Prism
New member
Harvey Gerst said:
...I myself have been wondering what the "603" stands for...
Maybe these numbers and letters were just pulled out of a hat by the marketing dept. at Marshall Electronics...
Isaiah
...I myself have been wondering what the "603" stands for...
Maybe these numbers and letters were just pulled out of a hat by the marketing dept. at Marshall Electronics...
Isaiah
B
blinddogblues
New member
Hey Slack, I like your playing. You and I would get along real well, playing that bluesy stuff! I preferred the first clip, I agree with Gidge, it sounded a little brighter and clearer. I will be interested to hear which clip was which mic. I will guess that clip one was the 603.
Hey Chris and Harvey, I am interested in learning more about this over the shoulder technique. I saw this earlier in one of Harvey's posts, but I am not sure how much detail there was. Over the shoulder, is that right next to the ear, or out front a little, like right over the guitar? I know I can experiment, but I am interested in a starting place recommendation. Thanks.
Hey Chris and Harvey, I am interested in learning more about this over the shoulder technique. I saw this earlier in one of Harvey's posts, but I am not sure how much detail there was. Over the shoulder, is that right next to the ear, or out front a little, like right over the guitar? I know I can experiment, but I am interested in a starting place recommendation. Thanks.
Chris F
New member
Blinddog,
The way Harvey explained it to me, the over-the-shoulder technique works for a lot of people because it doesn't disorient players who are monitoring as they record - with this technique, the mic picks up the sound from (roughly) the same place that the players ears do, which gives that old familiar sound. Works good for guitar, terrible for bass (too much string noise).
Slack - sorry, my poor old computer and 56k modem are too slow to download the clips. I should have specified that before I started making suggestions. Maybe if I get over to the University where I teach during the year(their computers are on DSL), I'll listen to a bunch of stuff and send comments, but I don't know when that'll be.....and going there only reminds me of WORK, which I don't wanna think about just yet.
Good luck.
The way Harvey explained it to me, the over-the-shoulder technique works for a lot of people because it doesn't disorient players who are monitoring as they record - with this technique, the mic picks up the sound from (roughly) the same place that the players ears do, which gives that old familiar sound. Works good for guitar, terrible for bass (too much string noise).
Slack - sorry, my poor old computer and 56k modem are too slow to download the clips. I should have specified that before I started making suggestions. Maybe if I get over to the University where I teach during the year(their computers are on DSL), I'll listen to a bunch of stuff and send comments, but I don't know when that'll be.....and going there only reminds me of WORK, which I don't wanna think about just yet.
Good luck.
H
Harvey Gerst
New member
Here are some rough starting points:blinddogblues said:
The mic kinda skims across the top of the guitar face. The mic shown is the Audix TR-40 Calibration Omni. Very smooth and no proximity effect.
K
Kelly Dueck
New member
Harvey's technique really works.
Everyone,
Harvey knows what he's talking about. This method really works. It'll give you a very natural open tone -- a tone you can then work with any way you want. You shouldn't have to touch the EQ at all if you're using any sort of half-way decent small diaphragm condenser mic . . . and we all know an example of one of those, now don't we
.
Thanks for the gifs, Harvey.
Kelly Dueck
P.S. Harvey, In your experience is it possible to get a really good acoustic guitar sound with just one mic? Or does it all depend on the context and "what you're after at the time?"
Everyone,
Harvey knows what he's talking about. This method really works. It'll give you a very natural open tone -- a tone you can then work with any way you want. You shouldn't have to touch the EQ at all if you're using any sort of half-way decent small diaphragm condenser mic . . . and we all know an example of one of those, now don't we
.Thanks for the gifs, Harvey.
Kelly Dueck
P.S. Harvey, In your experience is it possible to get a really good acoustic guitar sound with just one mic? Or does it all depend on the context and "what you're after at the time?"
B
blinddogblues
New member
In the pictures, there is only one mic. I assume you could record in stereo and the other mic would simply be over the opposite shoulder? I am going to give this a try tonight with my 012's or 603's and see how it sounds. Thanks Harvey...
Slackmaster2K
Gone
blinddog:
I also think the first clip is better. It's the V67...the loud foot stomping kind of gave it away, since I wasn't using the shock mount.
I've been playing around a bit more this morning, and the 603 sounds pretty decent on acoustic guitar, but not real pretty or anything...at least not yet.
The V67 sounds better...which begs the question: do I buy a pair of 603's just because they're cheap and sound decent? I'm not sure that a pair of any other mics this good sounding can be had for a grand total of $130. If I hold off, I could regret it....but if I buy them now, I might not use them.
Slackmaster 2000
I also think the first clip is better. It's the V67...the loud foot stomping kind of gave it away, since I wasn't using the shock mount.
I've been playing around a bit more this morning, and the 603 sounds pretty decent on acoustic guitar, but not real pretty or anything...at least not yet.
