I wanted to ask

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aviv

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If I have all of my speaker cables from my amp to my speakers in the correct + and - then is it still possible to get phase problems.

Im totally confused, I believe I am in a sticky phase rut of doom...

I have my Denon amp into the JBL speakers, when I sit dead in the centre of the speakers the bass seems to be non existant but when I move to either side of the speakers the bass becomes dominant.

Im pretty sure this is a phase issue but :S what the...

So my question still stands, are there phase problems if all of the speaker cables are inserted correctly ( + and - )

Thanks

Aviv
 
I'm no expert on this, but a few q's to think about: If you switch the +- on one speaker, does it sound better? Could it be that your room isn't good acoustically, and you have a huge null or void or something at your mix position? Are you sure your phase probs arent caused by your mic'ing techniques?
 
lol nah dude, im not listening to my recordings im talking basics.

My last set of speakers where the KEF Q series bookshelfs and they were great. These JBL's i have now are even nicer but i just wanted to know if having the cables the wrong sides which either blow my gear(assuming its carrying current) or provide phase problems.

thanks anyway g
Aviv
 
aviv said:
If I have all of my speaker cables from my amp to my speakers in the correct + and - then is it still possible to get phase problems.

Im totally confused, I believe I am in a sticky phase rut of doom...

I have my Denon amp into the JBL speakers, when I sit dead in the centre of the speakers the bass seems to be non existant but when I move to either side of the speakers the bass becomes dominant.

Im pretty sure this is a phase issue but :S what the...

So my question still stands, are there phase problems if all of the speaker cables are inserted correctly ( + and - )

Thanks

Aviv
Click to expand...
That sound more like the bass modality of your room, that at your listening position there is a bass null where your bass frequencies are cancelling each other out.

Bass traps in the corners will help with that. Possibly a new configuration in your room where your listening position is moved could help as well, (but only after taming your modes with some treatment.)

G.
 
I understand where your coming from but my last speakers proved no problems in this field at all.
Il find out tomorow after i buy some new cables to make sure its all wired correctly.
Thanks G
Aviv
 
What you are talking about is polarity (+ or _ ) which is basically the direction the electrons are flowing. If you have them reversed that would result in being 180 degrees out of phase which could be your problem or as others suggested it could be the room.
 
if you were careful with setting up the speakers and we're listening to say a cd... and your hearing this ... it's a room problem... the likelyhood of 1 of the interconnects to the cd somehow being wired wrong on one is basicly nil... and the odds that the amp is inverting onw channel and not the other is still lower...
 
NYMorningstar said:
What you are talking about is polarity (+ or _ ) which is basically the direction the electrons are flowing. If you have them reversed that would result in being 180 degrees out of phase which could be your problem or as others suggested it could be the room.
Click to expand...

I think you hit it on the head,(I presume) i mean ive had some awesome speakers in here and for me not to notice a null seems slightly odd. I mean i sit in the same spot.
So nothing will happen if i mess around with the cables in the sense that my gear wont start a forest fire? because they are carrying electrons as you said.
cheers
Aviv
 
aviv said:
I think you hit it on the head,(I presume) i mean ive had some awesome speakers in here and for me not to notice a null seems slightly odd. I mean i sit in the same spot.
So nothing will happen if i mess around with the cables in the sense that my gear wont start a forest fire? because they are carrying electrons as you said.
cheers
Aviv
Click to expand...
You don't - or shouldn't - just "mess around". Speaker wire is ALWAYS coded in one way or another to let you know which conductor is which. Even cheap-ass zip cord or lamp cord from Radio Shack is either color-coded by the color of the metal (pure coppor-color braid vs. mixed copper and silver braid) or by one side of the insulation being smooth and the other being ridged.

If you're using 1/4" or XLR cables, then remove the outer shell and look at the insulation colors of the wires inside and make sure they line up the same on both ends. If not, then it's an easy fix to re-solder them. If they are RCA cables, then your wire is probably not the problem, but the only way to know would be to replace them both.

