Help a newbie make a decent recording please

  • Thread starter Thread starter CrazyMonkey
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CrazyMonkey

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Here is a fine example of just how ignorant the average layperson is:

I have been asked by my uncle to make a recording of his band to make some homemade CDs. (Apparantly I'm qualified to do this since I know how to record from cassette tapes or vinyl to my computer, clean out hissing and noises, and make CDs. That qualifies me as a real expert, right?) The problem is that they are playing somewhere every weekend, and don't have time to devote just to recording -- they need me to record while they are playing a gig in front of an audience. I said I'd give it a whirl, and headed off to one of their gigs where I just took output straight from their main mixer into the line-in port on my laptop and recorded with CoolEdit. The results weren't what I'd hoped for: the vocals were too loud, the bass and keyboard were too quiet, and the reverb effects, which sounded good through the speakers for their live audience, sounded awful on the recording. I can't adjust the levels of the individual channels or the amount of effects being applied without affecting their live performance, so I'm trying to figure out what to do next.

I've spent most of today reading audio-recording-related websites, and kind of have an idea what some of my options are, but I figure it's best to ask the experts. So, experts, what would you do if you were me?

I'd like to do this inexpensively, although I would be willing to spend some money. In fact, I have been asked to do this before, so if I had to spend a good chunk of money, I could probably do recordings for a couple different bands and the sell the equipment later without coming out too bad, not to mention I'm a big nerd and I like to play with toys. :) So, please give me your inexpensive solutions, but if the only real way to get a decent recording is to lay out some money for some equipment, let me know how I should go about it, and I'll at least consider it.

Thanks for your advice and patience with a total newbie.

P.S. -- if you're ever around Southwest Michigan, check out my uncle's band Screamin' Bob. http://www.screamingbob-borderlyne.com
 
Yo Monkey of Mixed Grey Matter:

Well, brotha, you have a large job and much work to do. You do need to use the search button and you do need to read, and practice, practice, and more practice.

You are undertaking a recording job, live gig, outside the studio, and you have a tough job.

I'm not familiar with your gear but you may need to consult another forum on how to use the program you mentioned in your post.

If monkeys came down from the trees, you can acomplish your goal but you will need to work at it.

Green Hornet
:D :p :p :p :cool: :cool:
 
The best way to record a live show is with mics mixed with the direct mixer signal. Since the sound is usually mixed to sound best out on the dance floor that is where you will get the best recording.

If they really want a good clean recording then tell them to forget about recording it live without some expensive rental gear.
 
If your laptop has Firewire capability, you could get something like the MOTU 828, or better their 896. This would give you 8 channels of simultaneous recording to your laptop, which would also require a pretty good chunk of hard drive space. Figure on 5 MB per track per minute at normal sampling rates, so one 4 minute song with 8 tracks would take 4 x 8 x 5 or 160 MB. If you record at 24 bit, that would increase to 240 MB but would ease the need to ride levels as much to avoid clipping (and you DO want to avoid clipping...)

You would then plug the 8 most important channels on their board from the direct outs into your 8 channel interface, and record that. You might want to consider recording the main buss out and 6 other channels that are always low in this situation, like keys, etc, as you discovered. If you can get the signals BEFORE they get reverb added, you will still have some of that reverb in your recording due to mic pickup but it will be a lot less.

Once you have the most important 8 channels recorded (there will be bleed-over, so there will be some of everything recorded) you can then mix them and add effects, etc, in CoolEdit until it sounds balanced and everybody likes it. (Or doesn't hate it, at least)

Firewire interfaces are not cheap, the MOTU ones are about $1000. Most of the affordable multi-channel interfaces are set up for PCI card slots, which makes them impractical for a laptop unless you have a docking station for your particular laptop that has a couple of PCI slots in it.

USB interfaces right now are still USB1.1, which doesn't have the bandwidth to record more than two channels at a time.

RME makes a unit called the Multiface, which can be plugged into their interface cards. they offer both a PCI interface and a PCMCIA (cardbus) interface - their stuff is more PC friendly than MOTU, so if your laptop is a PC that might be a better choice. The Multiface offers 8 analog and some ADAT optical connectivity. The price is still in the same range...

I hope this gives you a better idea of a couple possibilities... Steve
 
If I were you, yes I'd read and read, but I'm sure you have. I can tell your very serious about this. I'd just rent the equipment, at least at first, to see what you can do with it and if it will work well. Why go buy stuff that won't work for you?
 
Yo Flyer of Nightime:

I hope MonkeyMan can understand your talented acumen.

Nice reply.

Green Hornet:p :p :p :cool: :cool: :cool:
 
The best inexpensive way is to get a portable minidisc walkman, a pair of good cardioid mini mics and the connecting cables. Nothing gets connected to their equipment, you position yourself where the sound is good on the floor. To do the mastering/remixing (yes, it can be done, to some extent) you'd need a multitrack audio program that supports automation.
~
It wouldn't be absolute top-grade, but it would be very very close- casual listers simply can't hear the difference between minidisc and CD.
 
I agree with DougC. I once did a recording of a live performance (a musical). The band wasn't mic'ed however the singers were. What I did was take a direct feed of the vocal mic's from the mixing board then I had my trusty Rode NT3 picking up the rest. They only wanted a mono recording so it wasn't too bad. You could user something like the NT4 or NT5 to get a stereo sound.

Porter
 
And one more vote for the simple route. I have a DAT-Walkman and a battery-powered soundcraft board. I'll use that with 2-4 microphones. Sometimes I blow off the little board and just use a stereo mic. But the whole rig fits in a briefcase sized flight case.
 
I cant see micing the gig from a distant sounding good, what if the place has terrible reverb or there is a lot of background noise....definetly better off with a multy input soundcard and then take mic's micing everything individually into that...that way everything doesnt have to be recorded perfectly on the spot...you can work with individual tracks later
 
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