Help on micing Guitar Amps?

Monsoon

Monsoon

New member
I'm new to the home recording thing. Having fun learning, spending lots of time reading this forum. I'm having a problem micing my guitar amp, and I was hoping you guys would be able to give me some suggestions. Here's the thing:

I'm running a Line6 Spider II head into a Crate cab. Using an SM-57 to mic the cab, running it into a DMP-3 preamp, then into an M-Audio 2496 installed in a Dell. Running Cakewalk's Sonar 3.

When I play the guitar, I like the sound coming out of the amp. When I place the mic in front of it and record, the sound coming out when I playback is thin, tinny, and, well, crappy. If I run a line direct out of the head into the preamp (no mic), the sound I get when I play back is thick, rich, and exactly what I wanted to hear.

I've tried moving the mic all over. close. far. angled, straight. high. low. I just get different degrees of crappy.

I'm about ready to just scrap the mic and do my recording direct in. But I feel like I'm missing something. If that was really the best way to record, then why all this fuss about what microphones to use, etc? Why doesn't everyone just do direct line in?

So, somebody, please help. What am I doing wrong with the mic?
 
Is your mic and cable OK? What does it sound like when you speak into it? Full and rich, or thin? You should get a good proximity effect with the 57 - increased bass as you get closer to the sound source. When you say "close", does that mean an inch or two from the speaker?
 
Where are your ears in relation to the cabinet? If you like how it sounds there, maybe you can use that as a start?? Also, does your room have a lot of natural reverb that you like? If so, it will be lost when close mic'ing. You may have to add it in the mix... Good luck, let us know!!
 
Thanks, guys. The mic and cable are fine. Vocals work fine. I kept playing around a little more with placement. I saw something in another thread about placing the mic way down low and about a foot back. I tried that, and putting the mic way down low (almost on the ground) picks up the whole cabinet sound (don't ask me how or why, it just does). So, I'm getting good input now. :D Thanks!
 
Ok, you talked about trying different distances with positioning, but what about placement on the speaker? Were you just sticking it some random spot, or did you try putting it really close up against the center of the cone, and going from there? You also should get your cab off the ground.
 
Monsoon said:
If I run a line direct out of the head into the preamp (no mic), the sound I get when I play back is thick, rich, and exactly what I wanted to hear.
Click to expand...


if this is "exactly what you want to hear" than double track it and you should be good to go.
 
OneArmedScissor said:
Ok, you talked about trying different distances with positioning, but what about placement on the speaker? Were you just sticking it some random spot, or did you try putting it really close up against the center of the cone, and going from there? You also should get your cab off the ground.
Click to expand...

Thanks. I'll experiment with those suggestions, too.
 
i place sm 57 on the guitar cabinet like this:

:)

if the smily is speaker, than one of the smiliys eye is where the mic is pointing, at the 90 degrees towards the box, about one inch from speaker. and that is all the policy i use. sometimes i move mic a little backward and that's it.
 
Yeah, that's what I was trying, but that was giving me the tinny sound. I had it midway up the cab, and the midpoint of the speaker. Neither gave me acceptable results. Maybe I have bad speakers on top. :confused:
 
That is very possible. Try all the speakers. They likely will sound different when you are micing that close. Also, the more you move towards the outer edge of the speaker, the thinner it will probably sound. The sound is generally thicker and bassier in the very center of the cone, so micing that really close should give you a decent proxmity effect and a fat sound.
 
another way to get a good thick bottom end ,although unconventional but works is to place the cab agianst the wall or in a corner and put a 57 or md421 on one of the bottom speakers near the center of the speaker and low hendix used to do this when he would have his marshalls cranked up i tried it and it works.
 
i also read about how wooden floor gives a special boost to guitars. find some wooden plate for about one square meter and give the cabinet on it. than place a mic somehow like that:
g. cabb |
|
| / mic
|

the article says, that wood reflection could give very fat sound!
i will try it myself next time i will record guitars, too see what i get!
experiment a little bit!

also check the preamp settings, specially if it has some eq on it, it could be possible that you cut some important fequencies!

have a nice day! :)
 
just one more thing! in my opinnion, you will never get the eksact cab sound that your ear hears no metter how you place the mic or no metter what kind of mic you use, so consider to play a little bit with amps eq and cut some highs and boost some bootoms and mids. in the end, you hear guitar about 1 meter(3 feet) from speaker, where the sound isnt the same as an inch from speaker! :)

have a nice time!
 
I think the amp is the real problem here. I got rid of my Line 6 for a Fender evil twin just to get something with some oumph! Its a lot like comparing an electronic drum kit with a real one. There's something magical about tubes and a microphone will pick it out. I found the Line 6 thin and overprocessed for recording.
 
I have to kind of agree with the tube amp thing i started colecting and playing tube amps for quite a few years and when i started to record i could never get a good sound so i tried the pod and the cyber twin but in the end im back to old tube amps good mics and pre-amps you just cant fabricate that sound with anything else sadly
 
You know what I just realized? Spiders are known for sounding thin and kind of fake coming out of cab, but they have speaker emulation on the direct out, which makes it sound a lot better than the normal direct outs on most other amps.

Actually, the new Pod stuff isn't that bad. People are always posting clips on the amp forum over at Harmony Central. Those guys are serious tone freaks (like to the point of being obsessive compulsive or something, I kid you not), and some have said they like the recorded sound of some of the new models better than the real amps.

But it's still not going to be just like a tube amp, no matter what. It's not necessarily the sound, but that they just react differently to the way you play.

For recording, if it is a good sound, you don't have much to worry about. If it sounds good, people aren't going to hear it and go, "That's a tube/solid state/digital guitar sound."
 
GET THE AMP OFF THE FLOOR! :D

that's rule #1 when you get to recording an amp. a floor will suck all the life out of a cabinet. put it on a couple wooden chairs.

second, i have to echo turnitdown's comment--if you like what you hear in the room with your ears, put the diaphragm of the mic right where your ears are. it should capture what you're hearing.

also, you might want to try a condenser on there along with the 57. i really like the Studio Projects B1 in conjunction with a shure 545 (pre-57). sometimes, depending on the amp/guitar, i use a sennheiser 835 instead of the shure. different flavor of the same.


cheers,
wade
 
Konanian said:
I think the amp is the real problem here. I got rid of my Line 6 for a Fender evil twin just to get something with some oumph! Its a lot like comparing an electronic drum kit with a real one. There's something magical about tubes and a microphone will pick it out. I found the Line 6 thin and overprocessed for recording.
Click to expand...

Yeah, but there's that pesky cost factor...
 
stringking said:
another way to get a good thick bottom end ,although unconventional but works is to place the cab agianst the wall or in a corner and put a 57 or md421 on one of the bottom speakers near the center of the speaker and low hendix used to do this when he would have his marshalls cranked up i tried it and it works.
Click to expand...

Yeah, that's what I ended up doing, actually. Got good results with with that.
 
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