headphone mastering

  • Thread starter Thread starter schnoops
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I am learning to use Cakewalk Pro Audio and have set up a project studio at minimal expense. In fact, the only thing I have purchased is an EV RE20.
My first project is coming along great (after only 490 hours).
I recently installed and used a CD burner, so I could see what my mix sounded like in the car. It sounds awful! No low-mids, no lows. And the midi tracks' level is significantly lower than the audio.
I attribute this to the use of portable CD headphones in mixing (run straight out of the SB Live card).
I don't have room enough for mixing monitors, so I have no choice but to use headphones. I'm looking at AKG240DF, AT ATHM40, and Beyer DT770 pro and DT990 pro models.
Do you have any experience with these models? What advice can you give someone who, for now, has no choice but to use headphones for mixing (to stereo)?
 
You can neither mix, nor master, properly with headphones. Period. Budget or no budget, space or no space...

If you had years of professional experience under your belt, you *MIGHT* pull it off - barely - but for those new to the field (or even those somewhat initiated), forget-about-it - it just isn't going to happen.........

As I said above, you'll get more effective results with a pair of $50 cheap computer speakers than you would with $600 headphones............


Bruce
 
Bruce is right. mixing on headphones is like going into a round room and trying to piss in the corner.

God knows I understand living within a budget and not having a lot of cash on hand. If you are really running tight,check these out.I have a set of the older model of these out in my main room just to listen to stuff while I am cleaning up etc. or if the group wants to shed the headphones to listen to playback.

(link)

I saw them on the circuitcity website for 50 bucks a pair.If you have a stereo reciever or amp of about 50-80w a channel or so,or can pick one up at a pawn shop cheap enough,you are in business.They aren't studio monitors by any stretch of the imagination,but they will be a lot better than phones.Just remember,the bass end is probably hyped like most consumer speakers tend to be..................good luck...........L
 
Guys,

Wow! It sounds like you know what you are talking about. Let me ask you this:
What speakers would you recommend suspended under a wall-mounted bookshelf thirty inches from my face, in an 8' by 9' room, powered by a fifteen-year old Sansui AU-717 integrated amp (75 - 90 watts, I think).

I was going to pay about $150 for a pair of Beyer DT770 pros, so try to stay in the same ballpark, or one nearby.

rick
 
Here's a thought:

I also have a small pair of RTR speakers. These, too, are about fifteen years old (probably older, actually). And I have an ADC ten-band stereo graphic equalizer.

Could a guy use the equalizer to tune a set of cheap speakers to his room by playing scales on various instruments (generated by his audio editing program) and working out the best compromise?

rick
 
In addition to not mastering/mixing with headphones, you don't "tune" your room or monitors with EQ!!!!

Thorwing an EQ into the mix simply mucks things up more by introducing all kinds of phase anomalies as a result of EQ filtering.

Run your speakers as they are and learn how to translate mixes on them until you can afford to upgrade your monitoring systems.

It means you will have to mix, listen to your mix on other systems (car stereo, boom box, home stereo), then make mental notes of how the mix is translating to all these systems so you can compensate on your monitors.

Bruce
 
So, it's "what you hear is what you get" when you mix/master with real monitors? I'm getting tired of burning a cd, running out to the car, then to a different stereo... and thats just some of my problems ;)
 
Not really - whatever monitors you use you have to learn to translate mixes on... better monitors mean less learning but you will never get away from having to listen to your mixes on various systems.

It's an integral part of the mixing process.


Bruce
 
And don't forget that your room is also a critical part of your monitoring "system".

Rooms have a dramatic (usually detrimental) effect on the sound you hear. Even nearfields suffer from this, despite what any sales rep might tell you.

barefoot
 
I mixed my bands last recording on headphones. I didnt master it of course, because no matter where I looked, nobody was selling 30 years of experience (Joke). But anyway, the end result I got was pretty nice (for me) considering it was a home recording done by someone with little recording experience and zero experience with the equipment I was using. But even with the satisfactory results I got I wish I had used my monitors. Imagine the improvement I wouldve had. If I could suprise myself with a headphone mix, I probably wouldve blown myself away the mix I wouldve had had I used monitors. Its just that back then I didnt know the severe drawback of mixing with phones. With our next one I'll have way more knowledge (most of which was gained here). But I still cant find anyone willing to sell me experience. :confused: ;)
 
I'd love to hear your headphone mix if you could send me or post a clip!

Bruce
 
Almost all my stuff at home has been mixed with Headphones, the Sony MDR-V6 models...Ahh....These headphones are great...they have this lovely marketing all over them...Uh lets see, Dynamic Digital Studio Monitor Headphones, wide flat frequency response... Oh well. One of the biggest financial blunders of my life was not taking advantage of my friends studio blow out.. All I bought was acoustic foam and a Alesis midiverb 2, shoulda went after the monitors instead of the 1985 Ibanez proline "V" guitar. I used his lexicons for a while when I had to resort to 4 tracking after a divorce forced a liquidation...20-20 hindsight...Well, about a year ago, I decided to take things in my own hands, looking for budget multitrack recording within my small budget...Hence the MD8, its not what I want but nobody had any of the Fostex 8 track HD recorders anymore...I bought the 3630 compressor...it was cheap too :0( dual meaning statement) So in roughly a year Ive gone from 4 track analog with mono drum machine and a live rack (Rocktron NR and ART Multiverb LT, Rockman chorus) to 8 track 1/2 digi, SR-16, a PC with SF 4.5, SF XP 5.0, T-Racks, Audio Logic, Cakewalk, Cd burner, Bass guitar..and on the 31st, I should be installing a new pair of Yorkville YSM-1i's...Things I still need are a cheap condensor, 24 bit sound card with digital i/o...maybe next year.
When I worked at Momentum Recording Studio's IO became very familiar with the shortfall of headphone mixes, even my postings at NowHear Radio highlight some of those shorcomings....reverb on headphones seem inadequate, through a pair of decent home speakers its obvious there was too much verb, the bass is excessive, and the highs are painful... Maybe Bruce should go listen to my stuff at Waldo's and then point out in detail the things the headphones hid during mixdown, the mixes are quick and sloppy and unmastered. Listen the first time with headphones and then with normal speakers..to me its obvious...
Do what ya can with what you can afford, maybe I shoulda put a disclaimer when I posted them... YSM-1 are about the cheapest in price but perform very well...


Peace,
Dennis
 
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