Johny Cash accoustic guitar sound

S

sooper8

New member
Hi folks- does anyone know how to get the Johny Cash accoustic guitar sound from the American series albums?
Would it be possible to recreate that deep rich sound in a home recording setting?
And if anyone has any ideas on getting that piano sound too? I guess it is going to have to be a close approximation using some kind of room verb type plug in? (seeing as I don't have a real piano)
thanks in advance
 
This question gets asked a lot. Usually, with some variation, but bottom line "How can I get (insert name) sound?

The usual answers are:

1. Get (insert name) to play it. That tone is all in his hands.

2. You can't get it without using the guitar he played, the mics he recorded in, the room he played in, and the high end equipment that was used to record it.

3. Someone will chime in and say that if you use (insert name) pre amp, and (insert name) mic, and record in a properly treated room, then you can get close to that.

The real bottom line is that you have to experiment with your mics, your pre amps, your guitars, and make sure that you are in a room that has been properly treated. There is no magic way to get the sound of a professional musician in a professional studio. But you can get close, and that's the best you can hope for. Study the insert that came with that box set. There are lots of close up shots of him doing the recording session, and he even explains some of how it was done. You can approximate where the mics were in relation to his guitar. If you look close, you can even see which mics he was using. I have it, but not with me, or I'd break it out and tell you.

The other thing to remember that they were probably going into very expensive pre amps, and most consumer grade pre amps pale in comparison. But with some careful tweaking, you can match it.

The last piece of the puzzle is how it was mixed. A good graphic eq will be your best friend. Along with a good compressor and reverb.

Experiment. We all had to at one time. There are websites that will tell you how to mic an acoustic guitar if you google it. And learning how to use your effects, be it plugins or outboard gear, will go a long way toward achieving the sound you are after.

One thing to remember: it's damn hard to get a $60 no-name acoustic to sound like a Martin D45...
 
Thanks for the reply!

Well, I appreciate the reply and I get the feeling that although it wasn't a dumb question that really it is an almost impossible task?
I am going to give it a really good try and play with mic placement, reverb and some eq
I suppose I was just looking for the shortcut with a quick fix on some plug in or another.(which perhaps was a bit unrealistic)
I have a very good approximation of the playing style and I even have a decent accoustic guitar - in fact everything sounds similar but just lacking that 'umph' when it comes to getting it recorded
Thanks anyway!
 
sooper,

One more thing to remember about Cash's "American" recordings is that they were mastered by Vlado Meller. Now, Vlado has both friends and foes when it comes to his mastering approach, which is basically slamming the compression through the roof.

I like Cash's work a lot, but I wish the discs had more 'real' dynamics. But that may be the 'oomph' you are hearing on the guitar.

Best,
C.
 
sooper8 said:
Well, I appreciate the reply and I get the feeling that although it wasn't a dumb question that really it is an almost impossible task?
Click to expand...


Not an impossible task at all.

There's isn't any more magic fairy dust in Rick Rubin's hands that wasn't in Cash's hands that isn't in anyone else's hands. Unless those records you're refering to represent the only great accoustic guitar recordings ever made. :D

It's just a really great-sounding source that was captured well, by people with years of experience under their belts. Just like with anything else, after you do it enough times, you hone it and you get better at it.
 
great acoustic sound

..well, there are a lot of great accoustic guitar sounds recorded ( Joni Mitchell is up there with the best IMHO) but I think it was the play between that rich guitar and the piano I was looking to capture from Cash's American sessions.
Maybe it is the compression that gives the 'umph' as Daisy points out...I shall give it a go.
Many thanks for your comments folks!
 
My personal opinion is that if your guitar sounds nothing like his, you won't get his sound.

Guitar/playing style will make the biggest difference. Having the same kind of microphones/setup won't hurt either.

I haven't heard a lot of his songs. Can you give an example of which song you are talking about?
 
Cosmic said:
sooper,

One more thing to remember about Cash's "American" recordings is that they were mastered by Vlado Meller. Now, Vlado has both friends and foes when it comes to his mastering approach, which is basically slamming the compression through the roof.

I like Cash's work a lot, but I wish the discs had more 'real' dynamics. But that may be the 'oomph' you are hearing on the guitar.

Best,
C.
Click to expand...

I have to agree here. I was surprised to hear the borderline distortion on these discs. There is definitely a "richness" to the guitar and vocals, but they are slammed hard.
 
sooper8 said:
..well, there are a lot of great accoustic guitar sounds recorded ( Joni Mitchell is up there with the best IMHO) but I think it was the play between that rich guitar and the piano I was looking to capture from Cash's American sessions.
Maybe it is the compression that gives the 'umph' as Daisy points out...I shall give it a go.
Many thanks for your comments folks!
Click to expand...
A lot of the oomph might be coming from the piano too, if you are listening to them played together...
 
omtayslick said:
I have to agree here. I was surprised to hear the borderline distortion on these discs. There is definitely a "richness" to the guitar and vocals, but they are slammed hard.
Click to expand...
Agreed. They are slammed hard. I can understand it to a point. A lot of the recordings were just Cash and his guitar. His voice was leaving him at the end; the man was in his late 70's! But he still managed to capture the essence and the feel.
 
Rokket said:
Agreed. They are slammed hard. I can understand it to a point. A lot of the recordings were just Cash and his guitar. His voice was leaving him at the end; the man was in his late 70's! But he still managed to capture the essence and the feel.
Click to expand...

I hadn't considered that. Good point.
 
It was recorded in his living room in the cabin down at the lake where he spent most of his late life, replicating that kind of environment might help (tall roofs, wood walls and floor etc.)
But the most important part will be to have your finger broken, and healed back with the thumb slightly crooked which will give you his chugging guitar syle.


Mike
 
I listened to some of the samples Amazon has up for the recordings. The guitar sounds fairly close-mic'd and is heavily compressed. With plugins you might be able to get a similar sound with skillful use of a multiband comp on the guitar. Most broadband compressor plugs would squash the highs too much IMO.
 
Ok first of all the guitars used....

I read Johnny was using 50s Martins for the stuff he did, mostly D28s and D18s so that can be a big part of his sound right there I also have seen a picture somewhere of Johnny sitting in front of a rather smug looking microphone that most likely cost as much as my house. I think that might have been his only mic for "his" tracks and then stuff would get dropped on later by guys like Marty Stuart.... A few other pictures I have seen showed a big huge oriental rug hanging from the rafters, one beside him and one in back... Now that might have just been for the photo shoot, but I am thinking that it would have been enough work to get that thing in place, that they left it there from the recordings.

I have a pre war D28 and with the right amount of compression I can get that sound too come "close" I have tried using my re tubed MXL 960 placed about chest high and singing and playing at the same time and it reaches a bit of the sound, I throw a multi band compressor on the mess and slam things up a bit, leave out reverb and keep things pretty dry.

I think the thing to take note of is that Johnny and his guitar took up most of the low mids in the recordings, while guest guitar players took up mids and highs, piano took the really high stuff and the bass.
 
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