Let the Wells Run Dry with easlern and ibleedburgundy

The song does end abruptly. I had thought about repeating the chorus, but in the end got carried along with the minimalist spirit of the song. I've been thinking of this tune as a one-off, oddball song that was just going to do its own idiosyncratic thing.

Until recently, that guitar on the left was balanced by another, clean guitar on the right. It was not quite doubling, but playing a complimentary line. The pair were mixed low, as you've heard me do in many songs. I thought it sounded very nice, but I had to ditch the other guitar to make space for the vocal, especially the harmony vox. I wanted the harmony barely audible, like hearing it subconsciously, but present. I couldn't have them struggling to be heard over guitars. So.

I take your word for it that the drums are too loud. I've had the mother-in-law in the house for the past week, for the holidays. I wasn't able to mix loud at all, so probably quite a few of the judgment calls are off. She's gone tomorrow, so I'll give another listen and a mix. Then, I think it's time to step back from the song.

These were great comments! Thanks all. It's what the Mp3 Clinic is all about.

I'm excited about the next tune up, I hope not far off!
 
Yea, I agree with posters above - keep the drum level where it is, and turn almost everything else up. Sounds like you have plenty of headroom to bring the guitars and lead vocals up, yet still give it an "easy listening" vibe.
 
Robus said:
Until recently, that guitar on the left was balanced by another, clean guitar on the right. It was not quite doubling, but playing a complimentary line. The pair were mixed low, as you've heard me do in many songs. I thought it sounded very nice, but I had to ditch the other guitar to make space for the vocal, especially the harmony vox. I wanted the harmony barely audible, like hearing it subconsciously, but present. I couldn't have them struggling to be heard over guitars. So.
Click to expand...

I would dare say that yes, the vocal (s) are the most important element of the song.

However, guitars are important as well

If the guitars are fighting the vocal, that can be an issue with arrangements and production. Or maybe the tones of the guitars compared with the vocalist.
Lots of ways to fix that, except it involves re-recording.

As to arranging, the blues guys got it down. The guitar and vocals are always very polite to one another. When the singer sings the guitar shuts up, and when it's the guitars turn, the vocal chills.

Don't know what your plans are for this tune, it sounds like you're calling this one a wrap and are ready to move on to the next one.

That's good. You never want to get married to one song.

Anyway, good tune, and good job despite little ole me wanting to hear more of the guitars.
Cheers.
:D
 
I agree with andrush that the drums are probably too loud in the new mix. At least early in the mix.

I heard fewer pops tho. That's good.
 
I really, really like this song. The performances were equally impressive. Only complaint is I get jealous when I listen to this good stuff.
 
Maybe there's something wrong with my ears. I think all this mix needs is a bit more guitar and about a 2dB cut on the drum bus. Vocals, piano, bass, all work really well together.
 
Love the bass guitar change. Perfect.

Did you EQ the bass drum? It sounds a bit boxy. Perhaps try a mid range scoop (500hz) on it. I dunno.

I love the way the cymbals have a nice long dispersion on this tune. I think if you take them down a DB relative to everything else you'll still retain it.
 
New mix in the OP.

I beefed the guitars slightly. I put back in a clean rhythm guitar track on the right that I had dropped for the reasons explained above. It comes in after the first chorus. There's also a new rhythm guitar on the right under that ascending bridge before the final chorus.

I'm having a hard time hearing where the level of the drums should be. Any thoughts?
 
Drum level sounds fine to me.

Guitars could still come up a bit.

At least the left side. It IS an imprtant component of the music bed.

You could have it a bit louder in the intro and first verse of the song and then bring it down some.

A bit more prominence in the beginning, and when it is brought down, the listeners brain will fill it in.

Just saying this cause it's some nice guitar work, and should be heard better.

Of course this could all be subject to my own tastes.

But overall, I like this newest mix best.
:D
 
Firstly let me say I get used to hearing songs a certain way and then I get biased. It is a character flaw. :D

I like the guitar balance.

