how can i get a high fidelity DISTORTION ?

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underp

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how can i improve the sound quality of Guitar Distortion Recordings

I've been trying to record some demos, but i can't get i great sound fidelity. The Sound quality is horrible.

what i'm doing wrong ?
what is the best way to record distortion ?

i don't really have the money to buy a Tube preamp and a great compressor.

Is there any trick that we can use, like a secret EQ preset in the console, some great audio filter in the PC, or something like that ?

My actual Settings are :

Guitar--> Pedal--> AMP @ MIC---> Console(mixer) ----> PC

---------------

The Mic is like 3 inch from the speaker cone.
 
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do you like the sound coming out of the amp on its own (not recorded), because if you don't like the sound of your amp, you will never like it recorded.

You need to define your chain more preciisely, what is the amp? what is the mic? what is the preamp/mixer? what is your soundcard? what are your recording to?

does the phrase "gain staging" mean anything to you? If so, great, if not, there is one of your biggest problems and your first homework assignment.
 
High fidelity distortion, I love it... like cruel kindness or jumbo shrimp...
 
no. the distortion sounds great in the AMP, is the recording what suc#s.

i mean, i get an anoying sound ( to much disturbing, imposible to hear )

i can't identify the chrods i'm playing.

sound like a recording out of phase or something, but it's well recorded. ( it sounds better when you pull down the MID tones, but it's not the idea ).

i know It's a common problem when recording distortions, is just that i don't really know how is called this problem.


sample :
 
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The problem is WAAAAAAYYYYYY too much gain - you've got a swarm of angry bees there.... just a mushy, indistinct mess.

The fact is, you need far less gain than you'd think for recording.
 
well, that's hard to explain to the guitar player ( if he doesn't hear that saturation, then he feels like he's playing ricky martin songs )

if you hear groups like mudvaine, guitar are even more satured, but sounds great ( i mean great sound fidelity )

But it's something that also happen when recording clean electric guitars, the "bell sound" is horrible . If there's any way to get rid of the belling sound, then the distortion will be fine.

i mean, the sound looks like a WMA file of 10kps. Distortion, saturationm doesn't really matter. You can hear a BAD distortion, but well recorded.

That's what i want.
 
First off, you need a good sound source (ie, good-sounding amp in a good sounding room, played by a good player) before you even think about a "good recording." Remember, shit going in, means shit coming out. Note also that good-sounding generally means "appropriate-sounding for the song."

Then you need a good front-end (mic --> mic pre --> A/D --> recorder) to capture your good-sounding and context-appropriate source.

You seem to be under the impression that you simply set everything to 11 and throw whatever mic in front, and expect it to work - that simply isn't the way it goes down.....
 
hahahahaahahah :D you have no idea of how i'm Laughing right now.

"shit going in, means shit coming out", that was great.


hehe.

so changing the subject,

my console mixer has XLR inputs, do i need a mic preamp ?

what's "A/D" ?
 
A/D - meant analog/digital converter

You didn't mention - what IS your signal chain now? (specific gear)
 
Guitar--> Pedal--> AMP @ MIC---> Console(mixer) ----> PC

I mean :

1- Guitar to the Pedal
2- Pedal to the Amp
3- Amp miked with a "uni-directional" mic
4- Mic pluged to the console with an XLR cable.
5- Console out, plugged to the PC -Line IN


Guitar ---> Squier ( classic ) like Blink 182 guitars ( but a cheap one )
Pedal ----> Zoom 505
Amp ----> Squier PR-408 (28W)
Mic ----> Audiodyne ( Uni )
Mixer ----> Phonic 8x2
Sound Card ----> Adi 1885
 
Seriously: gain staging. Look into it. It means you need to pay attention to the gain at every stage of your audio path.


Okay, for now lets pretend that the sound coming out of the amp is what you want (ie. the sound from the amp is exactly the sound that you want recorded).

1) mic placement is important

2) Setting up your mixer properly is critical!!! Set the fader on the channel to Unity (0), then turn the gain knob until it clips...then roll it back just a tad so it doesn't clip in the loudest sections of what you are playing. Now you have "gain staged" your preamp on the mic.

3) are you recording out of the "main out " of the mixer? (by the way, the pres in that mixer are part of your problem, as is the mic itself...try a Shure sm57, it isn't the most common amp-mic for no reason)

If you are recording out of the main out, you need to set the level on the fader so that the output isn't clipping in your soundcard ... check the recording meter in the soundcard mixer on your computer . If this is clipping, you need to roll back on the main fader of the mixer.

This is how you "gain stage".. every element in the path from the front end first needs to be set to its highest level with no clipping . This must be done for every track you record, and everytime you record a new track/new instrument, this needs to be redone.

Once you have all this stuff worked out, then you can play with mic placement. But every time you move the mic you need to re-gainstage.

Next, check out playing with less distortion. All you have to do is a little research to prove to your guitarist that even the heavy hitters do not record with anywhere near as much gain as you think they are using. Experiment, and try it out yourself. If you can't be bothered to experiment then there is no point in recording, it is the only way you get good sound.
 
by the way, the "preamp" that you are using is in the mixer. Each channel with an XLR input and/or a gain knob has a preamp.

and your soundcard has the A/D converter in it.

