Help Twonky Use Reverb Real Smart! please.

  • Thread starter Thread starter twonky
  • Start date Start date
T

twonky

New member
Lads:

I am in the middle of what is becoming maybe the longest session for the recording of a 5 song ep that ever was. Like almost a year of thinking and rethinking, rerecording and "fixing"

So we have finally reached the home stretch and are about to begin mixing the last two songs.

So here is where you guys/gals come in.

One or two of the songs are going to need some reverb.

Now, I have kind of shyed away from reverb for two reasons:

1. I tend to prefer dry roomy recordings
2. Reverb can be used really right or REALLY wrong and my fear is that it will wash everthing out and eliminate the attack and punch of stuff.

The song we are mixing is a real sparse kind of quiet song w/ drums (mostly toms and kick w/ some HH), Rhodes, occasional guitar and vocals. it is real quiet and then gets loud w/ Fuzzed bass and little tiny guitar solo w/ the drums and Rhodes pounding.

My question is this:
Any of you cats have some tricks you might share on how to achieve a good verbed sound w/ out washing out the whole song? i.e. are there certain instuments that when reverb is applied are more likely to give the illusion that the all of the instruments are verbed. and how 'bout the loud part is it good to take those verbs down to make way for the big dynamic jump?

I have Waves and Hyperprism verbs, and some others.

Hook a mug up w/ your knowledge

Thanks in advance

Twonky
 
Well....

If you try out some reverb, and it makes it sound better, it's good.... if you dial up a setting, and it makes it sound lifeless, muddy, dull and buried, then it's wrong!

Just jump in there and try stuff out -- no one but you can determine what verbs you need or want for your particular context...!


Twonky wrote:
2. Reverb can be used really right or REALLY wrong and my fear is that it will wash everthing out and eliminate the attack and punch of stuff.
Click to expand...
 
Hmmmmmm

thanks Bear

I kinda have that part figured out. I am not neccessarily waitng to put reverb on the track until someone tells me exactly which one to use and how much of it the particular track needs.

I will reiterate my question, are there instuments that generally can kind of give the illusion of verb on a whole song w/ out having verb on a whole song?

Like maybe drum overheads or snare or vox. I am mainly looking for some possible starting techniques to get me primed so I can develop my own "style"

Twonky
 
Actually - instead of reverbs, try using short delays and short-time ambient effects --- you'll get ambience without muddying things up like reverb tends to do.....

You'll need some decent effect units for good-sounding short ambience effects, though.... the cheapies usually sound metallic and harsh!
 
Yo Twonk Man:

I'll make a comment or two about reverb -- I don't know much about your gear but reverb is reverb.

On a couple of recorders I've had, there were two ins for two reverbs and that helped me isolate a good sound for vocals.

I don't think too many CD's out there today have vocals without reverb enhancement.

Never had to use much reverb if any on drums unless I wanted to create something peculiar.

One reverb unit I still use has tweakable patches but the tweaking is kind of limited.

My current box, the Yam 2816, has good verbs and there are two of them to patch in, plus all the other goodies to play with.

I have spent hours getting the vocal reverb the way my ears want to hear it. I guess that's the fun of recording -- all of the options that are available. Oh, I almost NEVER use reverb on bass as some of my patches on my syn seem to have plenty on the patch, plus I manipulate the EQ for punchy bass.

Hope some of this helps. I'm sure the Bear spends a good deal of time getting things just right for his ears and clients.

Green Hornet




:D :D :cool: :cool:
 
The Green Hornet said:
I'm sure the Bear spends a good deal of time getting things just right for his ears and clients.
Click to expand...
Don't be silly, GH... I simpy throw up the faders, and the magic is there!!! ;)

:D :D
 
twonky said:
I have Waves and Hyperprism verbs, and some others.
Click to expand...

Suggestion 1: I'd go with the Waves RVerb, if you have it.

Suggestion 2: Audition the different reverbs at 100% wet . . . you'll get a better idea of exactly what that reverb is doing. While at 100% wet, If you stumble on a setting -- either by preset, tweaking, or accident -- that doesn't seem as "washy" as the others, then chances are it'll fit the bill when you mix it in at a more modest setting.

