Help me out a little... recording questions!

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Fattitude632

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My band and I recently purchased a Tascam 414mkii 4 track and a Nady Starpower 9 Mic and we know absolutely nothing about it. It hasn't come through the mail yet so I'll use this time to try to figure out how the hell it works. First off, we're all 15 and we have so little money its sick... so we cant get any other eqiuptment. The 414mkii was the only one in our budget worth buying. Ok, now the questions... get comfortable because there's a lot.

Whats the best way to record (distorted) guitars? Using a mic and placing it in front of the amp? Or out through the jack in the back of the amp directly into the multi? Its a 130 watt Peavey tube amp (i donno if thats relelvant).

Should we record each instrument one at a time, or once where we all play at the same time? If we each individually recorded our track, how can we make it so we're all in sync with eachother?

And finally, is there any place i can listen to a recording done with a Tascam 414mkii? Like an mp3?

Thanks a lot
 
a friend of mines as a 414mk3 and were in hiphop but i'm 16 and samples live guitar from dis cat on my block and what i do i hook it directly in i dont really like mic placement b-cuz u would have to know mic placements and all this other stuff but its cool but i like the 414 its cool but i'm a p.c. head so i rock trackz on p.c. yeah just holla at me www.mp3.com/Killah_Trakz. just email me at wu_crazed@hotmail.com i'll help u out.
 
thanks

the live guitar... how would you get other instruments or vocals matched up perefectly with it? can you listen and play at the same time?
 
yeah he live guitar and yes u can play and record at the same time do u have aol or msn messenger if u do gimme ur name.
 
wow... i remember when

how many members are in your band and does everyone play an instrument? if so, your drummer is going to hate you if you only have 1 mic.

i've got a whirlwind director DI box that i connect to the output jack of my fender deville amp. sometimes i record that way, but usually i use a shure sm57 mic on the amp.

you probably won't get a good feel for each other if you aren't playing together.

i had a band when i was 17 and this is what we had to work with:

8 channel peavey mixer we got from a pawn shop.
5 mics we got from pawn shops, and 1 the keyboard player stole from school*
tascam 4 track cassette recorder

we used the peavey to mix the 4 mics we put on the drums (bass, snare/hat, overhead left, overhead right) with the bass (mic'd), guitar (mic'd), and keyboard (direct), and recorded all of the instruments to a stereo track on the tascam (track 1 pan hard left, track 2 pan hard right). then we recorded the vocals on the remaining 2 tracks.

In the mean time, you could do the following:
record the drums to track 1
record the bass to track 2
mix the drums and bass together to track 4
now record the guitar to track 3
record the keyboard to track 2
record your vocals on track 1

when you mix the songs you can try this:
keep track 4 (drum & bass) panned center.
keep track 1 (vocals) panned center.
pan track 3 to the right (as much as you like)
pan track 2 to the left (the opposite of track 3)

*i don't recommend stealing from your school, even if it is a private school (which ours was) where the headmaster paddles the shit out of you for every 3 demerits you get... turns out the little bald headed nazi was screwing one of the teachers, and was dismissed the year after i graduated
 
thank u

hey thanks for all the help, might have some more questions once we get the multi.
 
Cool thread!!!!!!
Got a soft spot for people starting like that!
I started seriously when I just turned 15. I was really lucky with equipment, as transistor radios had just been invented. Everyone had those huge old tube radios in their houses - and people were replacing them with small (horrible sounding) transistors.
My friend and I were busy collecting these old things, until we had 24 good ones. Then we removed the 'inners' - just left the amps and speakers, and build a couple of pre's. The sound was beautiful - loud - perfect, and it looked COOL!!
Our bands first recording was done in a basement at our school, we build cubicles around the drums and guitar amps with stands and blankets, in a circle, singer in the middle. Also in the middle were 2 old Shure mics, through a Shure mini mixer, into a Revox 2 track reel-to-reel. We recorded 4 hours of music on Saturday morning. Cut the tape and glued the 3 best pieces together to make 14 minutes of music. Our guitar player "took of school" Monday morning and went in town to hand the tape to an ex pupil who worked for the record company. 3 months later our first single was in the shops.
Keep going!!!!!!! Just experiment, don't give up, take your time, try and try again ;)
 
cool

thanks... especially to crosstudio.

but what are the advantages and/or disadvantages to micing the guitars over plugging em in direct?

and same thing... what are the advantages and/or disadvantages to recording in layers or as a group?
 