The V67 sounds better...which begs the question: do I buy a pair of 603's just because they're cheap and sound decent? I'm not sure that a pair of any other mics this good sounding can be had for a grand total of $130. If I hold off, I could regret it....but if I buy them now, I might not use them.
Slackmaster 2000
Gidge
Lapdance Test Dummy
If you can pull that good of a sound out of the v67, why bother with the 603's....if you would be using them for more applications (they rock for drum overheads) I could see getting them....but being almost as much a cheapskate as me, I would pass on them.....
B
blinddogblues
New member
I think once you get the positioning down, the 603's will be better for micing acoustic guitar than the V-67. As I recall, you said the guitar you were micing was a cheapie. Normally you would expect to get a better acoustic sound out of a small condensor than a large, but if your guitar doesn't sound too hot anyway, the V-67 may be more flattering. For me, I have always liked the sound I got from a small condensor better, but I have a very nice Larrivvee guitar that sounds great and the increased accuracy of the small condensors works great on it. If you already have one 603, I would go ahead and buy another one for the stereo option.
Slackmaster2K
Gone
Yeah I dunno...I showed the clips to Ed and he said the 603 sounded more controlled, but agreed that the V67 sound was better. Now we've all been told that a small diaphram is better for recording acoustic guitars, but if everything about the V67 is sounding better to me than the 603...and I'm not going to use the 603 just because of a textbook.
Blinddog may be right, and the V67 might just be flattering my cheap guitar. I'm going to restring the Beastmaster 2000 tonight (this big ass 12 string that I made into a 7 string) and see what it sounds like.
I'm a cheapass like Gidge, but that's why I'm having such a dilema. If I get a good sound out of the V67, do I buy a pair of 603's just because I'll never find a good pair at this price ever again? When we head west later this summer (oh please oh please) and I'm in a position to record drums, I hope I don't kick myself when I'm shopping for overheads and find that the 603's doubled or tripled in price.....
Oh, I tried the mic out front last night and got similar results. The sound is just kinda shallow.
Slackmaster 2000
Blinddog may be right, and the V67 might just be flattering my cheap guitar. I'm going to restring the Beastmaster 2000 tonight (this big ass 12 string that I made into a 7 string) and see what it sounds like.
I'm a cheapass like Gidge, but that's why I'm having such a dilema. If I get a good sound out of the V67, do I buy a pair of 603's just because I'll never find a good pair at this price ever again? When we head west later this summer (oh please oh please) and I'm in a position to record drums, I hope I don't kick myself when I'm shopping for overheads and find that the 603's doubled or tripled in price.....
Oh, I tried the mic out front last night and got similar results. The sound is just kinda shallow.
Slackmaster 2000
Slackmaster2K
Gone
Dangit...listening again with little headphones at work, the third clip (603) sounds best, though kind of dull... the V67 clip sounds more natural, but it's too "live" sounding. Hmmm.... Hmmm.......
Slackmaster 2000
Slackmaster 2000
H
Harvey Gerst
New member
Slack, I think your room acoustics/recording techniques are having a bigger effect on the sound you're getting than you realize.
In the end, you will hafta make the final decision about what you want to spend your money on, but it should be a very informed decision, based on really careful listening to some subtle things that don't show up immediately, like differences in level (louder sounds better at first) or boosted high end (brighter sounds more detailed at first listening).
Plus different sound sources will sound very different on different mics. What happens if you hafta record a flute, or a harmonica, or a fiddle? Thay's why I said you should try the 603 for several weeks before you decide. If you're not familiar with the subtle differences a mic can make, you need some time to learn how to hear better.
Having two identical mics is a good thing if you're recording a sound in stereo, and having a dedicated mic for vocals is also a good thing. For most people just starting out, getting two Marshall 603s and a V67G makes a great, low-cost "starter pack" for new recordists. It provides you with a lot of options that other combinations wouldn't offer in this price range. YMMV.
In the end, you will hafta make the final decision about what you want to spend your money on, but it should be a very informed decision, based on really careful listening to some subtle things that don't show up immediately, like differences in level (louder sounds better at first) or boosted high end (brighter sounds more detailed at first listening).
Plus different sound sources will sound very different on different mics. What happens if you hafta record a flute, or a harmonica, or a fiddle? Thay's why I said you should try the 603 for several weeks before you decide. If you're not familiar with the subtle differences a mic can make, you need some time to learn how to hear better.
Having two identical mics is a good thing if you're recording a sound in stereo, and having a dedicated mic for vocals is also a good thing. For most people just starting out, getting two Marshall 603s and a V67G makes a great, low-cost "starter pack" for new recordists. It provides you with a lot of options that other combinations wouldn't offer in this price range. YMMV.
Slackmaster2K
Gone
Harvey,
I agree with everything you've said, and I will certainly own up to my own inexperience. Basically all I've got to work with here are my own ears and my own equipment, so any conclusions I come to are going to be based upon that alone. I hope anyone reading doesn't assume that my comments will apply directly to their varied situations.
