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fretwire3d
New member
It's important, being that I'm in a 3 piece with just drums, guitar, and viola.
Help?
Help?
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manning1
Banned
viola is a sensitive orchestral instrument. if you have the money i would try a nice ribbon mic through a nice preamp.
with little money its difficult. maybe demo a cheap akg condenser mic through say a rane preamp. but this is still quite expensive.
there are a million solutions.
the cheapest you could try is a 50 buck cad mic into some sort of half decent preamp. maybe a dmp3.
with little money its difficult. maybe demo a cheap akg condenser mic through say a rane preamp. but this is still quite expensive.
there are a million solutions.
the cheapest you could try is a 50 buck cad mic into some sort of half decent preamp. maybe a dmp3.
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Stradivariusz
New member
Hi
Well, it is a bit to general. Can you describe more exact the purpose of you recording (kind of music, if each of the instruments will be recorded separately or all together in stereo, is it for comercial use, demo or just for fun)?
Strad
Well, it is a bit to general. Can you describe more exact the purpose of you recording (kind of music, if each of the instruments will be recorded separately or all together in stereo, is it for comercial use, demo or just for fun)?
Strad
sonusman
Banned
The mic you use will display the obvious different sounds inherent to that mic at any given mic placement. You will use what you have whatever that might be.
But, the placement on strings is what it is all about. No matter WHAT mic, you will probably mic it the same way, which is 12"-24" straight above the f holes on the viola. If you happen to have a great sounding room, you can use a omni directional mic pattern and use the proximity of the mic to the viola to control the direct vs reflected sound on the mic.
If you have a not so great room, you might want to mic a bit on the closer side, with a cardiod or even hype cardiod pattern mic. Problem here is that you get more proximity effect from the mic, making swells in the volume harder to contain. So much though depends upon your technique and what not here too! You might be able to overcome the proximity effect with a bit brighter tone, which you can achieve by bowing closer to the bridge. Maybe your viola is already sort of bright sounding like that, and the proximity effect of the cardiod pattern will give the sound a bit more "beef". Who knows!
But, try micing 12-24" straight above the sound holes as a start with whatever mic you have.
Preamps are totally overrated. You can get pretty good results with a Behringer if your instrument has a great tone, and you apply a good mic with mic placement.
But, the placement on strings is what it is all about. No matter WHAT mic, you will probably mic it the same way, which is 12"-24" straight above the f holes on the viola. If you happen to have a great sounding room, you can use a omni directional mic pattern and use the proximity of the mic to the viola to control the direct vs reflected sound on the mic.
If you have a not so great room, you might want to mic a bit on the closer side, with a cardiod or even hype cardiod pattern mic. Problem here is that you get more proximity effect from the mic, making swells in the volume harder to contain. So much though depends upon your technique and what not here too! You might be able to overcome the proximity effect with a bit brighter tone, which you can achieve by bowing closer to the bridge. Maybe your viola is already sort of bright sounding like that, and the proximity effect of the cardiod pattern will give the sound a bit more "beef". Who knows!
But, try micing 12-24" straight above the sound holes as a start with whatever mic you have.
Preamps are totally overrated. You can get pretty good results with a Behringer if your instrument has a great tone, and you apply a good mic with mic placement.
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fretwire3d
New member
A post-rock band. Interpol meets Godspeed You Black Emperor! meets Neil Young.
I would like to preserve my musical purity and use this as a professional recording. Not crystal clear recording… lots of reverb and maybe some general overdrive on the track. But I don’t want a cheap sound. The viola is about 170 years old. It has perfect tone and the best violist I’ve ever heard behind it.
But for the room… I have nothing but bad rooms. I have a very nice reverb processor though.
I have a Behringer mixer and wasn’t planning ever to buy a preamp. I have Nuendo and Cubase SX for mixing. The guitar track and drum track will be recorded on the same take to get a more dynamic, live feel. The viola will also be recorded live, but will be able to delete the track and do over.
Would a matched stereo set of condenser mics give a natural sound? Like a MXL603? I was going to pick up a set.
I would like to preserve my musical purity and use this as a professional recording. Not crystal clear recording… lots of reverb and maybe some general overdrive on the track. But I don’t want a cheap sound. The viola is about 170 years old. It has perfect tone and the best violist I’ve ever heard behind it.
But for the room… I have nothing but bad rooms. I have a very nice reverb processor though.
