how much mixing to do before recording vocals

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guitarplayer888

New member
I'm recording a full rock band project in a different way than I usually work. In this case we've got virtually all the instrumental tracks recorded and then I'll bring those as a stereo mix into another studio to record the singer. To bring him as complete a backing track as possible I started mixing the track as I would if I had all the completed tracks. But I find it difficult to make certain level, panning, eq and compression decisions without hearing a vocal in the mix. Do you usually make a "karaoke" type mix, essentially a complete track without vocals, or do you just bring a rough mix of raw tracks and then really get down to mixing once the vocals are complete?
 
Sort of a mix (no pun intended) of things. You don't want to nail down a mix... I mean, you don't want it etched in stone. You still need control over (at the very least) the aux sends that are feeding the vocalist's headphone mix. "I need a little more me" or "I need less hat" or "I can't make out the root note without more bass" or (whatever - Pick anything).
 
In the ideal world, I'll do a specific headphone mix of whatever the vocalist wants/needs to hear to bring out the best performance. This can be anything from a full (but rough) mix down to some drums for rhythm plus a piano track playing the vocal line (even though this'll never get into the real mix).

At the other end of the spectrum, it can be a "karaoke mix" (as you say) of everything recorded. Basically, experiment and do what works best--but don't assume you have to finalise a sub mix. Much/most of this can be done live.

...and a boo...hiss to Massive for stealing the pun I wanted to use!
 
I'm the very opposite, I'll just isolate the drums or percussion and guitar, piano or bass and sing or get others to sing, to that. Each time an overdub is done, the mix in my head changes so I don't bother until I've got everything down.
 
I'm trying mix great sound in headphones which wanna use for recording

I make stems like 'kik'n'snar', 'bass', 'evrythin' it pretty good
 
jimmys69 said:
Huh?..........
Click to expand...

Allow me...I believe he said,
"I try to make great headphone mixes for the vocalist to use when tracking. I make sub-mixes including ones with just the kick and snare, just the bass, etc. We blend them to taste when adding vocals. I find that this works well".
...or something like that...
 
heatmiser said:
Allow me...I believe he said,
"I try to make great headphone mixes for the vocalist to use when tracking. I make sub-mixes including ones with just the kick and snare, just the bass, etc. We blend them to taste when adding vocals. I find that this works well".
...or something like that...
Click to expand...

Thanks for the translation HEAT! I was considering suicide, but now I am all good. :)
 
grimtraveller said:
I'm the very opposite, I'll just isolate the drums or percussion and guitar, piano or bass and sing or get others to sing, to that. Each time an overdub is done, the mix in my head changes so I don't bother until I've got everything down.
Click to expand...

Just to be clear, I wasn't talking about creating a mix that will ever see the light of day in the final version. Rather, I was describing doing something "on the fly" to give the vocalist what he/she want in their headphones to get the best performance.
 
guitarplayer888 said:
I'm recording a full rock band project in a different way than I usually work. In this case we've got virtually all the instrumental tracks recorded and then I'll bring those as a stereo mix into another studio to record the singer...
Click to expand...

Is there a reason that you have to do this? Why not bring all of the project tracks? As others have pointed out, if your singer wants something different in the cans, it's going to be nearly impossible.

If it's an issue of the other studio having a different DAW, can you at least export the .wav files for the individual tracks and import them into the other studio's DAW?
 
KineticSound said:
Is there a reason that you have to do this? Why not bring all of the project tracks? As others have pointed out, if your singer wants something different in the cans, it's going to be nearly impossible. ..
Click to expand...
+ ... what +3 here?
Might be fine with some vocals, but maybe do a trial run with the singer?
 
KineticSound said:
Is there a reason that you have to do this? Why not bring all of the project tracks? As others have pointed out, if your singer wants something different in the cans, it's going to be nearly impossible.

If it's an issue of the other studio having a different DAW, can you at least export the .wav files for the individual tracks and import them into the other studio's DAW?
Click to expand...

Its a good question. The reason I'm doing it this way is that I recorded all the instruments in my studio but to get the vocals I have to meet the singer at a rehearsal space near his house. Since the rehearsal space doesn't have recording facilities and my system is not portable, I'm planning to just bring a laptop with Reaper and a simple audio interface and mic. I guess I could invest the time to figure out how to export my protools tracks into reaper but I'd never done it before so I'd prefer to take the easy way out and just take a stereo mix of the PT tracks. Its a good idea though, maybe I should make the effort to give him some more flexibility of mix in his cans.

Life would be much easier if I could just get him to come to my studio...
 
jimmys69 said:
Thanks for the translation HEAT!
Click to expand...
This underscores the side effects of legendary status and international fame and success !

Bobbsy said:
Just to be clear, I wasn't talking about creating a mix that will ever see the light of day in the final version. Rather, I was describing doing something "on the fly" to give the vocalist what he/she want in their headphones to get the best performance.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I understood that. It's funny, on a stage live, I can sing in tune with a full band set up. But recording, I just get put off by all the different lines interveaving and dovetailing. I've always found it so much easier to have just one of the melody instruments going with drums or percussion ! Go figure !
 
guitarplayer888 said:
Its a good question. The reason I'm doing it this way is that I recorded all the instruments in my studio but to get the vocals I have to meet the singer at a rehearsal space near his house. Since the rehearsal space doesn't have recording facilities and my system is not portable, I'm planning to just bring a laptop with Reaper and a simple audio interface and mic. I guess I could invest the time to figure out how to export my protools tracks into reaper but I'd never done it before so I'd prefer to take the easy way out and just take a stereo mix of the PT tracks. Its a good idea though, maybe I should make the effort to give him some more flexibility of mix in his cans.

Life would be much easier if I could just get him to come to my studio...
Click to expand...


I don't use PT, but it's just a matter of soloing each track individually and exporting like you'd export any stereo mix, except one track at a time. And for that matter, I'm sure there's some sort of "batch export" function in PT like there is in Cubase.

Just set a new folder up so you know where the tracks are, and then it's as simple as dragging and dropping them into reaper. Just make sure when you export that they all have the same start and end points so you don't have to align things, just snap them all to the grid in reaper. Easy as pie
 
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