Gain Structure Thread

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7string

7string

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Ok, Mr. Hamilton! I'm opening the door! I'd love to read whatever you have to offer.
 
Well he offered to take it up in a new thread so as not to hijack the other. I was just trying to make it easier for him and I, for one, would love to hear what he has to say.
 
Well,
Beyond the "level setting" stuff as covered in that very good sound on sound article, proper gain structure is one of the [million] variables on your way to really great sounding mixes, instead of just okay mixes.

These comments are specific to mixing on a console.

I would suggest REALLY listening to the tone of something like a kick drum, as you turn it up in relation to the bass guitar. REALLY listen. Listen for what pokes out first, rather than listening for an overall gain change.... Now listen to the kick with a compressor on it. ANY compressor. Set the compressor super "wrong" in your opinion. Turn the kick up and down in relation to the bass...Lighten up on the comp a little.... repeat. REALLY, really, really listen to what happens. DONT eq (yet, if at all). I am always amazed by compression, and its ability to let me turn the kick up, because I want more beater attack, but I dont want EQ-y sounding metal beater in this case... SO: set the attack time of the comp you are using on the kik late enough that it misses the beater all together. Completely misses the party happening at the leading edge of the transient, the reacts VERY strongly to the rest of the wave. Amazing. All of a sudden it sounds like you EQ'd on a ton of beater! That is part of gain structure. Get the thwack/boom ratio level'd out to your liking, then bring it up against the bass guitar....

I could go on like this for a long time, but I am tired... I will post more about this if anyone wants to read my ramblings....

Gain structure isnt just important: it is everything you do. It is EVERY SINGLE amplification of attenuation you happen to be involved in, which if you are the engineer: is all of them!
 
I, for one, will listen to anything you have to say! Please, more!!!!
 
7string said:
I, for one, will listen to anything you have to say! Please, more!!!!

Any specific questions to give this thread some focus? I enjoy talking about this stuff, but there are so many facets to the story... I will be glad to answer anything I can...
 
let's take a typical rock setup, two guitars (rhythm&lead), a bass, and a drum kit... how would one set it up to get the most potential volume/gain out of it when tracking... without causing clipping or digital distortion... because I find that once I have everything recorded, I have to turn the whole mix down about 6db or so and then compress/limit the whole song to get anywhere NEAR the volume of commercial records and I don't even want them that loud, but I would like it louder and clearer
 
dcwave said:
I would think that a discussion on gain structure would start with the signal chain being calibrated correctly. dBu, VU, dbFS etc...

I would check out this thread...

http://recforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/m/50382/0

The concept I am talking about is not calibration. Lets assume everything is cal'd and setup properly.

Gain staging is not simply about levels: it is all about WHEN to amplify and when to attenuate for the best possible sound without eq. I am making many assumptions leading to this discussion, rather than starting at calibration and working my way up through finer points in mixing.
 
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