This 603 is a very impressive little microphone in my opinion. It hasn't been as detailed as I had hoped for the specific application I was wanting to use it for, but it does seem to be very consistant and accurate in terms of recording my guitar. It's kind of funny...I showed Ed these clips (his tips helped me get the sound on the second 603 clip), and he said something like "it doesn't sound too bad and might work in rock, but doesn't sound very realistic at all." I had to laugh because it's really not fair that I'm using such a junky sounding guitar...*THE GUITAR* sounds fake. I'll stop being so lazy and restring the beastmaster and see how it sounds.
You make a good point about versitality and I understand that there is no end all microphone. For the price I would feel stupid if I didn't pick up a pair of these 603's. It would make me feel better if I could use them immediately however. Right now I'm not sure...I'll have to play more. I'm going to use whichever microphone sounds best for a particular instrument in my environment. If I get a better guitar sound from the V67, then I'll use it. Right now it's sort of up in the air. I like the roundness and sublty of the V67 on guitar, but at the same time it's not nearly as consistant dynamically or tonally as the 603.
Thanks again Harvey,
Slackmaster 2000
I agree with everything you've said, and I will certainly own up to my own inexperience. Basically all I've got to work with here are my own ears and my own equipment, so any conclusions I come to are going to be based upon that alone. I hope anyone reading doesn't assume that my comments will apply directly to their varied situations.
This 603 is a very impressive little microphone in my opinion. It hasn't been as detailed as I had hoped for the specific application I was wanting to use it for, but it does seem to be very consistant and accurate in terms of recording my guitar. It's kind of funny...I showed Ed these clips (his tips helped me get the sound on the second 603 clip), and he said something like "it doesn't sound too bad and might work in rock, but doesn't sound very realistic at all." I had to laugh because it's really not fair that I'm using such a junky sounding guitar...*THE GUITAR* sounds fake. I'll stop being so lazy and restring the beastmaster and see how it sounds.
You make a good point about versitality and I understand that there is no end all microphone. For the price I would feel stupid if I didn't pick up a pair of these 603's. It would make me feel better if I could use them immediately however. Right now I'm not sure...I'll have to play more. I'm going to use whichever microphone sounds best for a particular instrument in my environment. If I get a better guitar sound from the V67, then I'll use it. Right now it's sort of up in the air. I like the roundness and sublty of the V67 on guitar, but at the same time it's not nearly as consistant dynamically or tonally as the 603.
Thanks again Harvey,
Slackmaster 2000
Dolemite
New member
Well, if the V67 can cover for your crap micing techniques then stick with it!
I have taken the time to play around with the 603 (now I know why they call you Slackmaster, hehe ) and I think its a damn good mic for a lot of things, but then again, I haven't had the chance to use a V67 so I may not know what I'm missing. In any case I'm sure they're both great but suited to different things. I have been trying to use a 603 as a vocal mic due to my diminutive mic budget. Its very true that its easy to bottom out but with careful enough placement and even more careful mic technique (and a pop filter) I've gotten some decent sound out of it.
I have taken the time to play around with the 603 (now I know why they call you Slackmaster, hehe
) and I think its a damn good mic for a lot of things, but then again, I haven't had the chance to use a V67 so I may not know what I'm missing. In any case I'm sure they're both great but suited to different things. I have been trying to use a 603 as a vocal mic due to my diminutive mic budget. Its very true that its easy to bottom out but with careful enough placement and even more careful mic technique (and a pop filter) I've gotten some decent sound out of it.
Slackmaster2K
Gone
Dolemite: I haven't made any final judgements here...I'm just spouting the things that I am doing, and the results that I'm getting.
To anyone following this thread, the 603S is $75 at abemusic.com , not $65 as previously mentioned.
Slackmaster 2000
To anyone following this thread, the 603S is $75 at abemusic.com , not $65 as previously mentioned.
Slackmaster 2000
Dolemite
New member
Slackmaster2K said:
Yeah, I know man, I'm just kidding around, yo. I find it pretty interesting to hear your impressions of the mic, especially in comparison to the V67 since I have been eyeing that one for a while. I would also be interested to see what you can do with the 603 on vocals (if you've got the time and Harvey's got the patience) and how you feel about that versus the V67 for that application. But since you've already got a better vocal mic, it probably won't be much of a comparison...
H
Harvey Gerst
New member
Abe's Music has been selling pairs of 603s on ebay for $124 ($62 each). They have also been going as singles for around $60 each (with one going for an absurd $36). Right now, there are several showing on ebay with a very low starting price of around $25 each (I'm even bidding on those, but my bids are easy to beat).
B
blinddogblues
New member
Getting them at Abe's for $65 is as easy as calling them and placing the order. I bought mine just one week ago for $65 each plus shipping.