How do you guys go analog to digital?

[Nightfire]

For those of you who have a big console/mixer but do all your editing in the box, how do you go from your analog unit to your comp? Do you just use the direct outs of all your console channels into the direct ins of a Firestudio (or something along those lines)? If you do all your EQ in the comp why run it through a mixer first instead of just interface?
And if you dont do your EQ in the box, how do you send the tracks from your comp through the mixer then back to the comp simultaneously while recording the eq your putting on the things, and the volume etc.?


Mike

 

[therage!]

Unless you have some damn nice (as in top line) console why bother with additional D/A A/D conversions? I use my mixer's direct outs into a 1010 and the 1010 outs to my mixer, but that's primarily used for monitoring tracks. I use a rack mount pre and compressor but for the most part I mix in the box (Sonar) and master (Sound Forge w/Izotope) there also. I take my preamp's output directly to my 1010's input. I also do some amp modeling using S/PDIF.

 

[amra]

I use a 16 channel board for recording, and I basically use a direct out type setup to send each track to an input on one of my 1010's. Basically it is like having 16 preamps. I do have several other preamps that I use for vocals and other specific uses. If they need some initial compression/limiting, I route them through one of my compressors before it hits the 1010's converters. I usually avoid compression at this stage, except on snares/kicks sometimes, and screaming type vocals. If I am just compressing for effect, I do that in my DAW.

Once I get the tracks recorded into the "box", I do all the mixing inside the box, other than possibly sending a track or two out to some outboard effects, but not very often. The reverbs I have as VST plugins are better than any outboard gear I can readily afford, and IMO better than just about anything under a grand.

 

[Nightfire]

Ok, just the kinda stuff I wanted to hear, thanks guys. The reason Im asking is cuase I always see pics of peoples huge consoles but on a pc based setup so Im always wondering how they get those 16 channels to go into the comp, I guess you have to use an interface anyways. So in this case, why not just get an interface with preamps and leave out the console (if the eq on it is not used since mixing etc. happens in the box)?
Or do anyone of you rec. into the comp, then mix on the console using console eq?
By the way, Im assuming a 1010 is an interface?

Mike

 

[NL5]

So in this case, why not just get an interface with preamps and leave out the console (if the eq on it is not used since mixing etc. happens in the box)?
Or do anyone of you rec. into the comp, then mix on the console using console eq?

There is a LOT more to mixing than preamps and eq. There is also a lot more to a console. Is a console needed? Not really. But they just sound SO good! Also, the preamps of just about any interface pretty well blow - especially when compared to a pro console. The pre's in my console can hang with the best preamps there are. Lastly, it makes analog gear easier to incorporate and is generally easier to do complex routing (although Reaper is getting close).

edit - as far as a PC being hooked up, it works the same way a tape machine would - only I can do my editing digitally, and run plugs on some channels if I want.

 

[BushmasterM4]

I use a Mackie 1640 with firewire card installed in mixer. Works great for me. The mixer sends 16 clean signals to the pc. A mod is available for the Mackie so the signal is taken at the the faders or just before the faders. I prefer a clean send.

 

[Nightfire]

edit - as far as a PC being hooked up, it works the same way a tape machine would - only I can do my editing digitally, and run plugs on some channels if I want.

Thats what I mean, you say it hooks up the same way a tape machine would. Iver never worked with analog gear before thats why Im wondering. What do you use between your console and your pc, some sort of firewire of usb???? An audio interface? If so, and if the preamps blow on it, wouldnt the "good" console sound get dirtied up a bit by the interface/soundcard?


Mike

 

[Nightfire]

I use a Mackie 1640 with firewire card installed in mixer. Works great for me. The mixer sends 16 clean signals to the pc. A mod is available for the Mackie so the signal is taken at the the faders or just before the faders. I prefer a clean send.

Yeah Ive seen a few new mixers with the firewire option, but Im a cheap college student and want to get an old console of ebaythen route it somehow to the comp. But if I need an audio interface anyways I may just get the interface and work with that, save me money. I figured the console would be good for preamps and mixing with my bare hands instead of with the mouse.


Mike

 

[NL5]

Thats what I mean, you say it hooks up the same way a tape machine would. Iver never worked with analog gear before thats why Im wondering. What do you use between your console and your pc, some sort of firewire of usb???? An audio interface? If so, and if the preamps blow on it, wouldnt the "good" console sound get dirtied up a bit by the interface/soundcard?


Mike

There are no preamps on my interface.

 

[Nightfire]

Ok, makes sense. Sorry for the noob questions Im just getting started
What kind of interface do you use?


Mike

 

[NL5]

Ok, makes sense. Sorry for the noob questions Im just getting started
What kind of interface do you use?


Mike

I have an Apogee AD-16 and two DA16's. Plus a bunch of effects units with I/O as well. I have about 34 channels in and 50 out. (if I count correctly)

 

[Farview]

Thats what I mean, you say it hooks up the same way a tape machine would. Iver never worked with analog gear before thats why Im wondering. What do you use between your console and your pc, some sort of firewire of usb???? An audio interface? If so, and if the preamps blow on it, wouldnt the "good" console sound get dirtied up a bit by the interface/soundcard?


Mike

Look up the motu 24 IO. It's an interface that has 24 analog inputs and outputs. It's a pci interface, not firewire. There are a few dozen of these types of interfaces, you just have to look around.