You could be switching polarity somewhere else along the line too. Make sure it's not switched in any of your DAW racks or in any of the other cables in your signal path.

I still suspect your room. ;)

G.
 
im using speaker cable because the speakers arent powered. I can see where your coming from G but its the fact that ive used the KEF's in here and the bass was crystal so i have a real suspision its the polarity, BUT
il tell you guys tomorow seeming as you have all enlightened me plenty on this fine night,
i shall report!

Thanks
Aviv
 
aviv said:
when I sit dead in the centre of the speakers the bass seems to be non existant but when I move to either side of the speakers the bass becomes dominant.


Aviv
Click to expand...

That right there should tell you that its not the wiring. If wiring was the problem from the start, how would the bass just magically appear when you moved to the side? :confused:
 
whjr15 said:
That right there should tell you that its not the wiring. If wiring was the problem from the start, how would the bass just magically appear when you moved to the side? :confused:
Click to expand...

It often will

In the time it took for him to post this, he could have flipped one of the cables to see.

If its a real strong in your face null as you rock your body from side to side, its hard to imagine it being the room, it sounds like speaker polarity.

If its not that drastic, then chances are good that it could be the room
 
Maybe one of the boxes is wired backwards...hmmm...let me guess. Were they made in China? You can check polarity by touching a 9V batt acress the spkr wires (after disconnecting from the amp) Watch the spkr cone. Test one , then the other > If the batt connection is the same for both, they should move in the same direction. If they don't....


chazba
 
chazba said:
Maybe one of the boxes is wired backwards...hmmm...let me guess. Were they made in China? You can check polarity by touching a 9V batt acress the spkr wires (after disconnecting from the amp) Watch the spkr cone. Test one , then the other > If the batt connection is the same for both, they should move in the same direction. If they don't....


chazba
Click to expand...
9v is quite a lot voltage for expensive speakers, esp with fresh battery! Don´t do it!

1.5v is more than enough.
 
kubeek said:
9v is quite a lot voltage for expensive speakers, esp with fresh battery! Don´t do it!

1.5v is more than enough.
Click to expand...


bullshit.... 1.5 is enough granted... but 9V wont kill anything... ya gotta remember that alot of amps can swing up to+/- 60V even for cheap ass home stereos... and you dont leave it on long anyhow... ya just pop it and watch that they move the same direction...
 
60 volts peak into 4 ohm speakers is 450W (225W into 8ohm). Definitely not a home stereo.

The 9v battery, when you leave it connected for any longer than just sratching the terminals can produce cca 25W into 4ohm. That is more than enough to burn some voicecoils, because speakers are not designed for DC.
 
aviv said:
but its the fact that ive used the KEF's in here and the bass was crystal
Click to expand...

You are listening from the exact same position, right? Where were the woofer in relation to the floor and ceiling? Where are they now?

You have modal problems in your room. I can 100% guarantee that. Is that 100% of your problem? Maybe.
 
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well would you have guessed!
it was a phase issue. I bought some decent speaker cables, ensured the polarity was correct and there we go. It all came together.

I mean no doubt i would love some bass traps in my room for a few of the corners but that wasn't the main problem that i could clearly hear. It was freaking me out because I knew these JBL's where rather good and what I was hearing could not be correct.

But luckily its all come together. Thanks for all your advice but im glad i learnt that pase issues are dangerous, ensure that you know about them before you plough through with your adventures in home recording and such.
:)

Thanks

Aviv
 
20 points for me :)


I have seen more than once, speaker cables bought at the same time, from the same manufacturer, same model, with varying polarities

But now, like the other guys said, go the rest of the way and get the room acoustics as good as you can afford.

It won't be as obvious an "aha" at first but it WILL be to your finished mixes
 
The question I have is if it were a polarity reversal, why were only the bass frequencies affected?

G.
 
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