Late arriving Musicians

witzendoz said:
I was actually writing this as a guide for performing musicians not to get there late. As a sound engineer I pride myself on giving every act the best possible sound that can be achieved with the gear available and the room acoustics. For me to do this the musicians themselves have to give me half a chance by getting there early and telling me what they need.
Click to expand...
I'd like to make it clear that I was not in any way trying to disagree with this part. The performer really should act professional too. That means making sure to bring everything you need, arriving early ("if you're on time, you're late"), communicating clearly and courteously with the rest of the team, and preferably planning ahead for any contingencies. It also means dealing gracefully with obstacles and sometimes just working with what you've got. Really, all the same things the sound person should be doing.

I never really expect anybody else to live up to the standards I hold for myself, but wouldn't it be nice?

I actually only run sound for a couple shows a year, but just this past week was the annual music festival in my town, and I'm on the crew that provides sound for many of the venues. One of the guys (one of my oldest friends actually, who started running sound by helping me way back in high school) got fired after Friday night cause he was in a terrible mood and was I guess pretty shitty to some of the performers. It was pretty embarrassing for me because of my association with him. The club he was in is run by friends of mine and I kind of talked him up and then...

The last band I mixed last night was calling me out from the stage "Let's hear it for Ash Blackwater making us sound great!" I established a good rapport with all of my performers and everything went smoothly. I was lucky to work with some real pros who actually did show up prepared and on time, but really so did the other guy. He was just being a dick. He has lame excuses.

Right now I get to go haul the last of our PAs out of the venues where we left them last night.
 
Oh well, happened again last week.

The music club I am mixing for has now moved to a new venue, they have a house system which is small but good and as the venue is very small it sounds very good also. Due to the venues mixer being confined to the side of stage I take my own QSC Touchmix16 and I pad control it, plus have stored the settings, all channels muted, FOH and monitor EQ, vocal channels settings ETC, which makes it very easy for me to set up.

Anyway enough background, the venue opens at 7.30pm, the first act starts at 8.15pm. Last week the first act had not arrived by 8.10pm so Steve who organises the gigs there grabbed a guitar and started to set up for the first spot to replace the no show. But at 8.14pm the first act walks in and starts to mess around getting her guitar out "oh I don't have a cable to plug it in" no surprise there, I find one. It's now 8.20pm so I ask if she could hurry up "oh I am not booked to start until 8.15pm" comes the reply. When I informed her it was already 8.20pm the look on her face was classic and Steve thought my replay was classic.

What world do people live in? I will say that when we got started she was very good.

Alan.
 
witzendoz said:
I do the sound at a music club one night a week, usually close to $0 but because I believe in keeping this venue open I don't mind. It is a club where people come to listen not get drunk and talk. I get there a good 2 hrs before the show, so I can check the PA is working correctly, as I am not the only one using it through the week, and to get everything that is needed ready and checked. I can then take my time and relax and also fix any PA problems that may show up.

2 things are happening very regularly now:

First I get told things like I only need 1 mic and a DI for my guitar, only to find when they get there, oh some of my friends are playing so now I need 4 vocal mics, 3 DI's and mics for the drum kit. Oh and we have a cello with no pickup fitted:spank:.

Second (and this also applies to the acts above) we are say 5 mins out from show time and the first act rocks up (often complete with above instructions) and wants a sound check, two things, the room now has customers, and they are starting in a few mins anyway, remembering I have probably been sitting around for an hour with nothing to do.

This week took the cake, often when a second or third act has a drummer we try to have the drums set up before the first act (often a solo) starts. Well, the first act was very late, I am getting them on stage when the drummer rocks up from the second band. So its time to start the show and the drummer says he can keep setting up while the first acts is performing, which is very disrespectful. They then start arguing with me when I say no and tell them they are acting unprofessional, sigh! By the way did I say that the stage list for the second act did not say they had a drummer :facepalm:

Why is it that musicians do not act in a professional manner when given the chance to play a club where the audience is actually interested in what they do, run by people that actually care about them. This includes me, as I try to give them the absolute best sound I can. When I am playing a gig I turn up a good hour before to talk to the sound guy about what I/we would like, then if possible set up and sound check.

Alan.