A mixer is more than preamps and EQ. Thre are also mix b busses for setting up multiple headphone mixes, a control room volume control, 100's of routing options, etc...

 

[jmorris]

Yeah Ive seen a few new mixers with the firewire option, but Im a cheap college student and want to get an old console of ebaythen route it somehow to the comp. But if I need an audio interface anyways I may just get the interface and work with that, save me money. I figured the console would be good for preamps and mixing with my bare hands instead of with the mouse.


Mike

The tascam m520 consoles are going very cheap, I just bought one for 325 just for the hell of it, And I second Fairveiw's Motu 24 in/out sug. I have 2 motu2408mk3 , 24 in 24 out lightpipe to fire wire into box,simple

 

[xstatic]

If you have an inline console and the right converters you can easily set things up so that you are tracking from the console, monitoring returns from the console, and still recording a good signal from the converters. I run from the group outs (I have 24 group outs on my console) to the converter. From there I record the converted signal to my tower. Simultaneously I take the looped through analog signal off the converter (so it is just a copy of what went in, and not stuff coming back from the DAW) and return that signal to the tape inputs on my console. Basically, If I am doing a 24 track recording I am recording off of 24 channels that all have full routing, 4 band EQ, and full insert capabilities, and then monitoring back on 24 channels that also have full routing, 4 band EQ and their own seperate EQ's. I use prefade aux sends to build my 5 headphone mixes which allows me to set up a control room mix for me that is independant of the headphone mixes and the tracking sends.

As far as preamps goes, I am with NL5 on this one. The preamps in my console are of far better quality than any but the very best of interfaces available such as RME, MOTU, M-Audio etc... Then there is the fact that the console also has 100+ channels of fully featured killer EQ available. Around here people talk a lot about recording a "clean" signal that has no EQ, compression etc... When you start getting into larger setups operated by people who have more experience this concept of "shortest cleanest path" is less and less common. People generally do not record of an API or Neve console with racks of available top shelf outboard just to bypass all of that. Even during tracking in places like that, it is generally very common practice to EQ and compress to tape whenever it seems desirable.

 

[Nightfire]

Ok, thanks a lot for all the info. Got my eyes on a 1010

The tascam m520 consoles are going very cheap, I just bought one for 325 just for the hell of it

Thanks for the tip, looked up a few on ebay and craigslist.


Mike

 

[MadAudio]

I use direct outs and aux sends from my mixer. I also go directly from external mic pres (DMP3, Octane) into the interface inputs.

 

[ChuckU]

To me it's about what's convenient, and how much room you have. Money is important, but lots of good stuff can be had cheap these days. At my level, and (in)frequency of studio gigs, work flow - and keeping the computer up -are paramount.
I have posted my setup in the past, but I like to get feedback, and I just rewired my rig and bought some new stuff:
I have a Mackie 32x8 bus mixer as a front end. It's about 4' x 3', so it takes up a bit of room. I don't think they make them any more but I bet you can get a deal on Ebay. What I like about it is that it's very straightforward. I run mics and lines directly into each channel, picking up eq along the way and gain thru the faders. I go out the direct outs on each channel, then into my converters (RME Fireface 800, Octopre Platinum and an ADAT XT on standby). I use the aux busses on the Mackie for individualized headphone mixes, too.
I mix everything in the digital domain. It's quick. Automation and effects plugins work great, and are easy to incorporate. So, once it's digital, it stays there, but it's nice to put your hands on buttons and knobs.

 

[fenderlady]

To me it's about what's convenient, and how much room you have. Money is important, but lots of good stuff can be had cheap these days. At my level, and (in)frequency of studio gigs, work flow - and keeping the computer up -are paramount.
I have posted my setup in the past, but I like to get feedback, and I just rewired my rig and bought some new stuff:
I have a Mackie 32x8 bus mixer as a front end. It's about 4' x 3', so it takes up a bit of room. I don't think they make them any more but I bet you can get a deal on Ebay. What I like about it is that it's very straightforward. I run mics and lines directly into each channel, picking up eq along the way and gain thru the faders. I go out the direct outs on each channel, then into my converters (RME Fireface 800, Octopre Platinum and an ADAT XT on standby). I use the aux busses on the Mackie for individualized headphone mixes, too.
I mix everything in the digital domain. It's quick. Automation and effects plugins work great, and are easy to incorporate. So, once it's digital, it stays there, but it's nice to put your hands on buttons and knobs.

Awesome, I currently have a Allen and Heath MixWizard 16:2 and use an MOTU 828mkII for A/D conversion. The MOTU has been ok but a bit on the noisy side. I have been drooling over an Apogee but I know there are other A/D converters that are really good too. I just started looking again cause I was interested in the Apogee Rosetta 200, but found the RME Fireface 800. That caught my eye and it seems to have good reviews and people are very happy with it. Sounds clean from what I hear. So I am wanting to get one, hopefully in the next month or so.

 

[amra]

I don't have a 828 but I have a bunch of recorded with it, and it shouldn't be noisy. Are you sure you don't have some kind of line level mismatch going on?

Or, maybe you got a bad one...

 

[fenderlady]

It's not so noisy that it is not good. It really comes down to the difference in the chips used for the conversion. I want a unit that can compare to the Apogee and the 828 is a good entry level A/D converter. I had thought about buying the 896 at the time that I bought the the 828 but did not because I still wanted something like the Apogee. There are no line mismatches.