follow the bouncing ball

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terrible_buddhi

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When you guys have your tracks recorded, and the go to mix everything together...do you bounce the drum track? I want to make 'room' for the kick as it seems the bass is 'eating' it, but won't I be picking up the same frequencies from the overheads as the kick mic? Should I be doing any cuts on any of the drum mics...low cut on the snare/ overhead...hi cut on the kick? etc.

this is the track in question...there are some flaws in the performance that will be fixed very soon with some punches.



Thanks!
 
try a roll off on the bass starting at about 80hz

then try a roll off on guitar starting at 100hz, maybe 150hz

try putting a roll off on the toms and snare at 100 hz

and try a roll off at 100hz or 200hz on the overheads.

don't scoop it, roll it off.
 
A lot of times, the kick gets lost because there's not enough beater click.

I would suspect that's your problem.
 
terrible_buddhi said:
what is the difference between roll & scoop?
Click to expand...

Rolling off is gradually cutting everything above or below a certain frequency( in this case below).Scooping is just cutting the said frequency.
 
so is it a full cut? or like 3db? sorry to keep asking so many questions, I just really want to get this right
 
posted up a new one with your suggestions...what do you think?

 
ok......by bass i meant bass guitar....i don't know if that's what u did the roll off on or if you have even figured out what a roll off is.....just don't roll anything off the b-drum

i meant like going from 30 hz at the lowest volume on ur eq and then go progressively up.........like stairs.......until u get to the 100hz, 150, 200 hz mark......then u should be at zero.

also, chess was correct when he said u probably need to add some click......

it sounds like u may have added some low end in the b-drum.........try putting the added lows back to zero and do a mid scoop at around 500hz..........use a moderate bandwidth....... and you can take it all the way down to -12db or -18db if you want

you should have to turn the bass drum up. it should appear to have more low end once u turn it up.........

and like chess said......u may beed some click a.k.a attack..........that'll be around 3khz through 9khz..........but i personally like to raise 4 or 5khz

try adding all the way up to like 6db at 4 or 5khz
 
donkeystyle said:
try adding all the way up to like 6db at 4 or 5khz
Click to expand...

At least.

This is really more of a tracking issue than anything. More like a drum tuning/tightenting issue. It can also be a beater issue. The click needs to be there when you track, and you need to point the mic at it in such a way as to capture it.

As a rescue job, you might consider making a copy of your kick track, and cut everything off below 2 khz (on the copy). Cut off as in no gradual rolloff --- more like a steep cliff kind of thing. Then mix that track in with the original. It might be a little safer than all the boosting you might otherwise do.
 
This is trully interesting stuff! the bass was eating the kick, the guitar was smothering the snare...this is awesome! I can see where this subtractive EQ can take SO much time.

I spent some time infront of the actual mixing speakers last night, and this stuff makes a HUGE difference. But, I do have a long way to go.

Tell me if this is wrong...I solo'd the bass and kick drum...then knocked off frequencies (down to zero) starting from the lowest, until I heard the kick come through the way I wanted it to. I then went to the highest of the bass and started knocking off frequencies until it changed the sound of the bass in a way I didn't like. I boosted NO frequencies.

If this is the right thing to do, what happens when 2 instuments...say, the snare 'bite' and the meat of the guitar (just using this as an example) coincide? How can they both play nice using the same frequencies?

Thanks for your help guys! I trully 'saw the light' last night, and while it may not make my mixes 'professional' overnight, it has gone a long way to improving it already! Thanks!
 
one thing I wanted to add...I know a lot of people want more click...the fact is, its not there for a reason...my drummer is missing a foot and hits the kick drum with a rubber mallet that he attached to his nub.

as much as I want to just leave it at that, because I think its damn funny...but alas will probably be flamed for picking on the handi-cap, the real reason is the drummer doesn't want it...he wanted a sound as he described ' to sound like the bass drum from a marching band'. And hey, who is going to tell a drummer with a rubber mallet for a leg he can't have what he wants? :)
 
Blue, great article, and that chart is super usefull...it does highlight my previous question though...

Say I want a full bodied snare so I leave in 250hz.

but the 2 guitars both panned at 15 (one R one L) are also living at 250hz...won't there just be mud?
 
Keep in mind the snare isn't playing as constantly and consistantly . . . usually . . . as the guitars, so it's usually okay if they clash a little on the snare beats.

Look for other freq's to boost/cut. You might get even more snare meat by dialing in some 200 hz instead, which is fine as long as the guitar isn't hogging that up too. You might also try a little multiband compressing of the guitars at the 250 hz, or boosting them a little at 300 hz instead and see if you like that.

If they're competing, and both need 250 hz, exactly, and neither instrument can live without it and there's no other workarounds, then you need to make note of this, and next time you track, remember to tune your snare down a little. That's why it's so important to learn to listen while you track.

This is something I'd do only as a last resort, but if you have a pitchbend feature on your DAW that works worth a damn, you might even try using that to pitch the snare down a half-step. Depending on the style/genre of music, this can be a cool trick even under normal conditions. :D
 
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