Interesting Converter Comparisons ...

  • Thread starter Thread starter chessrock
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chipwits said:
Would like to hear comparison with some cleaner source material though =P.
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I've always thought Fiona Apple's records were very clean and well-produced.

Maybe we just have different ideas on what constitutes "clean" source material. Perhaps the entire pop/rock genre just tends to be a messy audio environment when compared to jazz, classical, etc. And a lot of that, I suppose, is intentional.

I'd be open to something else if anyone has any ideas. I'm certainly going to be posting some comparisons with the samples NL5 is supplying me, which could give a different perspective I suppose.

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chessrock said:
I'd be open to something else if anyone has any ideas. I'm certainly going to be posting some comparisons with the samples NL5 is supplying me, which could give a different perspective I suppose.
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I'm supplying samples?

I can do that, but I didn't know I was to provide the samples. :)
 
My Compy peed the carpet a couple weeks back, so I wasn't able to listen. Wah. Mostly fixed now, but there's still a chalk outline where AVG used to be.

Anyway, I hear a persitent claim that a DI/O makes a really decent converter, if you remove the tube (not turn it down, unplug it) and use a much higher current AC adaptor. For instance.

I use one with the tube pulled, it does OK, and I keep meaning to dig up a stronger adaptor. Maybe a little blind taste test might help me decide if it's worth the trouble...
 
When I tried removing the tube, there just wasn't enough gain on the thing. And you cannot use the input gain control, because it basically sucks -- totally changes the tone.

I think the DI/O is much better suited for louder sources, because the tube stage basically mucks things up, and the input gain is just ... well, bad. And without either, it just kicks out a pretty weak signal.
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chessrock said:
When I tried removing the tube, there just wasn't enough gain on the thing...
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Yeah, somebody mentioned that in the thread I linked, and somebody else weighed in that the hotter adaptor corrected the issue. I'll probably grab the AC plug somewhere, it's worth $25 to find out.
 
Yea, I actually tried the hotter adapter, as well. It works fine for a while, but after a few hours, the DIO really starts to run hot. I don't think it was designed to work with all that extra juice, without making even further modifications to the internal power supply ... at which time, you need to start asking yourself if you would have been better off just buying something better in the first place (the converters are already outdated compared to what most of the newer sound cards are using). But for the person who just really likes to mod things, and has a lot of skill in that department ...

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Hi Chessrock, great comparison this IMO, thanks very much. It's been bugging me why someone with afew different converters at their disposal hasn't done this before! Personally i'm using a 002R and i'm getting my first major converter upgrade in a week or two to a Lavry Blue so out of my own curiosity i'll duplicate your test and see what happens.

Great work, nice thread, happy days

Mark :)
 
ermghoti said:
My Compy peed the carpet a couple weeks back, so I wasn't able to listen. Wah. Mostly fixed now, but there's still a chalk outline where AVG used to be.

Anyway, I hear a persitent claim that a DI/O makes a really decent converter, if you remove the tube (not turn it down, unplug it) and use a much higher current AC adaptor. For instance.

I use one with the tube pulled, it does OK, and I keep meaning to dig up a stronger adaptor. Maybe a little blind taste test might help me decide if it's worth the trouble...
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Why does a converter need 3.4 amps of juice? And if the voltage is the same, what the hell is the difference? Unless ART underspec'ed the stock power supply, it will make no difference :confused: OK, that was a big "unless" :p

Yeah, audiophiles crack me up . . . and I even like some ART gear :o
 
Dunno. It bears repeating that the output drops big-time after pulling the tube, perhaps the amperage merely jacks up the output, appatently at the expense of greatly increased heat, if Chess' experience is typical.
 
Switching power supplies makes absolutely no difference in it's weak output; with or without tube.

I just busted that myth.

The audiophiles like it because it's a good, cheap D/A converter (that sounds better than what comes stock with their CD players) ... which it is.

For our intended purposes, though, which would be as an A/D converter front end for recording ... it's just not up to snuff compared to other options out there. Almost everyone to a man in this comparison easily identified it as the weakest of the bunch, so that should tell you something.

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ermghoti said:
Dunno. It bears repeating that the output drops big-time after pulling the tube, perhaps the amperage merely jacks up the output, appatently at the expense of greatly increased heat, if Chess' experience is typical.
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Adding capacity to a power supply does nothing unless the circuit needs to draw the additional power. Now, in the case of wall warts, they are rated at a given voltage and given load, such that the no-load voltage is really higher than the rating. Therefore, if you use a power supply with a higher amperage rating, the voltage supplied to the unit could be higher. Also, the tube heaters are by far the largest power draw in the circuit, so the simple act of removing the tube (why a converter has a tube :confused: . . . well, that's kinda the pot calling the kettle black :o ) would have a similar effect.

HOWEVER, and with the big caveat that I don't know the DIO circuit, it is highly likely that it uses voltage regulators. That would explain why chessrock's unit got real hot, because the vregs will drop the incoming voltage to their rated voltage, and to do so, they have to shed the drop in voltage as heat (v*amps drawn by the rest of the circuit). Vregs work best when the supply voltage is only a little higher than the desired voltage, crank the supply voltage too high and the vreg can get VERY hot.

Another possibility is that the stock wall wart supplies dirty power and the higher rated wall wart is cleaner. I would still prefer an improvement in power supply filtration over toasting a vreg though.
 
Came into this thread when the answer was already posted, but I'd like to point out the fun if you add another file to the contestors, that are an exact copy of one of the others. Makes people listen harder, can say alot about some opinions people have.
 
Stefan Elmblad said:
Came into this thread when the answer was already posted, but I'd like to point out the fun if you add another file to the contestors, that are an exact copy of one of the others. Makes people listen harder, can say alot about some opinions people have.
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Yeah. I always thought it would have been funny if they had made two or three of them be the same pre, then watched to see how many people said that one copy sounded better than the other. :D

As close as #2 and #3 were, I could honestly have believed my ears were lying to me. Of course, I was listening with cheap earbuds, so it might have been more obvious on my reference monitors, but... would have been funny. :)
 
I guess I suck.
I couldn't really hear any appreciable difference between the samples, with the exception of the original.

Oh well. Too many shows in front of really loud amps, I guess.
 
amra said:
I guess I suck.
I couldn't really hear any appreciable difference between the samples, with the exception of the original.

Oh well. Too many shows in front of really loud amps, I guess.
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I didn't hear any major differences either.

Not a D/A expert so its pretty much non-biased.
Love blindfold tests, its real and no- peer pressure puking.

Used Sony 7506, EMU1820 dock for playback. Did about 3 playbacks, jumped around, and then sat back in my chair and listened a 4th time.

I'm sure an oscilliscope would show technical differences.
And materials can determine the trouble free, lifetime of the unit too as far as one being more expensive than an another...

disclaimer: I can't hear a huge difference between my $169 Squire and my $800 US stratocaster either.
 
Garsh, I miss all the fun. I liked 2 in both, too bad I just ordered an 1820M. Alas, that's what I get for coming to the party late.
 
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