Suggestion 3: Now try the Reverb at 60-70%. Try to get an idea of the reverb's "tempo." This might be tricky/impossible to do, but give it a stab anyway. :D Is the main reflection of the verb in tempo with the beat of the song? Adjust the pre-delay until it sounds like the reflections is in time with the music.

Suggestion 4: On critical tracks, try copying the track and writing a reverb to it at 70-100% wet. Keep the original track and blend the reverb track in with it during the mix. No particular advantage to this method, really, other than it might save on some of the processor load and give you a little more flexibility. :D

:D Good luck
 
Man You guys are some stand up fellers!

Once I glean all if this knowledge, you guys will freak at how bad and my mixes are and....and the reverb is just so...

You will think "What the F*ck!?! How did the Twonky become so good?"

or you might think that I can't read, it could really go either way
 
Don't listen to Chessrock... he's the type of guy who puts 'verb on trains that are outside!!!!

:D :D



sorry chess, was about that time again...! ;)
 
Last edited:
This is nothing particulalrly radical or original, but it's the way I often work with reverbs. This does not imply that suggestions to replace reverb with delays are inferior, it just depends on my mood and the material I'm working with:

When I start a mix (in Pro Tools, but you could do this in analog or other DAW's) I set up two sets of stereo returns with a small room on one and a medium plate on another. The sizes of each (as well as other parametyers like predelay and HF roll-off) will later be tweaked to the tempo and feel of the song, so this is just a starting point.

Now I just listen to the song - if I feel like a certain element is lifeless I'll send some of that track via an aux send to the room to give it a little dimension. If I need an actual audible decay on certain tracks (like maybe claves or certain vocals) I'll use the plate.

As the mix develops, I may find I may need a third or fourth reverb for a particular element (like a tiled room for hand claps, e.g.)

Size adjustments are made because often you don't want the decay to overlap onto the next note or beat, but you may want it to go right up to it (again, depending on song and style). Predelay keeps the initial attacks clean, and hi-frequency roll-offs keep the dreaded reverb splash and sibilance down.

You can get as creative as you want - for instance, changing reverb types and/or settings on a bridge or chorus. Panning a reverb to one side in certain spots as a special effect. Raising the reverb as the dry signal is lowered to create a "ascending to heaven" effect... we're only limited by our imagination and the bounds of good taste (assuming we have any of either!);)
 
Actually - just re-read my post-- I didn't mean that one should really replace reverb with delay.... it's just that reverb doesn't always have to be a first reach in providing ambience to a track!
 
You didn't say what sort of mood or feel you are trying to impart to this tune.
 
Real Smart Reverb

As Sennheiser said, the mood you are trying to impart is important.
Don't be afraid to try mono reverb on an instrument/voice either. Sometimes that can help add life to a sound without muddying it up. Try panning the reverb to the opposite side of the dry signal or even line them up in the soundfield.
Everything doesn't have to be "stereoized".
 
A good idea!

this is all really good advice, its cool. I will try lots of these ideas.

As far as mood, the song is pretty somber, about sad stuff. Is there a such thing as "sad" reverb? 'SADVERB'

If there isnt such a thing there oughta be.
 
Thanks again for the info fellers.

Ed, just got around to reading your demistifying reverb post. It was very informative just what I needed.

Twonk
 
just to keep the thread going a little more....I usually find that a roomy 'verb on just the snare will bring much the whole drumkit to life. Then a little overall reverb (all tracks, one reverb, don't overdo, think steak....medium rare....) sometimes helps a little more without actually muddying everything up noticeably.
 
What's the difference between reverb and delay in terms of the sound, and in terms of how often you use it in the mix?

On my first album, just guitar and voice, I dealt with getting the levels right. On my second album, I dealt with levels and EQ. On this album I'm working with now: levels, EQ, and reverb.

Okay, so how will learning delay improve the sound of my next album?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top