How Can I Make A Good Clear Signal Chain For Vocals?

[Doctor Varney]

Still relatively new to this. I've been playing around with plugins for days and now my ears have totally shut down on me. I don't know what's right and wrong any more and can't keep track of the changes I've made. So I thought I'd turn to the more experienced for advice.

Basically, what plugins should I be using on my input?

I have a KAM KDM Mic. It's a decent, low cost mic that cost around £30. I've been muddling through, with compressors, filters, noise gates and God knows what else and I've had enough. I feel I need to start from scratch because it seems so complicated and messed up now.

I'm trying to make audio books, so it's just spoken word. I'm trying to get rid of the hiss I'm getting and everything I seem to do just seems to either sound muffled or hissy and I can't seem to get a nice, balanced sound.

One of the biggest problems is not knowing how it will sound until I've made a recording. I've been repeating the same first chapter of this book for about a week and I can't seem to move on and get anything done, until I get can get some basic learning in mixing.

Can anyone advise me on what I should be doing to get the most out of my equipment? I have FL Studio 10 with a huge range of good quality plugins but I don't have a clue how to use them properly. I'm using the Behringer UB1204-FX mixer for pre-amping and input/ output. It has effects but I'm not really sure how to use them.

One of the main things I'm struggling with is how to use the compressor. I've just about got the gist of what you do with a compressor but I still don't understand it completely. I have loads of them and I have one called 'Maximus' which I've used on the input and selected 'Noise Gate' as a preset. I've found out how get the incoming wave with spikes of equal height, whereas if I record without it, it is much more 'up and down'. I've also tried the 'Fish Fillets' one called 'Floorfish' and even tried them all together. The question is, should I be driving for equal height on everything or is that wrong? My ears can't seem to decide any more.

So basically - when you record vocals - where do you start? What are the rules?

 

[ido1957]

I plug my M-Audio Sputnik or Rode NTK into my Lexicon U42S and record to Sonar 6.0 - I use nothing on the way in. I compress using the Modern Lost Angel Compressor with ~4 db GR (free) and Lexicon Reverb ~ Concert Hall in Aux Send (free came with U42S/Sonar). I'm still learning how to mix and my next battle will be with the mix EQ .

 

[RAMI]

Still relatively new to this. I've been playing around with plugins for days and now my ears have totally shut down on me. I don't know what's right and wrong any more and can't keep track of the changes I've made. So I thought I'd turn to the more experienced for advice.

Basically, what plugins should I be using on my input?

I have a KAM KDM Mic. It's a decent, low cost mic that cost around £30. I've been muddling through, with compressors, filters, noise gates and God knows what else and I've had enough. I feel I need to start from scratch because it seems so complicated and messed up now.

I'm trying to make audio books, so it's just spoken word. I'm trying to get rid of the hiss I'm getting and everything I seem to do just seems to either sound muffled or hissy and I can't seem to get a nice, balanced sound.

One of the biggest problems is not knowing how it will sound until I've made a recording. I've been repeating the same first chapter of this book for about a week and I can't seem to move on and get anything done, until I get can get some basic learning in mixing.

Can anyone advise me on what I should be doing to get the most out of my equipment? I have FL Studio 10 with a huge range of good quality plugins but I don't have a clue how to use them properly. I'm using the Behringer UB1204-FX mixer for pre-amping and input/ output. It has effects but I'm not really sure how to use them.

One of the main things I'm struggling with is how to use the compressor. I've just about got the gist of what you do with a compressor but I still don't understand it completely. I have loads of them and I have one called 'Maximus' which I've used on the input and selected 'Noise Gate' as a preset. I've found out how get the incoming wave with spikes of equal height, whereas if I record without it, it is much more 'up and down'. I've also tried the 'Fish Fillets' one called 'Floorfish' and even tried them all together. The question is, should I be driving for equal height on everything or is that wrong? My ears can't seem to decide any more.

So basically - when you record vocals - where do you start? What are the rules?

OK, first of all......relax.

Going by this post and others I've seen of yours, it seems like you have a tendancy of making things more complicated than they need to be. Your original question is: "How Can I Make A Good Clear Signal Chain For Vocals?", and the answer is that the simplest chain is the cleanest chain. If you don't know what a plug-in does, what makes you think you need to use it?

I think your best bet would be to go from your mic, into your inter face. That's it. Then, once you recorded your track (making sure you closed windows and did whatever else you need to make it as noise-free as possible), you can experiment with plug-ins and see what they do.

One way to go about it is to ask yourself what it is you don't like about the recording. Then, ask yourself why and look into what you need to fix it, which might not always be a plug-in. It might be how far you are from your mic, it might be your room, etc.....

Also, mix with your ears, not your eyes. If something sounds good, don't worry about what some cool looking "graph" or "ANAL-ize her" is telling you.