I have a Behringer mixer and wasn’t planning ever to buy a preamp. I have Nuendo and Cubase SX for mixing. The guitar track and drum track will be recorded on the same take to get a more dynamic, live feel. The viola will also be recorded live, but will be able to delete the track and do over.
Would a matched stereo set of condenser mics give a natural sound? Like a MXL603? I was going to pick up a set.
sonusman
Banned
I think a stereo recording of the viola would be overkill for the production style I percieve you are going for.
Your reverb processor better be KILLER, like top end Lexicon TC Electronics stuff if you expect it to give you as good as a good room. When I talk about "reflected sound", I am not per se referring to "reverberation". The early reflections coming back to the mic is what the initial sound is all about! You need a very high end reverb processor to emulate a great "room", and still, it isn't the same are getting a more "room" sound while tracking, because to utilize the DSP best, you have to close mic, which means all the problems with close micing the instrument.
You might be surprised though how good a room CAN sound with very simple approaches to helping it out a bit. WHERE you set up the performer and mic can make a big difference. As well, if you can identify what part of the frequency range is offensive, you can possibly use some cheap treatments to deal with just that.
Your reverb processor better be KILLER, like top end Lexicon TC Electronics stuff if you expect it to give you as good as a good room. When I talk about "reflected sound", I am not per se referring to "reverberation". The early reflections coming back to the mic is what the initial sound is all about! You need a very high end reverb processor to emulate a great "room", and still, it isn't the same are getting a more "room" sound while tracking, because to utilize the DSP best, you have to close mic, which means all the problems with close micing the instrument.
You might be surprised though how good a room CAN sound with very simple approaches to helping it out a bit. WHERE you set up the performer and mic can make a big difference. As well, if you can identify what part of the frequency range is offensive, you can possibly use some cheap treatments to deal with just that.
sonusman
Banned
In the end though, just do the best you can. It isn't like you are paying for the best or anything. I am sure you don't expect "stellar" recording quality using a bad room, cheap mics, and cheap electronics, and a hooky software application as your tools. Right? 
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Stradivariusz
New member
As I understood, you are going to record viola separate from the others. If yes it will be easier. Mxl's will for sure do the job, but even not a pair, but just one. To the nice post of Sonusman I can just add, that it is even possible to experiment with the mic behind the ear of the viola player - it can give a warm and crispy sound - just take your time and experiment. I would listen very carefully also to the ambiance color of the recording. If your rooms are not soundin well they might influence your recording on a very unpretty way, than even with the best reverb you will not be able to get a nice sound. Placement of the mic is the most critical thing! Don't hesitate to place the mic closer to the instrument if you think that your room is sounding to much.
Cardioid in this situation will be the best choice (603 is a hypercardio so it will take more acoustics than the cardio) I guess that even Behringer B5 or SE Electronics SE1A or other cheap mics or will be the good choice - when you record from close distance.
Strad
Cardioid in this situation will be the best choice (603 is a hypercardio so it will take more acoustics than the cardio) I guess that even Behringer B5 or SE Electronics SE1A or other cheap mics or will be the good choice - when you record from close distance.
Strad
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petimar
New member
If you need to close mic, try micing over the headstock at the height of the top of the players head pointed at their chin. You might want to go rent a ribbon mic and a good clean high gain pre like a John Hardy, etc.
I have most often found micing on axis to the f holes gives too much bow sound and harsher sounds from the instrument. Off axis quite often (not ALWAYS!!) works better in less than ideal rooms.
Also try micing behind the viola. Sometimes this is quite effective.
I have most often found micing on axis to the f holes gives too much bow sound and harsher sounds from the instrument. Off axis quite often (not ALWAYS!!) works better in less than ideal rooms.
Also try micing behind the viola. Sometimes this is quite effective.
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fretwire3d
New member
Sure, I don't expect "Stellar" results. But I'll get the results I want.
The room is completely dead sounding. Would a room mic still be useful?
The room is completely dead sounding. Would a room mic still be useful?
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Stradivariusz
New member
No room mics. Just one cardio in the good place. If you have a room which does not have much reflections than you can be lucky by trying to record also from further than 0,5m. I did a viola recording in the dry room, mic was about 1m away and above him (room was dry, but high - around 3,5m) pointing the viola. Sound was warm and well articulated. Than I added a bit of reverb and the viola player was very happy (me too )
Strad
)Strad