a plugin.
I find it much easier to hear exactly what's happening if I flick back to the dry track once in a while.

EDIT**
About the plosives.
You can't really hear them in back track, but in your originals there are a few points where you sing a hard consonant and the mic kinda craps itself. That's a plosive. It's pretty much the same as blowing on the mic.
You've two choices really. Either try to control words like that a little bit, or move the pop filter back from the mic another inch or so.
Personally I've just learned not to sing them so strong.
 
aah right. Thanks man, so did you do this on logic pro? just it sounds amazing man..it's like exactly what had in mind for my sound. But to help you more when i find a instrumental i really like i'll record something to a backing beat for you so I can learn more. i'm currently reading a mixing book but to be honest alot of it seems common sense. Could the plosive stuff be because, i am having my upside down with the pop filter at the bottom (to cover where you obvously talk into) and then the height too? Should i have my mic in a normal position? just i was advised to do this on the forums thats why i've always done it..and could this be an issue?
 
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