Is mastering truly necessary these days?

[Serendipity Records]

While listening to some old CDs today, I pulled this one out, and it's an excellent case of someone obviously not even listening to their work.

In the 80s, when CDs were first coming out, there was a frenzy of albums that were remastered for CD. I have several CDs that had obvious flaws. One was James Gang's first album, which I actually sent back to the company as an example of putting out lousy product. They redid the CD and sent me a new one that was cleaned up. I also have Iron Butterfly's Metamorphosis which has an obvious 60cycle hum in the middle of Butterfly Bleu which lasts for a some time during a particularly quiet section. That was also redone and the new version is fine.

The most glaring example of how bad things were was Steppenwolf's first album. Imagine paying $12 or $14 for a CD and hearing the tape ramp up to speed at the beginning of songs! I still have both the good and bad copies, the only way to tell the difference is to look at the identifier codes on the inter ring of the disk. The bad one has the MCA number and LAL 74, the other has much more information. Everything else, packaging, numbering and labeling is exactly the same. How such a transfer would have made it all the way through mastering, pressing and shipping to store shelves without anyone even noticing is beyond belief.

Here's the start of a couple of the songs. First the proper master, then the botched one.

View attachment 136526

Fun days, eh?

It actually makes for a fun effect! At some point I'll try to (intentionally) apply that effect to a track.

 

[TalismanRich]

This is the Metamorphosis track I mentioned. You could almost understand how this would get under the radar, as it's in the last 5 minutes of a full album and seems to disappear after about 20 seconds, not glaringly in the initial 2 seconds of multiple songs.

There was also a Jefferson Airplane CD that I remember had ticks and pops because it had been mastered from a copy of the record. In those days, you didn't have the type of computer processing where you could easily edit a click in a few seconds. There were a few click and pop filters available, but you could also hear the speed variations from the record.

 

[jtees4]

I'm not technically good on recording, but I've been doing it for 55 years or so. I read tons of books about music, bands, producers etc. etc. What I do know for sure, even speaking about well known engineers, producers etc. (meanings have changed over the years), in the end they all hear sound different, apply different techniques, and end up with a different final product (or sound). Some of the biggest names in the industry hate others final sound on specific recordings. So,bottom line, regardless of who does the mastering....it matters immensely.

 

[RedStone]

I think mastering is essential. Even if you master with an AI platform, you are still in effect the final engineer. So ... You can be the final person, or you can get a second set of professional ears.

This is my experience mixing large format concerts, studio bands, self produced music, and live broadcast ... More ears are good! And professional ears are worth their weight in gold.

 

[markmann]

Now we don’t have absolute requirements for the medium, for example, vinyl pressings, what exactly would a proper, professional mastering engineer do? Change what you have done? They alter your dynamics, they alter the spectral content and they change the level. If your recording is supposed to be say EDM, or metal, or some other very defined ‘club’ your music fits, membership wise, then they can fix faults. If there are no faults, they’re changing your mix, to their preference. I can understand that some music is poorly put together and needs an expert to repair. Some people produce music and put it on here for us to listen to, and their sound is consistant, and nice. They’re happy with it. They made good choices. Sometimes, not choices I would have made, but it is their choices that make it ‘them’. What benefit would paying a 3rd party bring? Something different? They might hate it.

For most people who now self release, would a mastered product result in more streams or downloads? If yours was sh*t originally, yes, for certain. For good stuff, I suspect not at all.

Excellent points. Much of the end result is a matter of taste. I've heard many rock bands say that they dislike the sound of their album due to the fact that they had no control of the final output. As a home recordist I do and I like my mixes and final sound. Could it be better? I'm sure it could if in the hands of the right ME but I think I'm in the ballpark. One problem that I have is that things sound different to me on different days. I wonder how ME's deal with that?

 

[jamesperrett]

One problem that I have is that things sound different to me on different days. I wonder how ME's deal with that?

That's where reference tracks come in handy - something you can use as a fixed point of comparison.

