is the v-amp, or j-stat. or POD for me?

[Fetusborg]

hi.
im doing home recordings with VERY few equipment.
its rock format. guitars and basses lined out from CRAPPY amp to SBLive sound card, then sequenced and processed in Kristal audio engine.

may sound to you like it comes out crap, but im tweaking really well and getting great results.

but since my amp is shite, and i really wanna start MICING the amp instead of lining out... i was thinking of buying a v-amp, j-station or POD for this.

i figure id use it to model different types of amps to best suit the sounds i wanna get. im not really interested in the effects the devices provide, all i really want for guitars is in my overdrive/distortion pedal.

do you guys think this is a good idea? or are there just plain amp modelers out there that will do the job for me? (as again, im not interested in the effects - wah, chorus, bla bla that they provide)


ok thanks

 

[therage!]

Do some searches here as it's been covered to death.

Amp modelers are...well...amp modelers. Any of the ones you mentioned will work and many people around here have their preference. You might take a look at the Vox Tone lab too.

 

[Fetusborg]

yeah, i looked around alot here.
but i didnt figure out if there are just simple amp modelers around, or if they all come in with their "stomp-box multi-effects" characteristics.

but i guess i should use my money to get a better sound card.

allright, thanks.

 

[the edzell]

If you've got an amp which gets the tone you want, better to go for a better soundcard. The majority of posters here perfer a amp and mic to a amp sim.

Not to say they don't have their uses. I use the PodXt all the time, however I've just been doing demos so I'm going to start hooking up an amp when I start recording stuff that the public will here.

 

[olfunk]

don't know how much of a budget you're on, but the best amp modeller i ever came across was the sansamp gt2, amazing little box. check our the tech21 site for soundclips. not much it cant do in the way of sounding like different amps. and there arent any effects, which is good as you said you werent interested.

 

[bongolation]

Amp modelers are...well...amp modelers.

I know a guy who does music soundtrack production for MGM in Hollywood. In his little fooling-around apartment hobby studio, he uses a J-Station for recording bass and guitar (unlike most modelers, it has both guitar and bass amp & cab models) direct. This "hobby" stuff from the lowly J-Station sounds amazing and has wound up on television series and movie soundtracks.

The point here is that a good modeler (and the J-Station was a good modeler) in the hands of a pro can do remarkably good guitar and bass sounds. In the hands of the usual garden-variety chimp, it's going to sound awful and he's never going to shut up about how badly modelers "suck" and don't get the sound of "real" amps.

 

[Fetusborg]

yeah, ive seen the price of the sansamp, and i've read its the most recommended. but its just too expensive.

my budget is the lowest possible
i would buy a used piece from ebay, no doubt about it.

so theres the rub: amp modeler or better mic or better sound card.
i know the answer should be better AMP, but i dont think thats gonna happen. where i live they are too expensive.

Bongolation: i share the same opinion as you. im sure if i get my hands on a j-station, or any amp modeler, i'll make it sound good. i've acquired a touch for getting some good sounds due to the lack of equipment.

plus, the bass option of the j-station would be extremely useful as well.

 

[mikeh]

I own a Pod 2.0, a J-Station & a Bass V-Amp (I got them all at little over cost - so the redundancy of gear was not a major issue).

The main reason I use amp simulations is related to my recording facility. I live is a condo (so I can't get too loud) and my room is not ideal for room sound - thus direct recording/simulation works best for me. In addition, since guitar is not my main axe (I am mainly a drummer with pretty good keyboard chops) owning several amps (or even 1 or 2) "good ones" is not a gear priority. With the simulations, I can get close to the sounds of many different amps for a fraction of the cost (and space).

No one can predict if simulators are right for someone else. Only you can tell and the only way to do that is to trust your ears. That being said, I do have to ageee in theory with bongolation - an amp simulator in the hands of someone willing to work with it can generated some impressive, reasonably authentic amp sounds.

Since I've never owned most of the amps theses devices claim to simulate I can't attest to complete accuracy. However, I have giged/recorded as a pro/semi-pro drummer for close to 40 years and have heard most classic amps in the hands of many guitarists who knew how to get thier sound - and the simulations can come awfully close. In fact, I've had various guitarists (who I respect) in my studio who spent some time on my Pod & J-Station and they were fairly impressed with what these simulators can do.

For what it's worth, I like the J-Station just a little more than the Pod 2.0 (better clean sounds) and much more than a V-Amp.

 

[tdukex]

I've only played the POD 2.0 and the J-staion. I even liked the standard clean tones of the J-station, and it was cheaper, so that's what I bought. And I really couldn't give a shit less if it ever sounds exactly like a Blackface, Vox, or Marshall.

 

[ozraves]

if you're looking to create some synthetic sounds then an amp modeler such as the j-station (my fave of the amp modelers) can be a great tool.

if you're looking for some amp sounds, then buy some amps.

 

[StudioMxpx]

GO with V-amp!!! heres some vamp sound samples http://www.myspace.com/studioprojects

 

[Fetusborg]

yeah, from what ive read, im figuring the j-station is more worth it. simply because im almost sure they all basically produce the same sound, each having their advantages here and disadvantages there...

but the j-station is:
1) cheaper
2) got the bass amp models (goooood thing, in theory).

can anyone tell me how good or useful the bass amp modelings are?
as im almost sure i could probably get the same results using a guitar amp model


but pretty decided i'll get one, instead of also a mic, a better amp (expensive) or even a better sound card.
my room would never really work out to rightfully mic an amp, as its got pretty poor acustics.

aright.


