Getting rid of nasty HIGH END

  • Thread starter Thread starter Chris Jahn
  • Start date Start date
C

Chris Jahn

New member
I seem to have trouble getting rid of that "grindy" or "harsh" sounds in my mixes, i assumed that it came from either the guitars ( i been using some really high gain guitars) or from the drum overheads. but i cant seem to isolate it.

is this a common problem, were does it usually come from, what can be done about it, and is it somthing that can be left alone untill mastering?
 
nasty high end

everything sounds ok, the guitars are not to "grindy" and the symbols are ok also. ive gated the toms and the kick to reduce bleed, ive EQ'd and filtered the hats out of the snare etc... so its got to be a combo of the two i would assume.

mabye the sybols could be a little duller, but when ive dulled them out to try to solve the problem they are TO dull, i lose the crispness, mabye im mistaking "crisp" for treble?
 
Are you boosting higher frequencies to get "definition". I record bands sometimes that have a little DAW experience and sometimes they'll ask to get on the controls. 9 times out of 10 I catch them boosting all over the place and doing very little cutting which in my experience is not the best way to get where you want to be. Can you give more details about your techniques, or maybe post a clip?
 
boosting and cuting

Im really trying to learn to cut before i boost, an ive had good resualts.

I guess im just wondering if im way of base, would you assume that its coming from one of the two places i think it might be?

Im not in my studio so i cant send an example right now, and that would lead me to a second question since i have your attention.

I cannot for the life of me create ANY kind of file, or dump to any format that give me a decent un-mastered version to listen to in the car or whatever.

Dithering, no dithering, aac,mp3, it all sounds like crap. I realize there is a lot of loss when you do this, but is there a trick to getting the most out of it, just for somthing to listen to in the mean time that is an aproximation of the mix straight off my set up before you stuff is mastered? i use logic on a mac if that helps your answer
 
mics

im using a midrange set of audix drum mics, seven mic pre pack, not supper low end not supper fancy either, and i use an sm57 under the snare.

i use sm57s on the guitars and or these audix (forget what they are called) mics that are very very simalar to an sm58, some say better but who cares, ive tried experimenting with my vocal mic on the guitars, its a mxl 9000 tube.

it sounds nice, but im affraid to get it to close and blow it!! its definettly the best sound (warmest) for the guitars but lke i said, im not rich and i dont want to destroy it.
 
Chris Jahn said:
Im really trying to learn to cut before i boost, an ive had good resualts.

I guess im just wondering if im way of base, would you assume that its coming from one of the two places i think it might be?

Im not in my studio so i cant send an example right now, and that would lead me to a second question since i have your attention.

I cannot for the life of me create ANY kind of file, or dump to any format that give me a decent un-mastered version to listen to in the car or whatever.

Dithering, no dithering, aac,mp3, it all sounds like crap. I realize there is a lot of loss when you do this, but is there a trick to getting the most out of it, just for somthing to listen to in the mean time that is an aproximation of the mix straight off my set up before you stuff is mastered? i use logic on a mac if that helps your answer
Click to expand...

So in the studio you're ok with it but on other sources you aren't? If that's the case then your monitors aren't translating well, which will lead to the "what the fuck?" reaction when you get in the car. What are you using for monitors?
 
Are your mix levels hot?

I have a pair of transformers I keep on hand just in case I need to 'slow down' the transient response of digital signals - you might try something like that...
 
How hard do you hit the mic pres when recording? Maybe you're overdriving them? In which case it could just be an accumulating effect. Tracks sound fine in isolation, but the combined distortion makes itself obvious?
 
I struggled with this for a while. In my limited experience, I think the key to good mixes (especially ITB) is getting the rights mics in the right place so you can only touch the EQ when you absolutely have to. Most plug ins do more harm than good IMHO, and the good plugs are easy to over-do. To me, it seems that almost every plug sucks a little dimension from the sound.

Try going really basic - use as few mics as possible. All the gating and EQ-ing this out of that, etc. could be making it harder to really hear what's happening. A pair of overheads can be all you need. Most folks would also mic the snare and bass drum, but most of your problems will go away with overheads that are in phase, placed where they get the whole kit, in a decent room, with a decent player, with a properly-tuned, decent instrument.

If any of those elements are missing, more mics will only get in the way by adding phase problems, bleed, unwanted frequency buildups, (and the need for "corrective" Eq & gating), etc., etc., etc.

As for guitars, and anything else - Really listen to the instrument in the room. Your recording may just be perfect - it might be the instrument that sounds bad.

If all else fails, the only plug I could not live without for cutting certain frequencies and balancing a mix without sucking the life out of the sound is Voxengo's Soniformer. Looks like a multi-band comp, but functions more like a dynamic EQ.

:)
 
I was going to ask if your tracking levels are too hot... Harsh high end and a general loss of "focus" are pretty common when tracking too hot.

And if you track too hot, there's really no fix for that...

And of course, by "too hot" I don't mean clipping digitally - I mean overdriving the analog chain (which happens LONG before digital clipping in most cases).
 
If you are recording digitally, you can get harshness from cheap converters as well. What converters are you using?

One thing I've tried and it does work, is to use a single ended noise reduction unit like what DBX had out. I haven't used a Dolby for this, but it should work too. The frequency of the harshness is right around where the frequency of hiss used to be (and still is!). Dialing in just a little noise reduction will soften that area and go a long way toward making the recording sound less harsh.

Another unit that does this pretty well is the Empirical Labs FATSO. It has a feature called "warmth" which is kind of a dynamic filter that softens out the harshness in digital recording. Very similar to noise reduction units except that the FATSO responds to the material and brings the filter in and out.

Noise reduction units are dirt cheap these days, since everyone dropped them following the demise of tape. It might be worth it to pick up an inexpensive unit like a DBX 150 and see if it helps.
 
Chris Jahn said:
im using a midrange set of audix drum mics, seven mic pre pack, not supper low end not supper fancy either, and i use an sm57 under the snare.

i use sm57s on the guitars and or these audix (forget what they are called) mics that are very very simalar to an sm58, some say better but who cares, ive tried experimenting with my vocal mic on the guitars, its a mxl 9000 tube.

it sounds nice, but im affraid to get it to close and blow it!! its definettly the best sound (warmest) for the guitars but lke i said, im not rich and i dont want to destroy it.
Click to expand...


Alright. :D So now what are you using for overheads, and where do you have it (them) positioned?

.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top