 

[Doctor Varney]

Great advice, RAMI. Which I've promptly taken. I admit, I have got in a froth with it (it's late; I'm tired) and you're right, I over-complicated this totally. So started from scratch. I've gone straight in and clean, as you suggested. On the output I've put myself a Spitfish (De-Esser) and the Floorfish (mild gate) and applied a computed noise gate to the recording. I've EQed some of the mid range down so it sounds smoother and added a bit of reverb, much milder this time, with a touch of low cut. I'm still getting some knock off on K's with that computed noise gate I used. This is why I wanted to add a noise gate in the form of a plug in but I get a bit confused when playing with the attack and release.

Thanks again for the response and the straight talk, mate. It has helped a lot.

 

[Doctor Varney]

I plug my M-Audio Sputnik or Rode NTK into my Lexicon U42S and record to Sonar 6.0 - I use nothing on the way in. I compress using the Modern Lost Angel Compressor with ~4 db GR (free) and Lexicon Reverb ~ Concert Hall in Aux Send (free came with U42S/Sonar). I'm still learning how to mix and my next battle will be with the mix EQ .

I have the full pack of Moderns. I'll try that as well but I do tend to find those confusing. I've chosen the standard Fruity Reverb because it's mild and never sounds tinny like some I've tried.

I never seem to get any problems when mixing musical scores. It's always with the vocals. Because it's for a book, having silence in the mix is more crucial.

 

[aaronmcoleman]

Listen to Rami and keep it simple.

Mic->interface forget the rest. Once you have a nice sound that way (after experimenting with technique, positioning, singing, etc), come back with some pointed questions and some samples. Then maybe choose 1 simple compressor and we can help you learn how to use it. Keep it simple and go slow.

Your questions are kinda like, "how do I play guitar, I wanna shred like Eddie"...well first you gotta learn G-C-D then you can move on to more complicated stuff.

EDIT: whoops should have read the whole thing...audio books

 

[david42]

You're recording a talking book. Your only sound complaint is hiss.

The advice above is really good. But it's a perspective coming from multi-tracking and the best way to begin so that you avoid later problems when you mix.

But you're not doing that.

Since your work is the spoken voice alone, I'd say that it matters little whether you record it dry and add compression later or record it with compression to begin with. Whichever is fine, but you're not going to run into the problems musicians do later with multiple tracks. The cumulative wisdom is to record dry IN CASE whatever effect you might have used doesn't sit well in the MIX, but you're not gonna have a mix, so there's nothing it won't sit well with later.

The simplest thing seems to me to use noise removal to get rid of the hiss when you're done, whichever way, but I'd not necessarily concern myself with recording dry first. It's a time saving step to record dry in many cases when you are making music in a mix. I would imagine you'd have better work economy to set it up so it sounds the way you like it, leave it set up and come back the next day to read another chapter without changing any settings, and just turn it on and off the way it is. When finished, noise removal for all your chapters. Seems simplest to me. If your settings might get fiddled with (curious children around or others using the same equipment, etc. My cats sometimes rub themselves on knobs ha ha) then you'd be best recording dry so you can be sure it all sounds consistent by using your effect all at once.

Again I'm not saying any above is wrong or giving bad advice, but they are mostly coming from the music perspective it appears, and you're only gonna have the one track.

 

[Chili]

Yet another approach...

I think you need to identify the source of the hiss and eliminate it. Noise gates and compressor all have their uses, but in this case, you're using them as bandages.

I'm wondering if your £30 mic is up to the task. Cheap electronics are going to cause hiss. Also, you should be looking at the room you're recording in. Ventilation, computer noise, street noise, appliances all will create some kind of hiss or other unwanted noise. In music, you can get away with it because you've got backing tracks to hide most of it. But for spoken word, you can't cover it up.

eh, like I said, just another suggestion to throw on the pile.

 

[miroslav]

One of the main things I'm struggling with is how to use the compressor. I've just about got the gist of what you do with a compressor but I still don't understand it completely. I have loads of them and I have one called 'Maximus' which I've used on the input and selected 'Noise Gate' as a preset. I've found out how get the incoming wave with spikes of equal height, whereas if I record without it, it is much more 'up and down'. I've also tried the 'Fish Fillets' one called 'Floorfish' and even tried them all together. The question is, should I be driving for equal height on everything or is that wrong? My ears can't seem to decide any more.

So basically - when you record vocals - where do you start? What are the rules?

For spoken word...I don't think you really need to even use a comp. If there are a lot of dynamics in the speech (like there can be with storeytelling)...you don't want everything to be "even"...and since there isn't any other audio, then you can get away with leaving the dynamics as the speaker delivers them.
If anything..and I only say this as a possible, not a need-to...maybe a real soft limiter at the upper most peaks just to soften the rare ones, but leaving the rest untouched.
When you "juice up" a compressor...that may be the reason you are pulling up hiss/noise, and with spoken word, there's nothing else audio-wise that can help mask that...so in-between words, you hear the hiss/noise easily.

Like others have said...keep it clean and simple..."stright wire" mentality.
You need a mic that is very low noise, and a preamp that is clean/transparent.
After that...the speaker should be in control of dynamics and how the mic is worked....rather than slathering on all kinds of FX/Processing to correct later.