There is a kind of weird double cymbal hit at 1:52. It is on the other mix as well. Did I do that?

I think the drums are a little low now - especially the bass drum. Maybe split the difference between this mix and the previous? Or maybe just give it a little more bass drum.

Here is the main thrust of my post: IMO Nick's lead vocal is super strong - it stands on its own - doesn't need a lot of supplements or fills. Strongly prefer the previous mix in this regard.

The backup vocals are sometimes muddy :-)42), sometimes unnecessary from musical sense (1:39). The "woahhh" at 1:39 I think shouldn't be there because this is a dynamic low in the song and a nice moment for guitar and cymbals. To put a vocal fill there makes the low less low thus reducing the dynamic range, and kinda takes the spotlight from a nice musical moment. At :42 I am not hearing harmony between leads and backups, it almost sounds like someone is talking behind the lead. I bet if you turned it up I would hear the harmony but that wouldn't fit quite right either. In some of the other instances I am hearing the harmonies, and the execution is fine, but I just don't think they make the lead better. IMO this is the case at 2:30, :57, 1:02, 1:09, 1:18, 1:22, 1:39, and 1:50.

JMO but in this case I think the lead should be singularly out front and backups should be subtle and sparing.
 
Maybe I'll do another mix later in the week, before we move on. I actually preferred the lead and harmony vox balance on the first mix. It was the most spare of the three mixes, which let the harmony vocals be heard while being quite low in the mix. I may move back in that direction. I'll look into that cymbal hit.
 
Whatever the outcome, YOU'RE the one that has to be happy with it.

Not like any of us are music industry execs cutting you a check. :D
More like Monday morning armchair quarterbacks.
:D
 
Maybe, but it is a collective project. I'm not happy with the track unless Nick and Dave feel good about the way they sound.
 
Hi Ray, the instruments sound great, not sure the vocals are sitting right though. Maybe just some delay or verb, a little shelf around 6k or so? I think that would make it so you might not have to worry about doubles/harmonies so much too.

The outro is still my favorite part, the "jive talk" part was really fun. :D

Edit: the previous mix sounds right on vocal wise, imho (maybe some effects got disabled during latest bounce?). I'm kind of in the less is more camp I think. I really like the way back background vocals between phrases though.
 
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Hmmm....

The vox sound a lot more sparse in this mix. Did you drop some multi-tracking on the lead? A few words here and there are getting buried now, especially lyrics that line up with the crashes.
The bgvox does sound a little out-of-sync with the lead now. Like the timing is a little off.

I think I prefer the previous mix, honestly.
 
Listening to mix #2.

Still liking the clean guitars. The bass comes in at the "right" time now IMO. Bass sounds pretty nice. Maybe just slightly sterile. Could you add some low mid in? Like somewhere in the 400hz - 600hz region. Or maybe back off any low end boost you might have made.

I'm not hearing any pops or vocal artifacts now.

I like the backing answer back vocal. I think they need to be at least doubled. Maybe do 4 tracks and pan a pair to each side.

Drums don't need to be touched. They're real good.

Everything now is a minor nit. It sounds excellent.
 
I like double-tracked vocals - you put in the extra effort, and double or triple tracking lead and harmony vocals makes mixes sound fuller, and more professional - but you do need to bring the double down a bit, especially during the quieter parts. Good song. I do agree with Chili, however, re: Whitman's Tower - there's a bookstore depository in Dallas, and I'm sure it wouldn't be cool to call it Ozwald's Building.
 
Listening to mix 2...

Backup vocals seem out of sync and somewhat inaudible - just a low droning sound
Left guitar too loud in V1 - little on right side so it feels imbalanced
Right guitar too loud in V2 - same idea as V1
Dual guitars section - left still too loud
This seems to be a recurring issue in your mixes
Cymbal masking the lead vocal occasionally when hit

The rest sounds good...
 
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