Is this engineering job worthy?

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chessrock

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I just got done doing some work for a really nice group of Chicago musicians who call themselves Johnny 5 Gallon.

Wanted to get some input on whether or not you feel this production job is worthy of including on my list of examples/work I've done.

For now, I am pretty satisfied with how things came out. It was a pretty simple/straight-forward production, I'll admit. Nothing too fancy. A few things I liked: Guitar sound and overall mix. A few things I'd like to do over again: Bass guitar had dead strings, and there were some tempo issues during the chorus. Also, the singer didn't always have the best intonation, but he does convey a personality in his voice.

Overall, though, I'm happy considering it was just a "quick and dirty" job.

Song is called "So Dissatisfied." First tune on the list:

http://www.nowhereradio.com/artists/album.php?aid=1298&alid=-1

Thanks in advance for any input.
 
The engineering and mix is just fine. The guitar tone IS very good. The congas are a nice touch and the bass doesn't bother me in the least. The only detractor are the vocals. The singers do indeed convey the emotion of the tune very well but I'm not sure if it's enough to get by the intonation issues, but what the hell. A singer I work with frequently has somewhat the same problem; he has a voice somewhere between Dylan and Morrison. The charactor in his voice superceeds his ability to sing technicly well.
 
sounded a little harsh on my cheap cans .... liked the snare the most ... not sure if it would be my choice to show to people, maybe people in the same style and age group :D . I think you need something that no excuses need to be made for ...
good stuff though little rough but some people like it that way ... love that snare
cheers
 
I'm halfway through the song and I still can't tell if the lead signer is a chick or a guy... :p


Mix sounds fine... the git in the intro was a little thin, but after that it filled out nicely.


O.K.. so... song's almost over now.. and still can't tell if that's a girly man or a manly girl... :D

Somebody wanna clue me in? :p

WATYF
 
chessrock
The engineering sounds GREAT from my end!
A really clean presentation with enough polish to make me envious!
Great Job!
 
:D Alright, WATYF, for your info, that is a dude. Although I don't recall him being overly "girly," he did seem kinda' boyish for a 25-year old. Harmony vocals are 100% chick. Good call on the guitar intro; it could be beefed up a tad.

Thanks for the nice words, Jccm. And Track Rat. I may yet have to get my hands on Autotune if I keep working with these tone-slackers. :D The cheapness factor of my clients never ceases to surprize me; I think they'd rather spend their money on booze or pot than an extra hour's worth of tracking to fix trouble spots. Oh well. :D

Fed, I noticed the sound tends to get harsher, the cheaper the playback system gets. Still walking a fine line between gloss and harsh . . . maybe it's just time to ditch the idea of polish and strive for natural and accurate. I'll keep on tweaking.
 
that is some really good work, chess. :) i like the song. it's really happy.

i especially like the breakdown with the conga.

it's not my style of music, but your recordings sound great from a production standpoint. maybe sometimes i think it sounds a little too clean if you know what i mean. like maybe there's a little more treble than what i'm used to hearing.

i think you are a little critical of your work, but that's a good thing, I guess. i would work with you in a heartbeat, but the windy city is a ways away from nashville. ;)

smiles,

daisy
 
I just wanted to coment on "polish" part and why I said it wouldn't be my choice to show people ... IMHO there are objective (or absolute) things in the song/mix/production like vocal intonaiton, instruments are tuned, rithm and there are subjective (relative) things like instrument/vocal tone, level balance, instrument choice etc.

Again IMHO the objective things need to be perfect (or to the point where I don't notice the imperfections) and this tune is not, the subjective ofcourse are just that ... taste ...
cheers
 
Fed, thanks for bringing that up. I'll be obsessing over where to point the mic, getting the proper amp tone . . . not to mention doing the occasional battle with the computer (latency settings, error messages, etc.) . . . looking for the shorted cable, etc . . .

Meanwhile, I forget about the really important objective stuff you mention. Like I said, this was a very "quick and dirty" job, as a lot of my work tends to be. When selecting songs to include in my portfolio, I should look for opportunities where we really get a chance to work on and perfect things so as to put my best foot forward. Thanks again for the advice.
 
hey chess

I hear in mono on my cans ... It sounded great!

I'll listen tomorrow in stereo and hear how it sounds.

I dont know were I hear it... but there are too much highs on something...

Great work!

Uh oh... last drum hit was off for the drummer... :)

I'll have to stop by your studio when Im down in the city sometime!
 
it sounds like it was recorded well, but there are some pitch problems with the vox.. it sounds a little too bright.. the percussion is cool but the bass drum sounds a little low.. so does the snare.. some sour notes in that solo too.. when it's good, it sounds good though.. last drum hit was off..