 

[Grustifrut]

It’s not obsolete, but it’s also not magic. Mastering isn’t just for vinyl anymore. It’s still useful for:

- Getting levels and tone balanced across an album
- Making sure it translates across different systems
- Hitting the right LUFS/peak levels for streaming

That said, a good mix that isn’t squashed can go straight to release if you’re careful. You don’t have to pay a mastering engineer, but some kind of final polish or check is still worth doing, even if you’re doing it yourself.

 

[mowtontom2]

Yes...
Cheers

 

[SC7]

Is mastering an arcane/obsolete process for vinyl now used as a grift?

Given that around 90% (in my opinion) of music is listened to on smart speakers or portable audio including car audio there is never going to be a perfect 'Master'. I play lots of my stuff on my car audio and the vocals are not good - they are or can be muddy and at the back of the mix. When I listen to them on my PC in headphones it sounds total class and the reason is that that is how I mixed it. So to get a well mastered track that can be heard perfectly through the above media then it is going to require not one but 2 or 3 masters. That is now tripling the cost. I have some songs I wrote, recorded, and mixed/mastered 30 years ago on a Desktop 486 processor. I had about 4MB RAM and a 365MB hard drive, and used a Soundblaster Live Soundcard. The results are as amazing today as they were back then. I challenge anyone listening to them to say that they are not CD quality. I doubt anyone could have 'mastered' them 'better' than I did. I have since been in touch with atop mastering engineer hoping to get a before and after of a song they have mastered but I wasnt able to obtain one. My worry is that I don't know what one will sound like - but at the moment I am happy with my own results.

 

[CoolCat]

While listening to some old CDs today, I pulled this one out, and it's an excellent case of someone obviously not even listening to their work.

In the 80s, when CDs were first coming out, there was a frenzy of albums that were remastered for CD. I have several CDs that had obvious flaws. One was James Gang's first album, which I actually sent back to the company as an example of putting out lousy product. They redid the CD and sent me a new one that was cleaned up. I also have Iron Butterfly's Metamorphosis which has an obvious 60cycle hum in the middle of Butterfly Bleu which lasts for a some time during a particularly quiet section. That was also redone and the new version is fine.

The most glaring example of how bad things were was Steppenwolf's first album. Imagine paying $12 or $14 for a CD and hearing the tape ramp up to speed at the beginning of songs! I still have both the good and bad copies, the only way to tell the difference is to look at the identifier codes on the inter ring of the disk. The bad one has the MCA number and LAL 74, the other has much more information. Everything else, packaging, numbering and labeling is exactly the same. How such a transfer would have made it all the way through mastering, pressing and shipping to store shelves without anyone even noticing is beyond belief.

Here's the start of a couple of the songs. First the proper master, then the botched one.

View attachment 136526

Fun days, eh?

Reading the SOS article on the Beatles remastered to CD, the 1987 set was done with a lot of "mistakes" it seems. Like the Mono tapes being played trasferred to Digital from a Stereo Head Master Tape deck....really amazing such a project could make mistakes like that. I remember buying them in the "long box".

The story's are interesting though as a collector type.

the 2009 set and by now, Digital had greatly advanced so that was a no brainer improvement but also they had to decide to Make it Sound Better or stay Pure for the Purists. They did kind of both, with releasing a Mono Box set for Purists and the Stereo Box which wasn't adjusted much but improved over the 1987 CD set.
Prism Converters to Pro Tools 24/192k

Its interesting though Mastering to Vinyl, Mono and Stereo..ADAT to ProTools....the evolution to Online Streaming and LUFS.

you mention the 80's as the big transfer to digital...so true...CD's took over in a big way, everything transferred to digital format.
it makes sense there was a lot of slop jobs and possibly not even listened too, because it was 100's of albums being transferred, like McDonald burgers.

 

[DM60]

you mention the 80's as the big transfer to digital...so true...CD's took over in a big way, everything transferred to digital format.
it makes sense there was a lot of slop jobs and possibly not even listened too, because it was 100's of albums being transferred, like McDonald burgers.