Sadly, you have a cheap guitar into a cheap effects unit into a cheap amp into a cheap mic into a cheap mixer into a cheap soundcard..... hence the comment from Blue Bear..."shit in means shit out".

But yuou can polish that turd with good gainstaging work. But remember it is only a polished turd.
 
underp said:
Guitar ---> Squier ( classic ) like Blink 182 guitars ( but a cheap one )
Pedal ----> Zoom 505
Amp ----> Squier PR-408 (28W)
Mic ----> Audiodyne ( Uni )
Mixer ----> Phonic 8x2
Sound Card ----> Adi 1885
Click to expand...

That's a pretty low end path from start to finish. If mic placement and proper gain staging isn't giving you a good tone then it may be time for some upgrades.
 
i don't really think, that my equipment, has anything to do with my sound @@@@@@ FIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIDELITYYYYYYYYYY @@@@@@ ( to hard to understand ? )

I mean, we're not talking about a horrible distortion, or a bad music, or a bad guitar player. We're talking about 8khz sound.

I mean, no matter how bad am i on the guitar, i got to get FULL quality AUDIO, you think, that my voice in the microphone has anything to do with Audio Fidelity ?, i don't think so.

Take any of your MP3's and re-compress them to 64kps(MONO).

and compare the orignal with the 64kps version, WELL that's the sound i'm getting here.

YOU KNOW THE MUSIC IS RIGHT, BUT SOUND FIDELITY SUC#S.

-------------------------------

In this case, i'm totally agree with the microphone thing. If something is wrong, got to be the MIC or the sound card, but anything else.
 
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underp said:
i don't really think, that my equipment, has anything to do with my sound quality.
Click to expand...
Then, friend - you have A LOT to learn.......
 
underp said:
YOU KNOW THE MUSIC IS RIGHT, BUT SOUND FIDELITY SUCKS.
Click to expand...

Okay. And fidelity is highly (some would say directly) related to the quality of your....? Anyone?

By the way, the guys commented on your stuff 'cause they're used to looking backwards in a chain for the source of a problem. In this case, they just happened to look all the way back.

MP
 
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In all this chain, there's only one responsable, the one who's capturing the AUDIO ( oviously the MIC ).

I will have to try another MIC, definitly.

Nothing personal, my english is just not to good, but i think i was very clear talking about the fidelity stuff, i do beleive that we can hear bad instruments with great sound fidelity, i still don't understand why i'm getting this 4khz recordings.

Got be the mic. The problem is that i don't live in the US, and in my country we don't see shure products and stuffs like that, and also the are very expensive, like 3 times the regular price. Is total abuse, we have to deal with little resources. Hehe.

In my room, the Software has been my salvation for year, i solve most of this troubles with software, getting veru decent results.

But got to say that DISTORTION is fuc#ing me hard, WOW, i never tought it was so hard to treat. totally imposible to do.
 
okay, so you can't afford to upgrade gear. Did you read anything about the gainstaging I mentioned? That is the only way you are going to make it sound better. That is the only way you are going to make any recording sound better.

First question: is anything clipping (ie going into the red)?

Obviously you want the amp to distort, but you don't want anything else distorting. Jeez, read my post on how to gainstage your gear, it will make a world of difference.
 
i'm going slow in my upgrades, but guitars and stuffs depends on guitar player.

But i'm very interested.

what exactly is gainstaging ?
sorry by the ignorance. my english is bad

in the console, anything is exactly touching the red mark, they are always in the middle, cause i'm afraid to get distortion in the digital recording, i always end normalizing the audio.

i know is not good, but is not that serious to affect the fidelity in that way.

any keyword, to find your post ?
 
cstockdale said:
Seriously: gain staging. Look into it. It means you need to pay attention to the gain at every stage of your audio path.


Okay, for now lets pretend that the sound coming out of the amp is what you want (ie. the sound from the amp is exactly the sound that you want recorded).

1) mic placement is important

2) Setting up your mixer properly is critical!!! Set the fader on the channel to Unity (0), then turn the gain knob until it clips...then roll it back just a tad so it doesn't clip in the loudest sections of what you are playing. Now you have "gain staged" your preamp on the mic.

3) are you recording out of the "main out " of the mixer? (by the way, the pres in that mixer are part of your problem, as is the mic itself...try a Shure sm57, it isn't the most common amp-mic for no reason)

If you are recording out of the main out, you need to set the level on the fader so that the output isn't clipping in your soundcard ... check the recording meter in the soundcard mixer on your computer . If this is clipping, you need to roll back on the main fader of the mixer.

This is how you "gain stage".. every element in the path from the front end first needs to be set to its highest level with no clipping . This must be done for every track you record, and everytime you record a new track/new instrument, this needs to be redone.

Once you have all this stuff worked out, then you can play with mic placement. But every time you move the mic you need to re-gainstage.

Next, check out playing with less distortion. All you have to do is a little research to prove to your guitarist that even the heavy hitters do not record with anywhere near as much gain as you think they are using. Experiment, and try it out yourself. If you can't be bothered to experiment then there is no point in recording, it is the only way you get good sound.
Click to expand...
this is cstockdale's post on gain staging,
make sure you read it underp...
 
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