P.S They wonder why I sometimes get grumpy. :mad:
Click to expand...


are they really musicians ? or wannabee garage bands.

for sure they are not professional
else they are superstars who have become way too arrogant with really big egos
 
mr average said:
are they really musicians ? or wannabee garage bands.

for sure they are not professional
else they are superstars who have become way too arrogant with really big egos
Click to expand...

We get a lot of very professional / quality acts at the club that make good money from playing other gigs, they like to play there because people listen to them unlike most gigs where beer and loud talking rule and the musicians play in the background. It is also a good opportunity for side projects (from the musicians usual bands) to get an outing. We do however like to give a wide range of acts a chance to play to keep the night interesting. It is not however a garage band type gig and it is defiantly not an open mic type of gig. Acts that do mess us around don't get another gig in a hurry.

Alan.
 
My best one of last year was the act that arrived, audience in their seats already and handed the sound guy their phone. He looked, signed and pulled out the already connected 3.5mm cable and plugged it in (thank god not a latest iPhone with no headphone socket). He asked for the code. She said she couldn't give it him, but if he kept touching the screen it wouldn't lock. She then started frantically searching and prodding. It's not here - It's not here!!! She said she was playing it at work ten minutes ago and had been editing it. Was it by chance on your server? Blank look. Turned out the music wasn't;t even on her phone but her work server, and as she wasn't at work any more ...........

She was, apparently a professional, honestly. My band played at a festival in the summer, and thought one band, were very 'thin'. Two mics, two people, two guitars. Turned out they were actually using tracks, but had plugged them into the stage box without telling the PA guys. No soundcheck because the people were already sitting there. Eventually, by their final song, the PA guy spotted two random channels with something on it, and shoved the fader up revealing drums and bass. Their fault for not being told there even were tracks.
 
rob aylestone said:
My best one of last year was the act that arrived, audience in their seats already and handed the sound guy their phone. He looked, signed and pulled out the already connected 3.5mm cable and plugged it in (thank god not a latest iPhone with no headphone socket). He asked for the code. She said she couldn't give it him, but if he kept touching the screen it wouldn't lock. She then started frantically searching and prodding. It's not here - It's not here!!! She said she was playing it at work ten minutes ago and had been editing it. Was it by chance on your server? Blank look. Turned out the music wasn't;t even on her phone but her work server, and as she wasn't at work any more ...........

She was, apparently a professional, honestly. My band played at a festival in the summer, and thought one band, were very 'thin'. Two mics, two people, two guitars. Turned out they were actually using tracks, but had plugged them into the stage box without telling the PA guys. No soundcheck because the people were already sitting there. Eventually, by their final song, the PA guy spotted two random channels with something on it, and shoved the fader up revealing drums and bass. Their fault for not being told there even were tracks.
Click to expand...


people are stupid and lazy whether musicians or not
and they dont think at all
do they expect another chance when they totally effupp the first time?
 
witzendoz said:
We get a lot of very professional / quality acts at the club that make good money from playing other gigs, they like to play there because people listen to them unlike most gigs where beer and loud talking rule and the musicians play in the background. It is also a good opportunity for side projects (from the musicians usual bands) to get an outing. We do however like to give a wide range of acts a chance to play to keep the night interesting. It is not however a garage band type gig and it is defiantly not an open mic type of gig. Acts that do mess us around don't get another gig in a hurry.

Alan.
Click to expand...


Then that shoudl be a problem that quickly corrects itself
just block the offenders for a long time and then make them agree in writing to some basic ground rules if they want another shot
 
Mickster said:
Come on.......don't go through life that way. You're gonna miss a lot of good stuff.
Click to expand...

i guess i have just more worthless losers who dont care about anybody but themselves than you have
or maybe my threshold for tolerating them has been worn down over the decades of those people causing problems for the rest of us
 
wkrbee said:
Having been on both sides of the situation,I have seen bands that show up late expressly to screw with the first band,take their time getting off the stage after soundchecking so that the first band has to set up after the doors have opened,and OTOH seeing the sound guy make the other bands sound like crap-no effects on vocals/vocals buried/etc.-until their friends go on.All of a sudden the mix is great and everything sounds good.It's pitiful that some bands do anything they can to make the other bands on the bill look bad to cover up their own inadequacies.
Click to expand...
WOW, that brings back memories when I was playing original material. Bands so insecure they did all of the above.
 