I hated pops and clicks (I cleaned and destatic'ed, still pops and clicks) and ran out and purchased CD versions of my favorites. I think you're right. Factory settings, hit play and press on most of the first CD conversions.

 

[SC7]

For most of us, adding an extra person is something we don't want to do, or cannot afford to do - so we don't. The more mixes you do and the better your ears get means that if you did want to use one, you have to find one better than you, who you trust. I figure that is why most of us just don't bother. I've found a few on youtube who seem to think that because they have X or Y plug ins, they are a mastering engineer. They're not. It's a bit like the folk who now re-write the code for the engine management systems in cars. Some don't appear to have ever owned a car?

I agree. I recorded a few songs back in the 90's and have used Cakewalk Apprentice right through to today's Cakewalk Sonar. I did not master them in any way and even today when I play them back I am astounded at the quality of the recording/sound (as are people who care to listen to them - I always make a point of saying don't judge the song ie the lyrics, compiosition etc just let me know what you think of the recording quality. Be it on a car stereo or on an early MP3 player they always sound so good. And I wouldn't want them any other way. They were me (I wrote, recorded, mixed and recorded them all) and no one else had an input. And that is what I admire most about them.
I liken it to painting a masterpiece in oils. Would the artist want someone else to come along and dabble in their work in an attempt to make it more acceptable to the public?

 

[rob aylestone]

Mastering, as a process has changed. Now, real mastering engineers are actually fixing mixing mistakes, as many excellent products are accidentally flawed by the system and the room acoustics they were mixed in. When we were producing old fashioned records, mastering engineers were correcting perfect mixes to mixes that would retain most of the info in a form the medium could cope with. So managing bass, fixing phase issues and other technical stuff vinyl struggles with on a cutting lathe, and then in reverse, on a turntable of perhaps dubious quality.

It was a hugely specialist role then, and now, it’s just different. Their skill set now adjusts to meet the requirements of a genre. Taking premixed stems or the individual tracks and making them blend better.

 

[drtechno]

Is mastering an arcane/obsolete process for vinyl now used as a grift?

For some its more necessary than others, but its also on the style of the mixer. Because the mix guy might be the type that wants a good reflection of the vision of the song and focus on balance and composition and loudness and overall eq balance is not a main focus. But I suggest one if you want something that is translatable, because the master engineer tries the song out on different speakers and makes some final decisions eq wise and of course limiting and of course another set of ears that can give feedback on your mix and recording besides being able to make a few touch ups in processing.

 

[TalismanRich]

"Because the mix guy might be the type that wants a good reflection of the vision of the song and focus on balance and composition and loudness and overall eq balance is not a main focus."

Sorry, but that sounds SO much like the corporate speak I used to hear at meetings. Lots of words that really say nothing, but set the tone for future directions as we implement our strategy and achieve new goals.

 

[DM60]

"Because the mix guy might be the type that wants a good reflection of the vision of the song and focus on balance and composition and loudness and overall eq balance is not a main focus."

Sorry, but that sounds SO much like the corporate speak I used to hear at meetings. Lots of words that really say nothing, but set the tone for future directions as we implement our strategy and achieve new goals.

You say that like it is a bad thing? But really, the corporate suites did make sure product went out and didn't get lost in a "perfect" loop. Everything has a place and a role IMO.

 

[CoolCat]

one of the worst things in the cassette portastudio days was getting all the songs to sound similar.
being cavemen like bar bands...the studios were rare and mastering wasn't even or ever talked about much...as I recall.

the Home Recording world and internet opened all this chatting and forums, and then seems DAW happened and took over, and Mastering Buss Plugins became "mastering"

anyone still own a Alesis MasterLink?
that was kind of cool and supposedly worked, kind of...I never owned one...for CD-R days.

 

[TalismanRich]

You say that like it is a bad thing? But really, the corporate suites did make sure product went out and didn't get lost in a "perfect" loop. Everything has a place and a role IMO.

 

[DM60]

View attachment 153243

That all makes sense to me, what are you trying to point out?

Just being goofy in case it was missed.