Help with recording live worship...

  • Thread starter Thread starter windwords7
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I'm not really experienced with live consoles, but I looked up the Yamaha DM2000. According to their diagram in their brochure on the site, you can hook up the mixer to a PC via USB or Mini-YGDAI cards which have AES/EBU, Adat, TDIF and Firewire (although are these cards optional with the unit??). Again, sorry if I'm way off base on this one...I only did a quick research on it.
http://www.yamaha.com/yamahavgn/Documents/ProAudio/dm2000.pdf starting on page 8. :cool:
 
"Discretion is the better part of valour"

Rather than spend a loada cash on a highly expensive soundcard/interface, if you want something portable with at least eight or so inputs get hold of a digital porta-studio like the Fostex VF-16 or VF60 - although the audio is only 16-bit (CD quality) something like this will be easy to use, cheap, highly portable and adequate for your purposes - you'll be able to transfer all tracks as wavs to your PC afterwards using the optical input on a basic semi-pro soundcard. I have recorded bands in live situations this way using pre-fader sends from the front-of-house desk (in larger venues), although I understand that most churches will have a simple PA setup. If your sound guy has a decent desk you'll be able to set up two sets of signals - one for the PA and one for recording (Aux send/insert/direct record-ask the dude) or you can use your own mixer. I find this easier for live recording than moving a PC about (aargh), and the cost of the portable HD recorder and budget card (eg. E-MU 0404) won't exceed that of a swish interface. If, however, you intend to expand your PC system into a fully-integrated pro-studio setup above and beyond the immediate task of recording church concerts, consider a high-end soundcard/interface (RME Hammerfall etc) instead. Better yet, install a multi-track open-reel tape machine in your local church and record on the most stable (& best-sounding) format ever invented!

By the way, using a mixture of both desk output signals and an additional stereo pair of condenser mics out front will help capture not only an accurate mix but audience reaction/hall ambience. Sometimes "dry" signal feeds sound a bit dead in a live context, although vital to overall mix balance. Be sure to check for phase coherency, though, when using combined signals (especially drums, if they are used). I use waves PAZ analyzer for this purpose, as well as for checking even frequency response. If combined signals cause phase probs ("swishy-phasey-sounds") alternative mic placement is preferable to resorting to drastic phase-reversal switching (your church PA system probably doesn't have this facility anyway). If you have a good-sounding space (most churches are naturally acoustically reverberant), I say use it!

Ideally, you'll want to capture the "feel" of the live performance above all (especially in this context), and so a discrete, easily-operable, flexible and portable way of achieving this result is surely preferable!

Good luck in your endeavors!
Ali.
 
Just a quick thought, I'm not really sure about this. I had looked into this a little to do 8 tracks on a notebook. Behringer makes a new interface that is usb 2.0 and will handle adat in. (BCA2000?) They also make an 8 channel A/D converter that will output adat. I don't remember the number for that one, but it has 8 xlr's and/or 8 line in. It also has 8 analog direct outs. So wouldn't it be possible to use the A/D converter on the inserts of your house board to generate the adat signal to send to the software of your choice? The interface comes with all the drivers and was around 270.00 the last time I looked. The A/D was around 220.00. Add software you may already have, and you should have a pretty nice, and, how can I say this, unobtrusive system to route the adat into your software. If anyone knows why this wouldn't work, please let me know. I am still looking for a portable system, and love to learn about new tech.
 
Soileak,

I actually suggested the Behringer AD8000 ADAT interface in my long diatribe above in item 1a.

As far as using a notebook computer, though, you'll have to use a firewire interface (assuming your notebook has an IEEE 1394/Firewire port like mine has). I don't think any of the USB interfaces yet allow 8 channels of audio, but with USB 2.0 it is entirely feasible, I just haven't seen any devices yet.

I would suggest a word of caution, however, with trying to track 8 simultaneous channels on a laptop. Laptops use slower speed hard drives than desktop computers use (typically 4200 rpm vs. 7200 rpm), and I would definitely think twice about this. An alternative, though, if you do have a firewire interface would be to use an external firewire hard drive that has a faster speed.

There are many different ways to get things recorded, some better than others, and it all comes down to what you want to accomplish, what you are able or willing to spend, and what compromises you are willing to live with.

Good luck,

Darryl.....
 
Ok guys, thanks for all your help so far. Now I've heard our church is considering the DM1000 instead of the 2000. I've just dropped a 200gig HD drive in my computer and I going to be installing a firewire card and a faster processor soon. I'm still thinking Protools or Cubase. Does the DM1000 really change things much?
 
Bump! We are going to likely end up with the lesser DM1000 but is seems practicaly still a suitable board for recording live. Thoughts?!! Thanks!
 
Doesn't change much from my point of view, you just have 48 channels rather than 96; I didn't think you'd use 96 channels anyway. I still think the board has better onboard DSP than you are likely to have on PC, so I'm still for the 24 track hard drive recorder solution.
 
mshilarious said:
Doesn't change much from my point of view, you just have 48 channels rather than 96; I didn't think you'd use 96 channels anyway. I still think the board has better onboard DSP than you are likely to have on PC, so I'm still for the 24 track hard drive recorder solution.

Ok, that is good to know. BTW I am using a desktop not a laptop in case there was any confusion.

I am still considering the Hard Drive Recorder heavily.
 
Bump for new thoughts, new equipment in the last few months. I just met with a producer and we are going to do a studio 4 song EP and drop like 200-300 copies to raise the rest of the funds for what we will end up buying.

Ultimately we need to be able to do live worship sets.

Any thoughts will be so greatly appreciated.

Jake
 
If I were you, i would buy an Alesis HD24 and run the omni outs of your yamaha to the inputs on that. This way, you only have to bring the alesis with you, not the entire computer setup. Its really a no-hassle deal to record either, just press record. When you get home, send all the files over to the PC and do some mixing.
 
If Protools software (6.1) supports RME Interface.

instead of M-box with only 2 mic inputs why don't u buy a RME DSP 36 Interface this would help u a lot fot your live music recording. But you will have to check up if your Protools would run with this Hardware....if Protools is running with RME then it s a very stable system but provided Protools software is suppors RME. Guys can any one clear this doubt
 
wow, this thread is like trying to explain brain surgery in the dark to a first year med student over the phone... good luck, hope everything turns out fabulous... ;)
 
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borntoplease said:
wow, this thread is like trying to explain brain surgery in the dark to a first year med student over the phone... good luck, hope everything turns out fabulous... ;)


Yeah, I know. Thanks for taking the time guys. I've actually learned a lot and we are making progress. I just wanted some fresh thoughts about possible new hardware and software. BTW we have not bought the board that was origanlly talked about in the thread. That is on the church side and has been delayed. In the mean time we are moving forward to buy recording eqiupment regardless if that board is there or not. So don't base it totally on the board please.

Thanks!

Jake :)
 
rahul said:
instead of M-box with only 2 mic inputs why don't u buy a RME DSP 36 Interface this would help u a lot fot your live music recording. But you will have to check up if your Protools would run with this Hardware....if Protools is running with RME then it s a very stable system but provided Protools software is suppors RME. Guys can any one clear this doubt

I am looking at a 24 input device at the min. I will check out the RME DSP 36.

Thanks!
 
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