How do I get the "punch" that a commercial recording has?

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dawsonadod1

New member
I have read tons of plain old mastering threads and can't seem to sort this out. I have a song mixed down multi mono in PT LE 8 with a waves EQ, multiband compressor, and an L2 on it. I also added the L316 just to get more volume. I get volume but i am losing my song! The guitars and vocals come up but the drums drown out. The snare has no punch and when I compare it to a commercial song I can hear the loss of quality. It has an "airy" feel to it. I have produced and mastered songs in the past but i am trying to reach a new level of volume. How can i achieve this while keeping up the quality?

Thanks!
 
Did you consider that you might be squashing it just a "tad" too much...? :)

"It has an "airy" feel to it."

You're already sucking up the ambiance with all the compression...no wonder the "punch" is long gone.
 
Wow man. That is a tough/vague question to answer. I know what you are trying to achieve though. What I have learned from my experience, is that it is a combination of everything. Experience, gear, room, experience, experience, some experience, and also a bit of experience. I am no guru, nor master of anything, but I do notice getting better each time. I used to ask myself "how do I get it to sound like that?". The answer lies in the delicate nuances of a mix, starting from the room that each track is recorded in. Then the actual performance to begin with. Next, correct selection of mic/pre, and the placement of them. Then the whole mixing part that, well, can not really be taught. Only learned by experimentation, trial, and error. Absolutely, there are tips that can give direction, but the skill is an individual one that just comes from practice.

The 'airy' feel comes from working of the tools you have, prior to mastering. I thought for sure there must be a magic plug-in for this when I first started. There are some that attempt to fake this, but in the end, it comes from good tone, performance, and placing the performance in it's ideal place in the mix. Mastering will only expand on what has been given in the mix.

If you are using things like the L2, multiband compressor and 316, be aware that adding those things before getting your mix close prior, will only make it harder to judge where you are at. I will typically mix with a L2, just to have an idea where things are going. But I always check without. Adding an effect to your output bus is only misleading what you are mixing, unless you have a clear idea of where you are going. This cannot be guessed without tons of experience. I know I am still guessing, and I have been at it, off and on for 20 years. And by the way, my personal experience/opinion says stay the hell away from a multiband compressor, unless you are trying to 'fix' something. I have never myself seen the need to do this on a master bus unless I was fixing some other guys crap. If your mix is great to begin with, processing will be at a minimum during mastering.

Post up some examples if you would like others opinions. Maybe there is something we can offer.

Welcome to the forum Dawson! :D
 
As for you losing the other instruments a compressor will bring out all of the things you try to cover up (bad acoustics cheap gear) Dynamic response is just as important as frequency response this may be one of your problems and is often overlooked. Could either be because you are squashing your tracks waay to much or you haven't properly eqd them. May be a little of both. You have to learn to hear how your tracks sound when you track them and visualize how they are going to sound after you mix them and then master them. Think of it like building a house you have to have some sort of plan you don't just go buy a bunch of materials and start slapping things together. You can't polish a turd. Try to record something on a built in computer mic then go in and try compress it and tell me how it sounds. Some things are better left dry. Also as a side note on a DAW adda converters will SERIOUSLY affect your mixing.
 
Well, you need 10 posts to put up a link. I heard you can cheat by putting one in your sig.

Better yet, just post stupid funny stuff every 60 seconds here. It's what the thread is for.
 
dawsonadod1 said:
It has an "airy" feel to it.!
Click to expand...

Not sure this is relevent, but expanders are rarely mentioned.

As an example: An expander on the high end of a vocal brings out the "breath" of a voice.

The "catch" to using expansion is that it makes the input even more sensitive than having no compressor, which isnt practical when recording musicians that dont know how to play or sing extremely level. Often the answer is "compansion" (as in using a compander on drums).

Just a thought.
 
turdpprobox.jpg
 
try making your 1st two (low, low-mids) bands on your MBC have much longer attack times, much shorter release times.
you will have to find the balance between enough makeup gain, and squish
 
GONZO-X said:
try making your 1st two (low, low-mids) bands on your MBC have much longer attack times, much shorter release times.
you will have to find the balance between enough makeup gain, and squish
Click to expand...

good advice but only if you have good monitors and ears. bass transients can be a real pain in the butt for me atleast.

GONZO-X said:
turdpprobox.jpg
Click to expand...

Is this compatible with windows? Or do I need to use a MAC and pay extra for a usb key?
 
"...i am trying to reach a new level of volume."
That bit confuses the entire issue. Sounds like you need to get your mix together & then try to STEM master.
 
good advice but only if you have good monitors and ears. bass transients can be a real pain in the butt for me at least.
Click to expand...

well, if you do not have at least good ears and good monitors, you are more than likely wasting your time.
sad, but true.
 
SafeandSound said:
This will be done by employing a recording engineer of many years experience using the finest recording equipment.
Then employing a great mix engineer and then a great mastering engineer.

online mastering
stem mastering
Click to expand...

Or spending your time listening and experimenting. The secret is in experience in doing this. Just like some musicians are just naturally good at what they do, so are recording engineers/producers/mastering guys. It takes a different type of mindset and listening ability to get things right. I know that I myself, am not capable of being awesome at everything and getting perfection. I keep trying tho.

Why am I responding to a dood who came here for all the secrets, and hasn't been here in a month? I just learned something huh?

Guess listening needs to be on his agenda.... :D
 
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