how in the name of god do i get this damm Kick to stand out!!

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jamtheguitarman

jamtheguitarman

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no matter what ive tried, i cant get the kick to actually stand out in this song(song in my signature)

ive tried compressing and limiting, extreme EQing. The drums are done by Drumkit from hell superior by the way. at the moment im stuck to cubase built in plugs and some freebies(been using the classic series a fair bit)

im also having the same trouble with the toms.

what should i do, im totaly stuck :(

thanks
jamie
 
I have been messing around with DKFHS and I am having the same problem with toms. They all seem to have a long decay which really muddies each respective frequenct.
 
My first stab at that would be to pull the guitars back a bit and away from the center. Then the strings would likely follow.
Or, to tackle it another way, sometimes it helps to build from the space needed around the feature that needs help instead of trying to get it to fit through an existing wall. If you're hearing it anything like I am, the drums need to be monster (too).
Rebuild from drums up.
Wayne
 
Have you played with the envelopes on both the kick and toms? They will help define the sound you get (Attack, Release, Decay, Sustain, ...yada yada yada).

There are also many other settings such as the basic eq, tuning...yada yada yada.

There are 2 different types of metal kicks that I use. The first boosts the 60-80 and then again up in the higher frequencies for the 'click'. The second type boosts the 80-120 for a tighter sound. This eq'ing that I speak of is done in the VSTi...then more mixing after I convert the drum tracks to wave files for mixdown.

Hope that helps.
 
Hey dude I am gonna give you some ideas that I would try. I am no expert but It still might be of some help.
First thing's first. Get the kick happening on it's own. A boost at around 75-125 Hz depending on whether or not you want more thump or more punch (I like it somewhere in between). A big cut at around 300 Hz to lose the cheap sound, maybe even -18 db and not a real wide Q. You don't want to lose anything below 175 or so. Move your cut up a little to maybe 350 to 400 Hz if you're losing anything you like. A big boost at somewhere between 2500 and 5500 Hz to get the click. I usually do that one last so I can sweep around in those frequencies and see where it jumps out the most while the guitars and bass are in the picture. Also it doesn't hurt to throw a high pass and a low pass on there at the extreme ends of the spectrum just to gain some dynamic range with it. Example: you don't need shit below 40 or 50 Hz and you also don't need shit above 8 to 10 kHz, so leaving it there is just hogging your space. The compression is gonna vary some based on how you programmed it. If you're using mostly hard hits and you are not looking to change the dynamics of the track too much than you aren't really going to need to compress it that hard. Maybe a 2 to 4:1 ratio. Experiment with attack and release times as to not kill the initial attack of the sound and to not create a shitty sounding whoomp after the hits. Just try to thicken the fundamental sound up a bit. Next thing I would do is start with the kick when you mix. Get it up there real good and try to fit things around it. Definitely low pass your guitars. You don't really need anything under 125 to 150 Hz on those. Get the click of the kick to fit into the guitar sound and not in the same spot as a big frequency area that the guitars need. EQ the bass so it doesn't crowd in with the biggest punch area of the kick (probably around 100-125 Hz). Another thing, and this may be the biggest part of your problem if you haven't handled it already: This whole process will be way easier if you cut the kick drum out of pretty much all the other microphones in DFHS. If you haven't or don't want to do that, you'll definitely benefit from bumping the overhead and room mic tracks over a little to get the transients of the kick to line up - that will help out the thickness of the bass drum alot. However I find it is easier to control and sounds better to eliminate the kick from those mics altogether. Similar to the way some people would drape a blanket or something over the kick drum to keep it out of the other mics so much. You also want to do a huge cut or even high pass your overheads and room mics at somewhere around 400 to 600 Hz. You don't really need that in there and it fights with the kick sound as well. Sorry to be so long winded, but you've got some good stuff and I really want to help!
 
Oh yeah, another thing I would try if you haven't already is to pan the guitars pretty wide (I always hard pan my guitar tracks). It may or may not work for you...just another idea, may have been mentioned already.
Also those guitars are loud as hell on that track (I talked about that already in the other thread :p ) so straightening out the volumes would be the first thing to try in my book!
 
There are good responses here. My first instinct tells me to simply turn it up for starters. I'd have to hear what that sounded like to judge what to maybe do next though.
 
Hit the phase switch on the kick channel, see if that helps.
 
Gate the toms, cut off the resonance.

Metalhead is right on about pushing the lows and cutting the mids on the kick. That is exactly what I do to DKHS kicks and I am getting excellent results.

Also, I set up my channels as follows:

Kick - compressed with 1176 plug-in then EQd as metalhead indicates above then routed to main buss

Snare upper and lower- routed to a dedicated snare buss compressed with another 1176 plug in. Then this is routed to the drum aux buss.

All other drums and OH are EQd per track and compressed per track, various treatments, but sometimes none, then sent to the drum aux buss.

The drum aux bus is then routed to another bus with a Fairchild compressor plug in. I send other things to the Fairchild also to glue the mix which is why I route this way. The Fairchild buss is then routed to the main buss.

Hope that helps.

( Just listened to the track, the drums are mixed too low and yes, your kick is anemic) Also the keyboards are overwhelming when the drums and other stuff comes in. The guitars need to be hi passed to let the low end through. The keyboards need a high pass around 300. The drums are just too low, volumewise, in the mix, as is the bass. You left no room for them to pop through. If you can get that low end up the rest of the mix would work I think.
 
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