If you can't afford a U87 what's the next best thing???

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Which of these.

Such expert answers..so would please like to ask :
Which of the mics mentioned (TM103...U87ai...AKG414) would be best for basically placing in the middle of a room,one microphone,to record a band playing and the acoustics of that room?
Something that will in this distant miking application capture the space..(and make musicians sound best).
I was considering one of these mics(used)...to plug into some good but basic portable recorder.

Some 20 years ago I bought a Studer Revox PR-99 MKII 2 track reel to reel..a pair of 635a mics..& a Soundtracs mixer.
In the end..it was just too many buttons for my head to face...I should have known..to me perfection is a two knob 1957 LP Jr..( when I got my first regular Les Paul I found the additional two knobs
too much).
Anyway..the Revox still sits there with about 20 minutes of recording on it from the only one or two times I attempted to use it..& the mixer...well 160 knobs for which I only used 5 to play
my Nakamichi Cassette player through to figure out songs.
Oh Well.Thanks
Nick
 
Well if you still have those EV635a that would be a good start.
 
moresound said:
Well if you still have those EV635a that would be a good start.
Click to expand...

That is exactly correct. I recently recorded my son's band rehearsal with one mic. It was a spur of the moment thing and I put up a Sennheiser dynamic omni. The recording came out good, and when you factor that it was done with just one mic, I'd say very good.
 
And if it hasn't been said yet, the answer to the original poster's question is: Anything that Michael Joly has had his hands on.
 
Actually, I would give the Gefell UMT 70S a good look.

About £1,000 cheaper than the U87 and has the Georg Neumann M7 capsule.
 
I bet if someone had 100 of each model Neumann U47, U67, and U87, and AKG C414, ELA M 250, RCA type 44 BX and Type 77 in all their variants, EV RE20 in their mic locker, and there was one microphone that cost only $10.00 but delivered the exact sound they needed...
I think... suddenly a million dollars worth of mics is momentarily worthless.
Which makes for an interesting discussion. Just because a mic is of x repute, doesn't necessarily mean it's worth more or less than another.
Obviously, x mic is going to cost more to aquire and maintain, but the soundman or whoever is in charge of dictating the choice of microphones, is going to be the one to place the true value on the mic. Especially if that mic played a productive role for a hit recording.
Also.... who's to say that a cheap oddball mic didn't play role in some very famous hits?
I know of one mic that I have that is just that a cheap puter mic and it produced a sound a near $300 mic couldn't even touch.
So.... with that in mind, mics are like colors of paint. The more colors on your palette, the more colorful the painting can be.

I could be wrong, I usually am. But what the heck, I felt like writing my ignorant two cents for all the world to see.
 
Twinhit said:
I bet if someone had 100 of each model Neumann U47, U67, and U87, and AKG C414, ELA M 250, RCA type 44 BX and Type 77 in all their variants, EV RE20 in their mic locker, and there was one microphone that cost only $10.00 but delivered the exact sound they needed...
I think... suddenly a million dollars worth of mics is momentarily worthless.
Which makes for an interesting discussion. Just because a mic is of x repute, doesn't necessarily mean it's worth more or less than another.
Obviously, x mic is going to cost more to aquire and maintain, but the soundman or whoever is in charge of dictating the choice of microphones, is going to be the one to place the true value on the mic. Especially if that mic played a productive role for a hit recording.
Also.... who's to say that a cheap oddball mic didn't play role in some very famous hits?
I know of one mic that I have that is just that a cheap puter mic and it produced a sound a near $300 mic couldn't even touch.
So.... with that in mind, mics are like colors of paint. The more colors on your palette, the more colorful the painting can be.

I could be wrong, I usually am. But what the heck, I felt like writing my ignorant two cents for all the world to see.
Click to expand...


I think you are on the right track, but I would put it differently. The mic's "worth" is the *only* thing that can be determined by repute. Let's see- I wave my magic wand and make your SM57 sound like a mint condition RCA ribbon. On the other hand, I make my U87 sound like an MXL V67. Then we sell our mics within a week, and live on the proceeds for the next month. Let's see how that works out for you. The worth of the mic is what you can sell it for.