(oh shit... another doubt has popped in , better sound card or j-station, ahhhhhhhhhhh hahaha

 

[metalhead28]

First of all, I am an absolute advocate of micing a real amp! , However, I have experience with a POD and V-Amp as well which I use extensively for scratch tracks and demoing stuff. I will say that for the money ($169), you can't beat the V-Amp with a stick! It has very useable sounds which are right up there with any other modeler and with some knowledgable tweaking can yield pretty convincing results. As someone said earlier, if you know what a good sound is, chances are you can at least get 90% with a modeler whereas people who can't tweak one in are always gonna hate modelers! The only lacking area with the V-Amp I would say are the clean sounds, I find them to be a little dull and with very little headroom. Anyway, for the money you can't go wrong.

 

[bongolation]

The reason the J-Station is probably the best of the cheap modelers is that it has excellent software for programming patches.

Without using the software, programming effectively is almost impossible...yet probably 98% of the people who have derided this modeler in fora I've read have never even connected the unit to a computer -- so, essentially they're bone-ignorant of what the unit can actually do.

The noise floor of the J-Station is better than the other cheap modelers as well, and that's important for recording.

I really think that some of the pros I've heard have produced guitar sounds that I simply can't tell from real amps. They're that good -- but they don't come without patient and knowledgeable programming.

Here are the amp and cab models in the v2.0 firmware:

Guitar & Bass Amp Models

00 J Crunch (based on a JM150 Millennium "crunch" setting)
01 J Solo (based on JM150 Millennium "solo" setting)
02 J Clean (based on JM150 Millennium "clean" setting)
03 Boutique (based on a Matchless DC30)
04 Rectified (based on a Mesa Boogie dual rectifier)
05 Brit Stack (based on a Marshall JCM900)
06 Brit Class A (based on a '63 Vox AC30 top boost)
07 Blackface (based on a '65 Fender Twin Reverb)
08 Boat Back (a piezo acoustic guitar)
09 Flat Top (a dreadnought acoustic guitar)
10 Hot Rod (based on a Mesa Boogie Mark II C)
11 Tweed (based on a '57 Fender Tweed Deluxe)
12 Blues (a dynamic blues setting)
13 Fuzz (a '60s fuzztone)
14 Modern (based on a Trace Elliot bass amp)
15 Rock (based on an Ampeg SVT bass amp)

More A1 (based on a HiWatt Custom 50)
More A2 (based on a '78 Marshall master volume)
More A3 (based on a '81 Marshall JCM800 w/EL34s)
More A4 (based on a '72 Fender Bandmaster)
More A5 (based on a '65 Fender Bassman)
More A6 (based on a SWR Interstellar ODrive)
More A7 (based on a '83 Fender Concert Head)
More A8 (Direct - no modelling)

Cabinet Models

00 - No cabinet
01 - Brit 4X12 (Marshall 1960A w/75W Celestions)
02 - Johnson 4X12V (loaded w/Vintage 30 Celestions)
03 - Fane 4X12 (a HiWatt SE4123 w/Fanes)
04 - Johnson 2X12 (open back w/Vintage 30 Celestions)
05 - American 2X12 (a Fender Twin 2X12)
06 - Jennings Blue 2X12 (a '63 Vox AC30)
07 - Tweed 1X12 (a Fender Deluxe 1X12)
08 - Blonde 2X12 (a Bassman 2X12)
09 - Bass 4X10 w/Tweeter (an SWR 4X10 w/tweeter)
10 - Folded Horn 1X18 (an Acoustic 360)
11 - Flexi Bass (an Ampeg Portaflex)
12 - Green Back 4x12 (a Marshall 1960B w/25W Celestion Greenbacks)
13 - Mega 1516 (a Peavey 1x15 and 2x8)
14 - Boutique 4x12 (a HT 4x12 w/Celestion V30s)
15 - '65 Tweed 1x12 (a Fender '65 Deluxe)
16 - Goliath 4x10 (an SWR Goliath)
17 - Ivy League 1x10 (a Fender Harvard)
18 - Bass Man 4x10 (a Fender Bassman)

 

[bongolation]

can anyone tell me how good or useful the bass amp modelings are?
as im almost sure i could probably get the same results using a guitar amp model

It's possible, but the thing is that the cab models make a great deal of difference with bass, more than with the amp model itself, especially with flatwounds. The differences in the bass amp models are subtle; the differences in the cabs much less so.

If you upgrade your card, I strongly suggest you get one with MIDI I/O and a digital S/PDIF I/O. These features will make working with a J-Station hugely easier.

 

[Fetusborg]

It's possible, but the thing is that the cab models make a great deal of difference with bass, more than with the amp model itself, especially with flatwounds. The differences in the bass amp models are subtle; the differences in the cabs much less so.

If you upgrade your card, I strongly suggest you get one with MIDI I/O and a digital S/PDIF I/O. These features will make working with a J-Station hugely easier.

my soundcard actually already has that. midi i/o and s/pdif.
its a SoundBlaster Live! [FFEO].

i've read all over the place that its not cut out for recording, that i should upgrade, etc. overdriven guitar doesnt come out GREAT,,, but i can deal with it.

but the j-station is really interesting me. i'd find one amp model that i really like, and stick with it, to establish my personal tone.

oh, and great post about all that the j models. i'll refer to that when (read: if) i get one

 

[jitteringjim]

I have a POD 2.0 and a V-Bass. I have a buddy who owns a couple of Ampeg stacks, and I've been able to fool his ears after recording a track mic'd vs direct with the POD. As for the V-Bass, well - it sounds ok. I considered buying a J-Station, but got a better deal on the POD and added the V-Bass later.