Which KAM KDM model do you have?
That might be the source of your hiss/noise. Is it a condenser or dynamic mic?

If you are going to be doing a lot of spoken word stuff...get a broadcaster's style of mic. Something like the Electro-Voice RE20 is an industry staple.
I do think you would be better off using a dynamic mic instead of a condenser for spoken word, no matter what brand/model you choose.

 

[Doctor Varney]

Blimey! Some fantastic suggestions and real down to earth advice here. I like the way some of you have tailored the advice exactly to my situation.

Someone mentioned the Modern LostAngel. Right, well I've made some progress using the "Straight wire" mentality suggested above. I have a process-IN strip which connects straight to the 'outside', a 'landing strip' which houses my 'tape deck' and then my process-OUT strip, which goes straight to the master. Already it sounds complex, but actually it's very simple and organised:
IN--->Record--->OUT--->

Cutting a long story short, I have achieved great results (I mean amazingly good!) with just the LostAngel comp. and Fruity Limiter (FL's native limiter) and set this up on the Process-OUT.

It was SO CLEAN with just this stupidly simple chain but I had to just try something to satisfy my curiosity... So I saved my pre-amp and gate presets and plonked them on the Process-IN just to see what would happen...

The result is a very nice clean .wav file with absolutley no hiss. It does (as expected) produce a very compressed, flat wave form, with virtually no outstanding spikes. Not to be too reliant on the visuals, closing my eyes and listening, it does sound very good. It's probably NOT advisable to process-IN on a noise gate - but I've set it up to give me the option. With a few clicks I can change things around very easily.

So... LESS IS MORE!

So I've thrown some EQ on the process-OUT as well as a mild de-esser (thank you, Spitfish!). Now I've got that silky, reduced mid-band feel that does my voice justice. I could now do with a little boost in the high-mids... Already I think it's going to be good enough to get a few books out, while the quest for sound quality continues.

The question of whether I want the gate up front, on the way in, or on the post, is one I'll have to let my ears decide (?). I'm sure most of you would advise putting the gate AFTER the recording...?

Also, I'm now learning to control the volume on my voice to reduce spikes. After all, it's my main instrument. Might as well learn how to play it!

 

[Doctor Varney]

Which KAM KDM model do you have?
That might be the source of your hiss/noise. Is it a condenser or dynamic mic?

KDM400. Billed as: Dynamic Vocal Mic (next up from the bottom of the range). Memraflex grille, using XLR-XLR into the Behringer mxer's pre-amp ---> E=MU 0404 internal card interface in the computer.

At present I'm surrounded by the Mrs's sewing stuff. Heaps of material and books. Just try getting an unwanted echo in there! It's as flat as can be. When she moves out into the other room, as you can well imagine, I've then got the job of treating the room.

If you could possibly suggest a better mic, I'd be happy to start shopping around for Xmas. I've got to get some books on the market first though.

 

[Bobbsy]

I think it's time somebody mentioned the elephant in the room.

If you have hiss, there's something wrong with your recording chain. It may be your microphone or what it's plugged into--or a combination of the two. Using plugins etc. to remove the hiss should be a last resort, not a standard part of your recording chain. The results will never be as satisfactory as starting with a clean, quiet signal.

I'm going to suggest that you should budget and save up to spend a bit more on your microphone. Normally I'd suggest a standard XLR microphone with a separate USB interface--but if this is too rich for your blood, in your particular case a USB mic might do the job for you since it's unlikely you'll ever need more mics and your monitoring needs are small. Something like an AT2020 USB should do the job for you--or, if you can stretch your budget, a Blue Yeti USB.

Once you have a good signal to start with, your processing needs should be slight. On most audio books, a bit of light compression should be it. Or maybe some light EQ just to ensure clarity.

I'm afraid that trying to fix a faulty signal source with plug ins is a bit like straightening the deck chairs on the Titanic.

Edited to Add: I posted before noticing that there's a page two with some more details.

The EMU is an okay interface for line level signals and most Behringer mixers are okayish so long as you don't have to crank up the gain beyond half or three quarters on the trims. I'd probably go for a basic condenser mic which should add to the crispness and clarity without any hiss. A mic I've been very impressed with lately for voice work is the sE Electronics X1 which isn't too badly expensive. Also, they've been doing packages of the X1 with a Reflexion filter which might just solve your room treatment issues as well.

 

[Doctor Varney]

Brilliant, Bobsy! I've noted those mic suggestions and will start reading some reviews, mate.

Thanks for the detailed reply. Yes, I think you're right - but right now, I think I need to go for a fix. When I get a new mic, I suppose it will sort out a lot of problems.

One thing I have just discovered: I had hiss and hum. I just unplugged my Roland keyboard's power adapter from the mains and the hum stopped. I'm just left with the hiss.

So, I'm gonna run with the fix for now, get a few books out to test my market - and then start looking at the mics you've suggested.

And when I get set up for real in this room, I intend to sling the audio cables carefully away from any power lines.

Thanks again.