Did you just quote yourself?

So here is the deal as I know it from my personal experience. If a soundman is working for the headline band, they are required to save the good stuff for the head line promoted performer. Sucks, but that is what happens. With touring bands that may even be in the contract with the promoter/artist/venue.

Now, take that into perspective upon the venue and just how popular the band getting all the love is? If it is a local band and a venue with limited board and no ability to have extra channels or a mixing console with presets, it just makes sense that the band that is being paid the big money gets the soundcheck and mixer set.

To think that you would get the soundman to make you sound as good as the headline band is kind of silly. Unless you know someone at the venue, you are likely at the mercy of ....

I have also found that if you have your shit together, the soundman does not have to do much anyway. Think about that. Should you not already sound good on stage without the FOH helping you?

I find many bands just forget that your sound is your sound. With exception of maybe vocals, and the size of the venue, you should sound good before you get there. If that does not make sense to you, then you already placed yourself in the last in line for a pro FOH engineer to give a shit about you and your band sound.


Now as far as not being on time or taking set time from others; That is never cool for anyone to do. But again, shit happens. If out of arrogance and trying to fuck with others, well then they will not be doing music for long. We remember that shit.

I have been lucky enough to be in the headlining slot multiple times many years ago. I also have been honored to open for numerous signed/popular bands at large venues. At the larger venues (4000+), it is typical for the headlining act to have all there shit mic'd and channels of the board set from soundcheck. Even some the smaller venues that my band opened for the likes of Dream Theater, Suicidal, Fates Warning, Savatage, had their own stage manager that made the decision to set up everything in advance. We got to set up and play on limited stage and with minimal PA support. Even at the big 9000 plus gigs including Mile High Stadium that we played, the amount of PA was limited by the soundman in charge.

But, if you are not dicks, you sound good, you have a knowledgeable soundman, and you don't suck, it can go much better.
 
Last edited:
Back in my full time musician days. When we had agents and managers. The manager, or booking agent would send stage plot/tech riders, and hospitality riders before the contracts were even signed. Don't see much of this anymore, unless it's a well known act.
 
Toastedgoat said:
Back in my full time musician days. When we had agents and managers. The manager, or booking agent would send stage plot/tech riders, and hospitality riders before the contracts were even signed. Don't see much of this anymore, unless it's a well known act.
Click to expand...

I was one of those receiving those stage plots. I learned not to trust them because they'd frequently be out of date. Managers and booking agents often had no idea what the current technical requirements of the band were, even to the point of using plots that had former band members on them. It was generally a lot safer to wait for the band to arrive and ask them in order to avoid setting the stage twice.
 
you said the first act was very late so if they have to deal with a drummer setting up it's on them and not the drummer ..... the first act was the one being unprofessional by being very late.

I mean, I don't care, everything about all my gigs is always professional and on-time ...... I never run into the stuff you're complaining about ..... but this sounds like a very low paying gig and, as such, you're getting people who don't do a lot of professional gigs ...... gonna be a lack of understanding on their part
 
Oh dear, happened again last week, no sign of the first act 5 min to start time, we got hold of them via a message and they wrote down the wrong start time (what is it with musicians and diaries?) :facepalm::facepalm: Anyway they were almost there and actually did turned up 15 min after start. Got them on stage quick (1 voc and 1 guitar easy), cut their set time but also allowed for a shorter change over as fortunately the second act (full Band) was set up and sound checked ready to go, got there nice and early.

These acts are not rubbish acts, they are good sounding acts, but how is it people can be so disorganised? Why do acts leave it so late to turn up anyway, my own gigs I am always there at least 1 hour before start, then if there are any set up problems, start time late change, flat tyre on the way LOL, or anything else that can go wrong its all under control. I get to this gig 3 hours before start to get the sound happening, just in case the PA has been moved around (they hold functions there), the PA has a problem, or something is missing and I have to organise a replacement. I also set up my own mixer for the house PA as I have all my settings saved for setup starting points. I get set up, have a beer, talk to the boss, greet the acts that show up on time, relax , etc.

Alan.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top