Can't help with micing, but in terms of recording live vs. in parts:
The advantages of recording live are thus:
1. You get the energy of a live performance, everyone feeding off of each other.
2. It's more comfortable, since it's how you practice and perform.
3. It's faster and A LOT less complicated (I cannot emphasize this enough).
4. In my opinion, it sounds cooler.
The only disadvantage is bleed from one track to another, which means that if you don't get all the levels right at the beginning, it's really hard to fix it later.
The advantage of recording part by part then, is that each instrument is relatively unemcumbered by bleed through noise from other tracks. The disadvantages are that it sounds more stiff, it can be a lot more nerveracking since typically everyone else in the band is just sitting around watching you do your part, and (here's the big one:) it's ALWAYS a lot harder and more complicated than you think it will be.
If you were going to record part by part, you would do it by having either just the drummer or the drummer and bassist or guitarist (depending on whether you can record one or two tracks at a time) record their part(s) first, then adding the rest.
So my recommendation is unless your drummer is VERY VERY good and is able to play his parts without everyone else playing, and everyone knows their parts by heart perfectly, that you record live. Believe me, I know. The best way is to record the music first, then go back and add the vocals after. I'm sure lots of people will back me up here.
 
I don't think it's quite so cut and dry -- it depends totally on the musicians, the producer, the engineering environment, and of course the nature of the song -- not to mention the desired result for the end product -- sometimes clean and precise is what's called for, other times live-off-the-floor is the way to go........

Bruce
 
but what are the advantages and/or disadvantages to micing the guitars over plugging em in direct?
Click to expand...

The speakers in your cab are part of your guitar sound. They are different from PA speakers. They do not reproduce the entire sound spectrum. Instead they cut off some of highs. As a result, the sound will not be as harsh. If you run direct, you will have to use some sort of box to try and emulate this effect, or the sound will be overly piercing.

This is included as a feature on some effects units. It is commonly referred to as cabinet emulation. It is really a hight-cut (low-pass) filter that attenuates the high end. Some of these sound OK, but you're almost always better off with a Shure SM57 directly in front of one of the speakers.

You can buy one online for less than $100, borrow one from a friend in another band, or order from a catalog (most have return policies with a restocking fee). I'm not suggesting you take advantage of one of the catalog companies, but hey... I was young and broke once too :-)
 
xtremedb said:
The speakers in your cab are part of your guitar sound. They are different from PA speakers. They do not reproduce the entire sound spectrum. Instead they cut off some of highs.
Click to expand...

Almost more importantly, your speaker cabinet and power amplifier are an integral part of your tone. Bypassing these sections can remove desireable characteristics of the tone. These include, for example, even order harmonics generated by overdriving a tube power amp section, reactance and resonance of the speakers and speaker cabinet, and interaction between the sound output from the speaker and the strings, wood, and pickups of the guitar.

Some emulators/modelers are more complex than just a low pass filter and try to actually model how the amp and speaker cabinet react to your playing.



Matt
 
Some emulators/modelers are more complex than just a low pass filter and try to actually model how the amp and speaker cabinet react to your playing.
Click to expand...

Good point... actually, almost every device on the market attempts to reproduce the overtone series and tonal characteristics of more desirable amplifiers... with varying degrees of success.

The only point I was trying to make is that the tone will be harsh and nasal if you don't use some sort of speaker emulation when using a direct line.

Brad
 
one more

ok, this maybe be gettin annoying, but how far from the amp should the mic go?
 
Distance 2 - 10cm (centered on speaker cone) for huge distorted
sound, 50-70cm ( off center ) for mellow jazz.
 
Start right in the center on the grill and use your ear. If you are using a dynamic mic like a SM57, you will notice an increase in low frequency response as you get closer to the speaker. This is referred to as proximity effect.

Move the mic forward and back to work this effect in your favor (if you're using a dynamic mic). Also try moving the mic left to right. The closer to the center of the cone, the brighter the tone will be.

Also try getting the amp off the ground to minimize reflections from the floor. Depending on the distance of the mic from the speaker, you could actually calculate the angle of the floor reflection to determine the effect on phasing... it's a lot easier to just use your ears :-)

Hope that helps

Brad Gallagher
http://www.just-for-musicians.com/
 
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