The part where I agree with what I think you meant is- Just because a mic is worthy doesn't mean it's the *the right* mic. Yes, worth can also be intangible, because it meets your needs here/now.
The primary job of a tracking engineer is to put the right mics (not the most expensive mics) in the right places, plug them into the right preamps, and manage not to clip any components. Marketers try to tell you that by flipping switches on a mic modeler, you can get the sound of a U67. A lot of old timers will be annoyed when they create a machine that can really do that at a price a human can afford. Don't hold your breath. I think they are still years away from realizing the promise of mic/amp/cabinet modeling. So- don't sell your U67.-Richie
 
My experience with TLM103's is that they sound nothing like a U87. I'm not disputing. Just my experience.
A U87 is not the end all be all microphone. it doesn't suit everyone. I find it much less versatile than my Blue Kiwi. Again, its all a matter of taste. I would much rather have options, for example a couple middle of the road LDCs, and a good dynamic mic such as an SM-7 than one U87.
 
Today I came across this thread that I started way back in 2007 and I would like to add a footnote.

Yes Hi Folks it's me again.... the OP with the tea fetish who wanted to know what the cheapest way to get a U87 was.... other than theft.

I recently have become a friend and collaborator with a guy who has worked for the last thirty years in some of the top studios in the world..... See the blurb below *
Every day he uses 47s, 67s, 84s, 87s, 414s, C12s, RCA ribbons etc.

He recently has been mentoring students at an audio school where he had the opportunity to use some of the cheap mics that they keep for the newbies.

One of the mics impressed him enormously as being very closely matched to the 87...... he went out and bought one straight away..... wanna know what it was ???

A $250 M-Audio Solaris..... American design made in China. At the time he couldn't find a new one so he bought a mint condition used one for $150.

The other cheapie that blew him away and he now owns is the Rode M3...... $120 brand new.

Click here for SOS review: Rode M3

They rub shoulders in his studio with his Vintage RCA Ribbon and the SM58 that he recorded David Bowie with at the Hit Factory.....

Thought some of you shoeless, starving fellas, might like to know that..... I know I did.


* A senior in-house recording and mix engineer for artists such as The Rolling Stones, Duran Duran, Bon Jovi, Joan Jett, Cyndi Lauper.
His engineering credits can be found on multi-platinum selling records such as Midnight Oil’s ‘Diesel & Dust’ and David Bowie’s ‘Tin Machine II,"
 
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The Solaris is a great microphone as is the few others in it's class put out by M-audio. :thumbs up:
 
moresound said:
The Solaris is a great microphone as is the few others in it's class put out by M-audio. :thumbs up:
Click to expand...

After my friend turned me on to the Solaris I went and bought two.... and also the Sputnik and a matched pair of Pulsar 11s... can't believe what you get for the price.

Great stuff..... it's a shame they're winding down production.

Here's an interesting piece that mentions some of these:

http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?do=artists.interview&ID=a705182be6c9668a309495546d7a5efa&action=20
 
Quite a few years ago at a local Commercial Studio, 2 friends and I did an A/B between the Studio's 1977 U87 and my sE Electronics SE2200A.
We recorded me singing into both mics at the same time with the U87 upright and the SE2200A upside down directly over the U87 into a Radar Iz Recording System.
Long story short, when we listened to the recording, the Studio Owner and my other friend were totally blown away by the similarities between the 2.
The U87, of course, sounded better as it had more depth and more air but the similarities were pretty amazing.
No, the SE2200A is NOT a U87 but as mentioned above by Harvey, with some tweaking, it might come really close.
Bob G.
 
Here's the way you do it

Buy your self a cheap large diameter condenser mic as cheaply as you can. Send it to Michael Joly and have him modify it. He will remove the cheap Chinese electronics and replace them with high quality components. He will then replace the capsule with a high quality copy of the Neumann U87 or other Neumann capsule depending on the mic. You will get results that are at least the equal of the Neumann and it can even be better in some cases. I have had 4 mics modified in this way and the results have been nothing short of amazing. You can record whatever you want and don't have to do anything to the signal if you don't want to and it will sound better than anything you have ever done before.
 
Guitar Hack said:
Buy your self a cheap large diameter condenser mic as cheaply as you can. Send it to Michael Joly and have him modify it. He will remove the cheap Chinese electronics and replace them with high quality components. He will then replace the capsule with a high quality copy of the Neumann U87 or other Neumann capsule depending on the mic. You will get results that are at least the equal of the Neumann and it can even be better in some cases. I have had 4 mics modified in this way and the results have been nothing short of amazing. You can record whatever you want and don't have to do anything to the signal if you don't want to and it will sound better than anything you have ever done before.
Click to expand...

That's very interesting, just curious, how much does all that modding cost ?
 
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