I guess you have to draw the line somewhere, but as for your question "is the engineering job worthy?" I would say that depends on how much you charged! :eek:

No I wouldn't use it as a showcase tune because of the negatives..
 
B.SABBATH said:

No I wouldn't use it as a showcase tune because of the negatives..
Click to expand...

I agree...

...but if it gets you jobs that you think you will enjoy being a part of...then does the quality of it really matter? Really?

It is good, but has many "home recorded" issues with it.
 
That drummer doesn't play very hard, does he? The kick is too weak.

I didn't dig that bass tone either. It's nice and even but lacks character. Needs some mids.

I don't agree with the panning on the guitars. I would have run 'em closer to center or maybe bus a short verb of each guitar to the opposite side to make 'em blend better.

All minor nit-picks though. Overall pretty good chess.
 
Sounds good overall. The kick was a bit weak and the bass does sound a bit dead, no punch. Dig that snare though. You're fully aware of the musician side issues, beyond that it sounds pretty darn nice. If presenting to others, they may not have the same sense to separate the musicians from the tracking and engineering. IMHO this is a fine engineering effort :D
 
I thank everyone for their nice comments, but I'm afraid I've come to the conclusion that my engineering job wasn't quite worthy on this effort.

In my own defense, it really is a tough situation to be placed in. On one had, the client wants to be in and out, mostly to save money; partly to save time. I feel like a freakin' fast food drive-through window. Our session was 11 hours total for 4 songs, including mixing/mastering/burning.

That's less than 3 hours/song. Hell, normally I need (at least) that much time just to mix each tune to my standards! :D So what do you do? I guess you take the job for the extra cash, but you don't fool yourself or the client in to thinking you can actually do a job worthy of bragging over.

I'm going back to the drawing board and remixing this one; on my own time. I just want to see how good I can get it if I spend real time on it.

Thanks again for your comments and encouragement. It really is a treat and a blessing to be able to get so much quality, even expert feedback in some cases on a site like this. :D Long live the mp3 clinic, and thanks so much for the great advice.

Back to the drawing board!
 
if you can get this good a sound in 3 hours, spend some extra time on it for the portfolio version. you are not, however going to solve the singers pitch problems imo. so take that into consideration when deciding whether to spend more time on this.

the drums sound awsome, cept the bass drum, not loud enough. i second the comments about maybe tuning up the snare and bass drum as well.

guitar sounds great, bass guitar is kind of dead, vocals are very clear.

i'm not sure if most of the stuff that needs fixing is within your 'engineering' control. i guess there is only one way to find out.

btw, where is your studio or do you really just do this out of your home?

also, that opening guitar line reminds me a lot of a song by the indigo girls :).
 
erichenryus said:
if you can get this good a sound in 3 hours, spend some extra time on it for the portfolio version. you are not, however going to solve the singers pitch problems imo. so take that into consideration when deciding whether to spend more time on this.
Click to expand...

You're right. I should give it up. Maybe I could pull a Lance job and re-do the bass (after changing the strings of course). ;) The kick would be pretty easy to fix. The vocals might be tough to pull off, though, and I'm not sure if Autotune is up to the task. And the guitar solos . . . I just don't know. I suppose I could retrack the whole thing and start my own mixerman diaries. :D
 
The song really cool - I liked it a lot. I thought you did a good job of recording.

This is just me, but I thought you could get a better tone on the guit. It was a little harsh (over mid-ranged). However, I think it's close to the type of sound you would want on a song like this. If it were me, I'd retrack the lead vocals. The guy (or is it a girl WAYTF) has a real nice voice for this style of music. If all the notes get hit correctly, it's going to be great. Something's wrong with the vox on the last note they hit (when they slide the note down).

If the bass had dead strings I liked it anyway. It could be brought upin the mix just a smidge.

Good song and good job. For three hours of work - terrific job.

Trip...
 
yeah i wasn't that impressed with the guitar tone...

however i thought the overall mix was really nice. esp. for such a quick job, great work.
 
I agree with everyone who said to *not* put it in your portfolio, but I don't think it's really your fault, you know, you're pretty much taking a picture of what they give you, so that's gotta be frustrating sometimes as an engineer. If I came into your studio, and you played me this, I'd think, hmmm, well, okay, thanks anyway. I thought the instrumental part was pretty cool, though (seriously)! :) Except the guitars sound Podified. I think the last song you posted sounded way better.

Macle
 
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