issues with a patch bay

osus

osus

New member
okay, i've spent an hour or so reading posts and instruction manuals, and i think i have a basic grasp of how patch bays should work. i have a neutrik 48 plug patch bay that i'm trying to use to route the outputs from my mixer into the inputs on my delta 1010.

here are my issues:

1) i can't get it to work at all. i've set it up 'normal', with the eight outputs of my mixer and the eight inputs of the delta 1010 into the patch bay, with channel '1' of the mixer above input '1' of the delta 1010, and so on. nothing happens when i have it set up like this. i've tried swapping the position from top to bottom on each channel, and got the same result. i've been using xlr to trs cables from the mixer into the patch bay, and regular 1/4 to 1/4 from the patch bay into the delta 1010. is this the problem? will mixing ts and trs cables in the same mess things up?

2) i have additional sources beyond the mixer that i'd like to be able to switch out with the mixer outputs (and plug into the delta 1010) without having to crawl around the back of the rack. it seems to me like a patch bay should be able to accomodate this (i plug all my sources into the back of the patch bay, plug my eight recoring channels into the back of the patch bay, and then use patch cables on the front to switch things out as needed.) will this work, and if so, how?

thanks!
 
Half normalled is pretty much the standard way to set up a patchbay so that the signal flows from the rear top jack to the rear bottom jack, without needing to patch it in front.

So the outputs of your mixer would be connected to the top rear jacks, and the corresponding bottom rear jacks would go out to your interface.
 
Normalled should work Half Normalled would be better...

Could be something as simple as feeding the mixer outputs to the Delta outputs... you're so busy at the patch bay you haven't looked to either side of it...
 
Does it work when you use a patch cable?

In that case you may need to flip the individual modules around so that the side facing the back is now facing the front, and visa versa.
 
thanks for the replies, i haven't been back to my practice space/recording playground to try out the options... i'm most inclined to think that littledog's suggestion is the solution--i got the patchbay used and haven't tried opening it up, but i have tried the following configurations:

mixer into top rear, delta 1010 into bottom rear, nothing on the front

mixer into bottom rear, delta 1010 into top rear, nothing on the front

and both of the above with a patch cable connecting the top and bottom of the same channel on the front.

regardless of if it's normalled or half normalled with regular back-to-front operation, one of these above should work, no? which is why i think maybe my issue is the back-to-front-ness. i still have no clue what i'm talking about, though.

so mixing trs and ts cables in a single channel shouldn't cause a problem?

thanks again for the replies, i'll try opening it up tomorrow and playing around with the cards...
 
half-normaled and normaled will work. I'm assuming you want to normal the Delta's inputs to the mixer outputs? In this configuration the console's channel outputs will feed the Delta's inputs with no patching required. First double and triple check to see you have the patchbay modules flipped in the right direction. It sounds like they are in what's called an isolated or "open" configuration. In that configuration the top row of the patch bay won't feed the bottom row unless a patch cord is inserted. To acheive the normalled configuration I talked about above you need to feed the channel outputs of your mixer to the TOP REAR jacks of your patchbay. The Delta's inputs need to be connected to the BOTTOM REAR jacks of the patchbay. That's all you have to do. Why do are you using TS cables for the Delta inputs? I'm pretty sure the Delta's inputs are balanced and the neutrik bay is a balanced bay. Do not use unbalanced connections. Do not go from balanced to unbalanced if at all possible. Use 1/4" TRS cables, they will save you quite a headache. I'm also curious as to your console. It doesn't sound like the typical home-recorder console since it has XLR connectors for the channel ouputs. It seems suspect to me because usually only larger format more expensive consoles have XLR's for channel outputs and it seems odd to only use eight of the channels for outputs. Thanks uncle Nubs!
 
Definitely make sure the circuit boards are positioned correctly for the configuration you want. Also try pulling the connectors out slightly while sending a signal from the mixer to the 1010. Sometimes TRS connectors are not the right length from the shield to the tip due to poor quality control, especially with budget connectors. Also, as previously mentioned, use balanced TRS cables with all connections. Also, as previoulsy stated, you may want to go directly from the mixer to the 1010 to be sure it is working properly. The half normalled mode should be the best since it will send the signal directly to the 1010 when no outboard gear is inserted, but will allow you to insert effects into path as needed, or inject an alternate signal to the 1010 when desireable, or even split the output between the 1010 and another device (monitor, headphone amp, etc.)
 
thanks again, i haven't had an opportunity to put everyone's suggestions to the test, but i'm pretty confident from studying neutrik's diagrams that the previous owner flipped the cards from front to back which is causing my issues (as several have suggested).

sweetnubs--i'm using ts connectors from the patch bay to the delta because it's what i've got--i got a bought a whole mess of equipment used from a friend and he had an eight channel unbalanced snake. the delta and the patch bay are both balanced, and i'll definitely be replacing the snake with a balanced equivalent when money allows (and providing i don't just save up to replace the entire rig). but if the only disadvantage is the usual sacrifice in sound quality and noise level, then it's gonna hafta wait, unfortunately...

the mixer is a big old soundtech 1604. it has sub outs and two aux channels for effects that i'm tricking into a total of six submix channels, which are all coming from six xlr outs. again, it came with an xlr to trs eight channel snake, which i'm making do with--ideally i'd rather use all sixteen channels out to the patch bay from their inserts and have the sub-mixes, auxes and main patched seperately for when i actually want to sub-mix, add record-time effects and/or get a quick, pre-mixed 'live' sound. but that means investing in sixteen channels of insert-to-stereo ts connectors, and probably a second patch bay. and that runs into money. so... for now...

thanks again for the responses, i'll post my findings in case they help anyone else (although i think the root of the problem was a 50%-50% blend of ignorance-of-patch-bay-operation and... well, me)
 
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